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Cigarette smokers with IBD

mikeyarmo

Co-Founder
Anyone here smoke? This was brought up in the chat (which was great :D) and I was curious what the majority of people were. What does your doctor say on this issue and do you find this is more helpful or harmful for your condition?

I am a non-smoker just in case you were wondering.
 
Im a smoker. Ive been now for 5 years so longer than I have been diagnosed with Crohns. and honestly I havent noticed there being a link to smoking and making your crohns worse. Actually i find it to be soothing when i am having bad pains that having a cigarette calms my stomach. But of course my Dr HATES it and tells me everytime to stop being its going to make my crohns worse. But i think its just his way of scaring me in to quitting because most if not all dr's will rag on you if you smoke. He also perscribed me some pills to try and get me to quit and I noticed it pulled me right out of remission and had some really bad side effects I think it was wellbutrin. it really messed me up.
 
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ReeRee

Guest
At first my doc told me to stop smoking, until he sees just how nervous and how bad my anxiety problems are. Then he told me to just cut down because he was afraid if I quit alltogether, I'd kill people...lol. I probably would too.lol.

I don't notice any changes when I smoke really.
 

cookey

Mama Crohnie
Doctors have been telling me for years...Smoking is bad for Crohns, well I have news for you doctors, so is the air we breathe...case closed. We don't have any doctors in here do we? Oh well...lol.
 
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ReeRee

Guest
Smoking is bad for Crohns
That may be true, maybe not, but I'll tell you one FACT: Me quitting smoking would be bad for DOCTORS as well as the rest of society...lol.
 
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ReeRee

Guest
There are far too many idiots in my world to give up my only remaining vice..lol. Namely my ex husbands and ex boyfriends...lol.
 

Tami Lynn

Forum Angel
Okay...

PLEASE do not shoot the messenger!

I know that most of you who smoke do NOT want to hear this, but I believe it holds some truth...

IMHO smoking does make Crohn's worse (and this is coming from an ex-smoker), but it isn't always apparent at the time you're doing it b/c it actually seems to make you feel better (or at least comforted).

I totally understand how smoking can give the temporary feeling of calming the nerves and that it can be the one vice we cling to and hold dear to our hearts... so I am certainly not condemning anyone who still smokes! I think we've all dealt with vices and have our own coping mechanisms we use.

Heck, smoking was the first thing I used to do in the morning before going to the bathroom sometimes...before eating....before coffee...before WAKING UP! LOL

But for those who are interested in learning or at least reading about the medical facts check out this article from the Australian Crohn's and Colitis Association:



Ultimately it's a personal and individual decision, but it is good to have all the facts.

Don't beat me up for posting <ducking> ...I still Luv you guys! :D
 

mikeyarmo

Co-Founder
I think it is good that you at least shared that with us Tami. Like everything else though (including what we eat, what meds we try, etc.) this is a personal choice and eveyone needs to do what they feel most comfortable doing.
 

Tami Lynn

Forum Angel
Like everything else though (including what we eat, what meds we try, etc.) this is a personal choice and eveyone needs to do what they feel most comfortable doing.
I TOTALLY and WHOLE-HEARTEDLY agree Mike!!! :)

I just like to put all the cards on the table, look at all the information and research, as well as take individual opinions into account in order to allow others to make the best choice possible for them. ;)

Just call me "The Informant" j/k :cool:
 
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ReeRee

Guest
Huh? Wha...? Oh well, thanks for the facts. I'm living in denial tho...
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Seriously, It's good that you posted that. Thanks. I kinda figured it wasn't exactly good for us to smoke....duh...lol. I enjoy reading all the facts regardless of how deep in denial I am..heehee.
 
I am currently a smoker and when I have tried to quit I go into a flare. My doctor said that smoking can be worse for Crohn's patients but what is harder on your system is quitting. He said to cut back and slowly try to quit. He said to NEVER quit cold turkey or I would most likely end up in an awful flare. (I do want to quit but everything else in my life has changed because of Crohn's and I need some type of vise!!! JK!!!)

Marcia
 

Kev

Senior Member
Smoking is bad for you, whether you have IBD or not. Smoking kills, case closed. Or is it? "They" say that smoking interferes with the effectiveness of meds if you have CD.. and I won't/can't argue that point... But, if you have a form of colitis, usually more crucial if ulcerative, cause the congregated ulcerations bleed more, but it can also apply to crohns colitis, then the aspect of smoking that narrows the arteries, constricts blood flow, will cause you less blood loss. Both of my worst outbreaks occured after quiting smoking, and it was when I resumed smoking that my bleeding became manageable. Its not a good remedy (remember, smoking kills) but it is valid enuff of a concern that I have been told by 3 doctors NOT to quit, at least not without dr supervision. I plan to try this year, and plan on using nicotine replacement therapy (patch) to try to avoid a major downturn. I hate smoking, and LDN makes me hate it all the more. I would place smoking on a worse scale than say methotrexate, and I don't like metho at all. But, if you smoke, don't be surprised if quitting makes you worse.
 
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Isla

Guest
Yes after I quit it sent me into a much worse flare, but since adding the meds I am ok. I have been quit for 5 months now and even though it may have caused me more symptoms I would rather "suffer" the effects then to pick up smoking again.

I actually have a LOT less stress in my life since quitting. I have a lot more time and a lot more money :) But it was one of the hardest things I have tried to do. I had been smoking for 10, 12, 14 years something like that. I was also a heavy smoker.. smoking between 1 pack to 2 1/2 packs a day.

I miss smoking every single day, I really liked it a lot. But my aunt offered to help watch my daughter if I would quit... so I did. So twice a year she will be going to Florida for a couple weeks each time to give me a break. So yay for me!
 

butt-eze

Superstar
I'm so proud of you Isla. :ycool:
All Crohn's aside... I HATE SMOKING!!!! My parents have smoked all my life and still do. I'm pissed that I will have to watch them die from it. I'm pissed that I will have to deal with all the pain and suffering they will go through. I'm pissed that they watched me nearly die while on a ventilator and still didn't quit! I'm pissed that I've never smoked a cigarette in my life but cigarettes will still break my heart. My mom is my very best friend and it is quite inevitable that cigarettes will kill her. The kicker is that my in-laws are smokers too.
As a non-smoker: I hate having to walk through other peoples' cigarette smoke; I hate having to smell them walk into our clinic smelling like an ash tray; I hate that people hug my child when they have those toxic chemicals all over their clothes and skin.
If people want to have a habit/vice it is certainly their choice. I'm only pissed about how it affects my family. I don't say anything to my family though. What's the point???:(

And yes, I don't eat perfect. So, I do things that are perfect for me either. No one is perfect...

Sorry to vent but it is the one thing that depresses me the most.
 
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Isla

Guest
Thank you for the praise! My mother nearly died due to pneumonia that wouldn't go away because of her smoking. She quit and I STILL wouldn't quit even after seeing her in the hospital. She quit after smoking for over 30 years.

They say smoking is more addictive than heroin - I know an ex heroin user who cannot quit smoking. I believe them. Cigarettes ruled my life and invaded my thoughts every few minutes. So all of you thinking about starting DON'T.
 

butt-eze

Superstar
Pen, no need to apologize. I am just really bummed about the whole thing. But you certainly didn't pour salt in the wound. It's just one hard fact of my life. Please don't feel bad for a second.
I love my Crohn's Forum family and that's why I feel like I can share my feelings.
 
Pen, I like that no smoking with minors thing.

I suppose I'm fine with smokers doing it in their own properties as long as children aren't subjected to the poison, but when it comes to public places, I'm sorry, put it out. It's like it's been said: Having a no smoking section is like having a no peeing section in a pool. Doesn't work.

Smoking took tolls on several family members and I watched them drop years before I believe they could have.
 

soupdragon69

ele mental leprechaun
As a cardiac ITU nurse I despair (sp?) trying to get folk off ventilators. They think stopping smoking when they come in for bypass surgery is the best thing as they will get over the withdrawal symptoms easier during their hospital stay. The real problem is because they stop smoking at that time and not several weeks earlier all the C**P at the base of their lungs starts to travel upwards, impacts on their 02 and C02 exchange and we cant get them off the ruddy ventilator because they are blocking their own airway and end up with pneumonias and tracheostomies and weeks in hospital!

I am an unstable asthmatic since my late 20's and have never smoked and I hate it when others smoke around me - even outdoors.

Sorry HUGE rant over! ;-)
 
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ericajones80

Guest
I'm a non smoker who is a big fan of the ban of smoking in bars and restaurants happening in my state. Thank god
 

Kev

Senior Member
Just a couple of quick points.. Now, I'm a smoker, so I understand some of you'll want to beat me up over this. that's OK. John Stossel (sp) of ABC news did a little digging. Seems the 2nd hand smoke issue is wildly exxagerated. He went back to the fellow who started it all. A scientist who did the original studies on effects of 2nd hand smoke. It is deadly.. like smoking.. BUT according to him you have to be exposed to it 24X7 without a break or fresh air for it to have an impact. I think some of the reactions, the backlash, has gone too far. Here, they imposed rules just few years ago, all licensed establishment had to have a separate ROOM, with negative flow air exchangers, removing all smoke so it didn't enter general areas. Establishments who complied spent a small fortune.. building separate rooms, putting in smoke removers and latest of air handling technology.. literally each place spent 10's of thousands to play by the rules. What happened? People still weren't satisfied. Two years later the laws were changed again.. no smoking inside period, no matter how well the smoking rooms were separated, no matter how efficient those expensive air exchange systems worked. And, no smoking in outdoor areas, even if they were separated by more than the law allows.. here it's 15'. So, a business is not permitted to have a separate outside area just for smokers who can have a drink, sit at a table, etc.,... or the place loses its license and is heavily fined. But, I can step outside... as long as I'm 15' away from a door or air vent, and smoke as a non customer. So, I can stand next to the rope, or fence, that is separating the non smoking clientele on the outdoor patio, and smoke at will. It is ludicrous. And the effect on the businesses. clientele down by 30%, means a loss of revenue, employees are laid off, or shifts cut back, less in tips & wages and the impact on all of these businesses lossing 30% of their business has a huge trickle down effect... they earn less, they sell less, they buy less.. It all adds up. And for what? Over-reaction, knee jerk, chicken little legislation. I am sorry.. but most people who don't smoke have been sold a bill of goods. I don't think they realize the effect they are having.. I agree with the no minors in cars thing.. but one town tried to ban smoking anywhere within their limits. someone realized the potential danger.. turning their flourishing town into a modern day 'ghost' town.. and stopped it before it went too far. gimme a break
 
This is my first post, been a member for about a year but just been lurking reading posts and trying to figure out this "sh|tty" disease (like none of us has heard that one before!). Okay, not going to weigh in on the "no smoking anywhere" laws, but I will say this. I have been diagnosed with CD just about a year (figure I have had it since I was 19 or so) and have been a non-smoker for almost 4 months on the advice of my gut guy. I love smoking, I mean, if there are still ciggy's around when I am 70 I will start again (seriously), but the doc said it may help put me into remission so I quit. had tried evry way to quit in the past and nothin had worked (cold turkey, patch, gum, Zyban, herbal, etc) This time I tried a new drug called Champix and let me tell you - this is the only thing that would have made it possible!! Every other time I would become Mr.Hyde around everyone and be totally stressed out (one of my biggest triggers). On this drug I was calm, I mean one day I looked into my pack and noticed I only had one left, I smoked it and haven't had another since. I would still like to have a smoke, I probably always will, but it is not life or death to have one anymore. I am not trying to sell the drug or anything, I just thought I would suggest it as it woked so well for me. As with any one of the drugs we all take, this one does have side effects (mine was nausea - lust a bit more than usual - hee hee) so make sure to research it before taking it!! Any-hoo, hope this helps someone and thnkas to everyone on here - your posts have been a god send for me fo the past year.

Chris
 

Kev

Senior Member
Before I get too beat up, I wasn't advocating smoking.. just that some folks tend to forget (or deliberately overlook) that smokers are people too. And I'm not on a 'smokers have rights' kick here. Most smokers, like myself, don't want to smoke. I am going into a stop smoking program (not the best timing, with everything else that's going on right now) next week... hope to be off, or weaning off, in a month. (unless my GI vetoes it, in my case, it might just make my health worse, IBD wise.. And, that is legitimate, and a very real concern).

Like, folks, there was a time when alcohol was considered the work of the devil, and prohibition came about... which led to the blooming of organized crime. I think its insane that an establishment CAN'T legally be a 'smokers only' affair. I know WHY they won't allow it... they'd drive all the non smoking places out of business or seriously hurt them. I know/knew a lot of folks in the bar/tavern business. I would go into one of these places (pre-illness) maybe 1 or 2 nights a month. It was always jammed. Now, post illness, post smoking ban, they are virtually empty. Places where it was standing room only, three rows deep at the bar, are 1/3 - 1/2 empty.. empty chairs, empty tables, 1/2 staff, closing earlier, etc..

Say you're a non smoker, working a bar, etc., where 50 - 70% of your wages comes from tips. Someone says.. Ok, lets ban smoking in bars and taverns. It sounds like a great idea, you won't have to breath in 2nd hand smoke. Stale beer, or b/o, well.. that stays with the territory. But at least no 2nd hand smoke.. Then your tips drop by 30% or more, then they cut back your hours.. or even have to reduce staff and let you go. Suddenly, it doesn't seem that its really that big a deal whether folks could smoke around the joint or not. Those are now the good old days. People behind these brilliant moves don't look or don't care about the impact. I dont' smoke any less due to the laws, I just do not go to bars or taverns.. I stay home n smoke. It isnt' decreasing the folks who do, it's just driving them underground, removing their contribution from the local tavern economy... There will still be as many people getting health issues from it. The benefits of stopping public smoking were grossly exxagerated, and the health risks of 2nd hand smoke hyped beyond reality, and the losses/costs of putting these laws in place were downplayed or underestimated. You know we have 34 police officers dedicated to patroling places for smoking. The cost of that, what these cops could do if they were deployed against real crime, makes me sick. Again, I'm not advocating smoking, just saying that the 'politically' correct folks don't know the truth, and the laws being put into place are bogus. That's all, ok?
 
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Isla

Guest
Ya I took Chantix but it made me very very ILL but I could take it long enough to help me quit smoking.

As for the smoking bans - I agree on some levels. There should be no smoking in a place that serves food EVER. It doesn't reduce revenue. But bars are another story - as a recently quit smoker I am very thankful that the bars are no longer smoking establishments and so are my non-smoking friends. They avoided going to the bar very often cause of the smell and having to go outside for air. But, it is a loss of revenue for bars. I saw at least a 20-30 % decrease in clientèle that has been a steady loss (not just after the ban.) Here there are several society clubs that are private and members only, they are the only smoking bars left in the city. In Utah they have these private clubs for smokers as a way around the ban. But I think this is a good idea - having private clubs for those that want to mingle with other smokers at a bar.

/6 cents
 

butt-eze

Superstar
Good point about the bars. They are not health clubs. I don't drink either so I would have no reason to ask a bunch of alcoholics to stop one of their other filthy addictions. Don't get offended. I'm simply thinking of my alcoholic father who also smokes. People who don't care about their health tend not to care about others health. My dad went to light up a cigarette in the car when I was 7 months pregnant! My husband immediately flipped on him. Regardless if the harm of second-hand smoke is exageratted or not. It's not for me.
Growing up I was exposed to my parents cigarette smoke constantly. In the house, in the car, in small hotel rooms...gross! So, I got ear infections ALL THE TIME!!! I was constantly on antibiotics because of this. As soon as I lived away from my parents at the age of 16 I literally have NEVER HAD ANOTHER EAR INFECTION. Cigarette smoke has been heavily linked to causing ear infections. Not fair to an innocent child.

Please don't get offended by my hatred of smoking. I don't hate smokers. My best friend and mom smoke. It doesn't make who they are. I get that it's an addiction.
 

soupdragon69

ele mental leprechaun
I have no problem with someone who chooses to smoke but it annoys the heck out of me when I have to inhale their exhalation when I choose not to smoke.

Its walking through the pall of smoke outside outpatients or outside offices where workers have no choice but to go outside.

Better support needs to be provided for those who choose to smoke so it doesnt impact on those who dont. (hope that makes sense?)

I am very glad the ban is in place in eating places as nothing is worse than having someone smoke at the table next door whilst you eat when they wouldnt do it while they were eating.

I have never had any inclination to smoke - even in teens - and have only been asthmatic since late 20's as I said before. I have seen smokers lungs during surgery and looking at what resembles blackened bubbled plastic its amazing the number of colleagues who see the same and still smoke. So yes definately an addiction. But how many of us can point the finger at a smoker and not have the other fingers pointing at our own weaknesses I would ask?
 
hello,I am also a smoker.The only thing that keeps me sane at times lol.I have been told to quit smoking too but for serveral reasons can't seem to.I have tried the Patch which didn't help me at all.Some day I will
 

My Butt Hurts

Squeals-a-lot!
I went to a symposium a few years back, and the doctors were all in agreement that smoking made Crohn's symptoms worse. They also said that smoking made one other condition's symptoms better. I can't remember whether or not it was IBD or colitis or what. People who smoked with whatever they said almost for sure would flare if they tried to quit.
As a New Yorker, I am happy with the smoking ban, especially in restaurants. I don't frequent bars that often, but I when I do go, it's nice not to sit in smoke. I would get a sore throat after just a few minutes. I don't think as many people smoke these days as they used to. Not just because I don't see them out in public, but I don't see them at private picnics, nor do many relatives, friends or coworkers smoke any more.
Is it possible that the majority of the people who were drinking at the bars are also the smokers? Overindulging in alcohol AND cigarettes? Maybe it's good that they are not out in public, then driving. Drinking in their own home may be the best for the general public. (Not trying to start a fight here, just sayin'. Maybe it's a possibility.)
 
Firstly, I mean not to offend anybody because I have strong feelings on issues like this.

I agree with much of what some have said here about non-smoking areas and the fact that we need to make sure to simultaneously preserve freedom to do what one wants, and to protect the health of others (which is also a freedom of sorts). I don't care if one wants to smoke but when they drag others into the mix from 2nd hand it's another story. Yes you could chose not to patronize a certain establishment if it's an issue, but many times that's not the issue and you don't have a choice in your environment. I feel that whether or not 24/7 exposure or just a few hours is at hand, it's toxic. Doesn't matter IMO, it's a poison, so there is no "trivial" amount of 2nd hand to me. Perhaps non-smokers don't know what it's like to feel restricted on an earned right to do what they want with their habits, but I'd have to say that smokers don't know what it's like to be bound to an effect of their environment without choice, they often don't realize how horrid the inhalation and odor is because they live with it. Bars and taverns are a little different though and I believe that perhaps they can have some slack, but in general the smoke is too ubiquitous to have it allowed in other public places, I'm sorry.

It's fine if one chooses to smoke, that doesn't matter, you have that right, but I should have the right to avoid it if I choose. It's a reason drunk driving is such a sinful no-no as far as the penal code. It's bad enough if someone wraps their car around a telephone pole, but at higher speeds that car is a deadly weapon, and when others are dragged into the mix it's a different story.

I'd like to speak on a common point of view too, that if you are gonna live once "then you better live it up while you can, life's too short"...I completely disagree. Life is short, why make it shorter? You can still "live" great without gradual suicides....You don't live short and fun if you live "harder" the whole while--you live shorter, and often end up on ventilators and life support with immense agony. Often those who make it to their 80's, 90's or more die peacefully...if you live hard and die young you often die with great suffering because of the rebellion your body enacts because it's trying to call it quits while you want to go on. You've violently worn out your body with toxins and poisonous stressors, you think you'll go calmly out of this world? Your body's the most important thing you can ever own, hands down. It's no guarantee you'll get a long, great life by living with health in mind (I can already sense all the anecdotal "well my uncle smoked like a chimney and he lived for XX years")....but in the game of chance that this life is, stacking odds in your favor is inarguably the wisest thing one can do.

/sermon
 
Yes smoking increases risk of death including second-hand smoke, but even without smokers your increase of death is still there by other means, we breath in and ingest tons of pollutants unknowingly every single day and don't even get me started on sugar and the damage that does to the body.

Smoking is one known trigger for crohn's disease (but that doesn't mean it's the reason everyone who has crohn's has it because of smoking (this includes second-hand smoke) however the carbon monoxide released from smoking actually causes an anti-inflammatory affect on the colon which is believed to be the reason why many UCers don't get sick until after they quit smoking and can go into remission from smoking, but nothing is written in stone, many CDers smoke and don't do any worse symptom wise compared to when they quit and vise-versa for UCers, it's not a "cure-all" for them either.

People smoke because they enjoy it and because they are addicted to it and dying as a result of someones second-hand smoke is no different than dying as a result of a drunk driver on the road...life is full of risks that's just the way it is, taking one risk out of your life (quitting smoking for example) doesn't guarantee you'll live longer or necessarily healthier either...lots of CDers that never smoked exist a life of living with CD.

I know I wouldn't be impressed if I quit smoking and then died the next day because of a drunk driver LOL!

Life is chance and we all risk it whether we know it or not.

:)
 

Kev

Senior Member
I know the risks of quitting.. Still going to give it a shot. When I quit, I'm going on the patch... indefinitely. There is a risk from staying on the patch too long, but it'll be less risky (hopefully) than continuing on tobacco. If my IBD, whichever it is, does not flare because of quitting within 5 - 10 months, THEN I'll try gradually cutting back on the patch. I may have to stay on it indefinitely. Only time will tell.

As for those who've never been addicted to smoking... I'm sorry, but you really don't know what the addiction is like. Those who are addicted, like myself, are usally all too keen on kicking the habit.. It is second only to herion in strength. And it is easier to get, far more prevalent, far more available, and totally legal.

If I'm driving along, and an elderly person steps out in front of my vehicle, my thoughts aren't.. "Oh, that stupid fool. Damned near got us both killed!". No, I think.. "old-timer, you are doing the best you can.. I'll yield so you can make it"

Anyone, as a crohnie, whose ever had anyone think or express.. "If you REALLY wanted to get well, to get over this disease, you could". Pretty much the way a smoker feels when non-smokers treat him/her like they're 2nd class citizens.
 
Yeah, I'd never pretend to understand or comprehend the addiction of any drug, as I've never done any. I'm not one to state "if you really wanted to you could" it's more complicated than that....I also don't think lowly of smokers in general, but I don't care much for those smokers that have a "get over it" attitude if I'm choking on exhalations in their vicinity when I don't have control over it....and that applies to anybody with a "get over it" attitude whilst harming others, not just 2nd hand smoke.

@ pb4, I'd have to restate my "stacking the odds in one's favor". Of course there are no guarantees in life, but every bit you can lean things in your favor is that much more advantageous. The "somethings gonna get us anyways" line of thinking makes no sense to me, I don't understand such attempts at justification.
 
[ The "somethings gonna get us anyways" line of thinking makes no sense to me, I don't understand such attempts at justification.[/QUOTE]


No worries, it's just the way I happen to look at life...I know and accept the fact that I'm gonna die some day, and I'm quite okay with it, most people fear death, I don't, doesn't mean I play russian roulette in every aspect of my life or anything (my only "guilty" pleasure is smoking cigs) I just know that death it inevitable and I'm gonna do what I enjoy while I'm living and if smoking is my only "risk" factor then be it.

Besides which, I quit smoking for 3 yrs straight and it turned my crohn's into a total nightmare of a flare, didn't leave the house for those three yrs and ended up depressed along with severe anxiety...I don't call that living do you? I started smoking and along with other things (supplementation) things finally started to get better to the point where I can at least leave my house and if smoking is what got me to this point then I guess I have to credit it for that.

:)
 

butt-eze

Superstar
Comparing second-hand smoke to a drunk driver isn't the best analogy I've heard. I think people that drive drunk have even more disrespect for innocent life than someone who forces an innocent person to inhale second-hand smoke. Drunk driving is a horribly stupid act!
I have to agree with Benson's sentiments. Smokers, like my parents and in-laws, will always find a way to justify their habit. Just as I find a way to justify the things that I do that I shouldn't. Obviously, if we all felt bad enough about our habits we would hopefully quit. That's why they're an addiction.

I too realize I will die someday but I realize I don't want to experience the pain of not being able to breath again. Lung cancer and other risks associated with cigarette smoking are crappy ways to die slowly. I've never experienced something more scary than being on a ventilator. So, don't say I never warned you. The nightmare is hard to erase.

I say if anyone wants to continue smoking more power to ya....you'll need it in the end!
 
Yeah, drunk driving is a lot worse (hence you don't get a 10 year revocation of a drivers license for 2nd hand smoke)...it's not an equal analogy, but it demonstrates how one's habit and carelessness can negatively affect another's well-being.

After finding out I had Crohns and worrying about that being my end decades later, I have an even stronger affirmation to live as healthy as possible. It's not like we have a "Crohns patch" that we can wear for a few weeks to quit (be nice though).
 
Well I guess another way to look at it is diet, look what people are shoving into their mouths when it comes to fast-foods and processed foods...look how fat and unhealthy north america has become in the last 50ish yrs because the industry of "fast" has taken over...people who are sugar addicts are causing plenty of damage to themselves, not directly to others of course but the bottom line really is we damage ourselves be it an unhealthy diet, smoking, drinking ect it affects us physically/mentally and financially.

It's a lose-lose situation...people are not perfect, that's human nature, an over-weight non-smoker can shun a skinny smoker and vise-versa but we're all at fault because no one is perfect and those over-weight people who are eating themselves into diabetes and other health issues know better just like a smoker knows better...boils down to human nature. The irony of it all is laughable, imagine some over-weight person sick with diabtes complaining about second-hand smoke killing them. Then there are some who are more concerned with how they're going to die more than the fact they are going to die...one thing I'm sure we could all agree on is the quicker/painless the better but with the way we live our lives today the chances are in favour of a lenghty illness leading us towards our demise.

We're here for a good time, not a long time :)
 
I want to be here for a long, good time. :)

I see your points of the hypocracy of obesity vs. smoking, but some people (termed "health nuts") watch out for risks on all fronts, like me pre-Crohns....no drinking, no smoking, no drugs, no garbage food, no careless promiscuity, etc...I am a fitness freak. And despite this being indicative of a boring person, people who actually know me know otherwise.

Crohns is my vice now. I don't mean to state this in a "holier than thou" tone either, just saying that not everyone has some downfall healthwise (out of choice, ie: Crohns), but I'm not perfect overall, no, far from it. I have faults and there is a crack in the egg shell with me just like the next guy, but it doesn't happen to be an apathetic, reckless treatment of my body.
 
You'll be surprised to know that I work out with cardio and weights at least 4-5 days a week, I eat nothing but healthy, no processed, fast-foods, animal fats, caffeine, just plain old healthy eating and exercising...I do it for my crohn's...I also smoke (6 cigs/day) for my crohn's because as I experianced for myself, without smoking I'm totally unfunctional...I'm still not in full remission, never expect to be because of perianal complications that has left me with active disease my entire 17 yrs with crohns, in my colon, on and off in my rectom and permanatly on my anus, but I do better than the best I can...even being a smoker...and I don't drink or do drugs either...infact, I don't even take oral RX for my CD because I consider myself lucky enough to be either allergic or non-responsive to them...I've gone the natural route with my CD as well which has gotten me farther than any other method.

And I haven't been having a "good time" in the last 17 yrs of having crohns (and then 5 yrs ago developing IBS as well) so I don't care if I'm not here for a long time, I don't eat right and exercise to live longer, just to live a little better...it's all perspective.

:)
 
Good points. Not to direct this thread off topic (cause that never happens on this forum), but what are your non-Rx solutions that've worked? I'm only asking because I'm curious since Rx's seem to thus far, only make my disease laugh.
 
E

elp888

Guest
Shouldn't everything (in a perfect world) be done in moderation?

I like feeling healthy: eating well and exercising regularly.
It's good for mind and body.
However, occasionally i like to drink too much, smoke pot,
and eat whole bags of chips or chocolate chip cookies....
especially when done in good company :)

Maybe not so good for the body, but very good for the mind.
 
BWS1982 said:
Good points. Not to direct this thread off topic (cause that never happens on this forum), but what are your non-Rx solutions that've worked? I'm only asking because I'm curious since Rx's seem to thus far, only make my disease laugh.

I'm either allergic or non-responsive to traditional oral RX so I had no choice but to put my (HUGE) skeptisism aside and try the natural route (which I've been doing for about 5 yrs now)...

I use bee propolis, fibre supplement (which my GI urged me to take), omegas 3-6-9, probiotics called primadophilus reuteri (which aided my high cholesterol and severe lactose intolerance issues as well as vaginal health), vitamins A and C-Calcium Ascorbate cuz it's easiest on the gut (I also take B12 but not to help with my CD symptoms directly), I drink chamomile tea and water (on occassion 100% fresh juice) exercise regularly with cardio and weights, have eliminated fast-foods, processed foods/beverages, animal fats, refined sugar and sugar substitutes/artificial sweetners from my diet.

I used to "go" 30+ times/day with bleeding, tons of mucus, horrible lower back pain and anywhere from semi-formed to mush to D...I now go 5 or less times a day, fully formed stools, no bleeding, no mucus, no pain...Most of the credit for this goes to the bee propolis and fibre supplements (the probiotics too) but the combination of all has brought me down to the level I'm presently at, not full remission as I still have issues with urgency and frequency as 5/day for me is not "normal" (one/day is)...but I'll take what I can get...My GI also encourages me to continue on this route, to him it doesn't matter that oral RX aren't helping me so long as something does, now that's a good GI.

:)
 
elp888 said:
Shouldn't everything (in a perfect world) be done in moderation?

I like feeling healthy: eating well and exercising regularly.
It's good for mind and body.
However, occasionally i like to drink too much, smoke pot,
and eat whole bags of chips or chocolate chip cookies....
especially when done in good company :)

Maybe not so good for the body, but very good for the mind.


LOL, ya, but we don't live in a perfect world, we live in the world of IBD, which is even less perfect than your average world...to each their own, I know many who started out being vegetarian and work-out finatics and still ended up with IBD so I'm certainly not saying that this life-style is guaranteeing one won't get IBD, but I grew up on junk-food and now that I've given it up I don't want it to be part of my life again, even a small part because maybe for me (as we're all still very individualistic as far as this disease goes) it's not an option...but I give it up willingly if it means I'm going to feel better, no bag of chips is worth feeling miserable (if that happens to be part of my connection to being really sick)...I don't miss any of that stuff so it's all good.

I found regular exercise amazing for my mind and body, it brought me out of depression and severe anxiety...I didn't leave my house for a good 3 yrs at one point, which happend to be when I quit smoking and the only reason I started again...so you see, I smoke (6/day) so my method isn't completly "perfect" as far as 100% healthy goes but I don't care, it's what works for me so I'm sticking with it.

:)

:)
 

butt-eze

Superstar
pb4~

I can relate to oral meds to working. Have you considered Remicade or Humira? I tried Remicade and will be starting Humira this week. The Remicade seemed to work for awhile.
 
butt-eze said:
pb4~

I can relate to oral meds to working. Have you considered Remicade or Humira? I tried Remicade and will be starting Humira this week. The Remicade seemed to work for awhile.

Thanks butt-eze :)

Because I don't have severe D and I'm not going 30+ times/day anymore, rather, 5 or less with formed BM's my doc doesn't think I'm a candidate for such a strong med like Remicade and to be honest I'm glad, I don't want something with horrid side-effects, I just wish I could get the urgency issue under better control...the frequency is better (5 or less) but it would be nice to get that back down to my normal which was 1/day before getting sick...for me the urgency is worse than the frequency because when it hits me it hits me hard, I cannot hold it and that's depressing, you'd think having formed BM's would make this a non-issue but not for me.

:)
 

My Butt Hurts

Squeals-a-lot!
How come people hate cigarettes, but love to sit near a campfire??
Maybe cigarettes should be made from campfire wood instead, and no one would have a problem with second hand smoke. Heck - I don't care what other people want to do with their lungs as long as it smells okay.
Mmmmm.... when my husband is smoking some beef on the grill - that's good smoke!!
 

Kev

Senior Member
Captain Black cigarillos smoke smells just like chocolate.. nobody complained how they smelled.. Go figure
 
D

dizzyd

Guest
Had my annual check up with my specialist and he seems to think smoking is a big no-no for crohns. Says it will come back faster and more severe. Since I have finally kicked the habit (it took several tries) he didn't even want to discuss me going on maintenence drugs. He said quitting it the best thing I could have done and if I was still smoking then he would have wanted me on Imuran. Anyway if anybody is interested the book by Alan Carr "Easy Way to Quite Smoking" is very good. It took several readings and attempts but everything finally sunk in. The mental addiction was way harder to break than the physical addiction.
 
dizzyd,

Your doc is correct, statistics do show that smoking is technically bad for crohn's but helpful for uc because the carbon monoxide in cigarettes aids with inflammation in the colon, yet for crohnies smoking can actually make cd in the small intestines worse...however it is important to remember that nothing is written in stone regarding this either as many ucers still don't find any comfort from smoking and some cders (such as myself) do better smoking than not, maybe because my cd is mainly affecting my colon, who knows, all I know is when I quit (using zyban which worked like a charm by the way, with mental and physical addiction for me anyways) quitting for three yrs made my cd worse than ever and starting again (along with adding other things) really helped.

:)
 
D

dizzyd

Guest
Crohns really is different for every person. I quit smoking for several reasons.
One reason was my crohns the others money, health and I really do hate the taste and smell. Tobacco company did a great job in convincing us that we need to smoke...hard to believe how socially acceptable it was years ago. The new laws are good...Being made aware of what I was doing to non smokers when I lit up really made me hate smoking.
 

Kev

Senior Member
The take I've had on it.. and I just quit smoking, so I'm not advocating it... is that it assists with blood loss in colitis (whether its ulcerative or crohns 'COLITIS') but it hinders in crohns in the small bowel (iluem, jeujunem - sp-. duodenum, cecum, etc)
Why it hinders there but helps in the colon I don't know. Maybe the diameter of the colon leads to more bleeding, and the critical thing is to stop the bleeding. As to whether the doctors know why it works one place, not other, I dont know. I just know that if you've got colitis, regardless which type, and you quit smoking, there is a risk you'll be advised about by those running the stop smoking programs. it still, in my opinion, is worth taking the risk
 
I've never heard anything along those lines of smoking assisting with blood loss, only that the carbon monoxide aids with colon inflammation but can be irritating to the small intestines for those with crohns...the only thing I know of that hinders blood loss for all IBDers is taking NSAIDS.

Here's a link..

http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/35173.php

:)
 
I know some have had better luck with staying on cigs, but I still believe overall that stopping smoking is "total body-wise" a better decision, as hard as quitting is. If it happens to make your disease much worse, go and see a doctor to find out alternative treatments, or even surgery if need be, because I doubt many doctors could say without remorse that smoking is "benefitting" a patient so much as to ignore any other risks, even though apparently it can benefit. Don't mean to sound high and mighty at all, really...but justifying benefits from carbon monoxide (remember that toxic stuff that comes out of cars?) and ignoring the harm on the rest of the body is akin to scalping yourself because you're tired of paying for haircuts....I know it's given some relief in a disease that's difficult to treat, but I will always be in the belief that there's got to be a better way for each of those individuals. Think of cigarettes as any other medication in this light, with all the demonic effects we all know they have on the heart, skin, lungs, brain, everything...is that a set of side effects that is outweighed by benefits? I really can't make the decision for you but if it were me I'd never stop searching for a new method of treatment, because I literally couldn't live with myself smoking, even lightly, just to get some Crohns relief. Again, no offense.
 

Kev

Senior Member
The properties of smoking that causes it to constrict blood vessels results in less bleeding.. those same properties cause hyper tension, heart disease, etc, etc.. The other small benefit is that tobacco counteracts caffiene, caffiene can worsen diarhea, dehydration, etc.. As for alternatives to the bloodloss, doctors couldn't offer me anything that worked... tho I'd been hospitalized for over a week. My big hope is that the NRT will preclude me having another episode, as my only remaining recourse may be surgical removal of all my remaining colon.
 
I wonder what the possibilities are if any botanical or herbal analogues can be either discovered or altered etc....to mimic the nicotines effects. Even a synthetic substance of sorts that has none of the risks.

Congrats Kev, btw on the decision, all the best, I really think blogging here will help. Really hope your body takes well to it.
 

Kev

Senior Member
Well, the 'clean' nicotine patch can be safely used for a year.. my plan is to take it for that long at least.. but try tapering off at the 9 or 10 month mark very slowly.

Here's the kicker.. nicotine isn't addictive.. not habit forming.. its the 599 other chemicals the cig makers put into tobacco that make it habit forming N addictive. And, when you burn these 599 known added chemicals, that process causes them to react, forming new combos, so the total is closer to 1000. ALL added to make it harder to kick the habit. Now those same sweethearts are marketing single cigarellos... flavoured like peppermint, cherry, chocolate, wine.
In single packing, they dont' have to carry the warning labels, and fool folks to thinking.. I'm only going to buy one... what's the harm in that? Right! GOTCHA!
One leads to another, then to two... and then you get hooked, and can't get off

Pretty darned sneaky..

As for carbon monoxide alleviating inflammation, that part does make sense, to a degree... like, ever had a sunburn, any type of burn.. keep the air away from it .. and the pain decreases. CO would do the same.. but how would it get to the GI tract... only in the bloodstream. I'm not doubting that it could impact on inflammation, just having a problem understanding the method of delivery, you know. Like, since I haven't been around any Carb. Monox. for days now, you would think my inflammation or pain levels would have increased. due to just pressure alone. Doesn't matter.. I'm not worried about pain, just bloodloss. It really knocked the stuffing out of me when it was at my worst..
 
BWS1982 said:
I know some have had better luck with staying on cigs, but I still believe overall that stopping smoking is "total body-wise" a better decision, as hard as quitting is. If it happens to make your disease much worse, go and see a doctor to find out alternative treatments, or even surgery if need be, because I doubt many doctors could say without remorse that smoking is "benefitting" a patient so much as to ignore any other risks, even though apparently it can benefit.
It's not always as cut and dried as just going to see your doc for alternatives to smoking...I'm either allergic or non-responsive to traditional oral RX and I know there are many more out there in the same boat...

I've actually had my colon and rectom surgeon tell me not to quit smoking if it brings me any relief with my symptoms, but he was also aware that I don't respond to traditional oral RX too...

I've also had a GP tell me that if prednisone was the only thing that worked (for a short time it was) that I should just remain on it indefinitely....

to be honest, I'd rather smoke then stay on pred the rest of my life, the effects of smoking aren't always as noticable physically compared to that of permanant pred use.

There isn't always an easy answer unfortunately it's usually a matter of deciding between 2 evils.

One good thing is that they are working on a med that mimics the effects of carbon monoxide being released as if by smoking, without all the harmful affects from actually smoking...but meds usually are in the pipeline for about 10 yrs so who knows when it will actually be available....I could be dead from smoking by the time this med hits the shelves LOL!

:)
 

Kev

Senior Member
yeah, from the non smoker perspective, it seems so cut and dried to just quit the cigarette addiction. It isn't. I've had 3 docs in this field suggest (in a whisper) to keep smoking, and one insist that I not quit w/o supervision (still have to face the prospect of saying I didn't listen to that).. and the fine folks at the addiction centre told EVERYONE there is a risk. Like, I wonder from time to time if my diseae would have stayed in remission if I hadn't quit the last time. Those of you with this disease who never smoked... think about that. I mean, really think about that. One socially unacceptable habit, if I'd kept at it, might have prevented the last 3 years of hell I've gone thru.. the sacrifices that I've had to endure.. Next time you want to confront a smoker who crosses your path.. stop for a moment and consider.. he/she quitting may trigger a life of crohns for them. And I'm not making this up.. not defending smoking, just the need for us to understand our fellow man (woman), and the rest of the story.
 
Points taken. I know the quitting isn't cut and dry, that's nearly impossible.

I'm interested in how well/fast that CO mimic-pill comes out.
 

Kev

Senior Member
Actually, the CO thing puzzles me.. Cardon monoxide isn't good for folks (listen who's talking about things not being good for folks.. talk about being two faced).
Be interesting to see who/what/where will make/sell it. I heard about (tho it may be urban myth) about an 'artificial' cigarette avail in Europe that provides CO but does not release harmful toxins/smoke to anyone else.. anyone heard of this? My point (before I lose all track) is whether a manufacturer could patent something that is just CO.. or could they just patent the method behind the way its made. Without some patent protection, is there enuff profit for such a pill? And, at what cost/price? Can't I just go inhale some 2nd hand smoke vs paying for another pill?

OH, and a footnote. Those considering quitting smoking should do it sooner vs later.. 1st, its healthier (usually) to quit sooner vs later.. BUT it will be easier too.
WHY? Well, apparently tobacco of today ain't the tobacco of yesterday. 16 years ago, a smoke had < 200 added chemical to make it more addictive. that number today is close to 600.. Seems the tobacco lobby don't like quitters.
 
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R

Racer X

Guest
Kev said:
Say you're a non smoker, working a bar, etc., where 50 - 70% of your wages comes from tips. Someone says.. Ok, lets ban smoking in bars and taverns. It sounds like a great idea, you won't have to breath in 2nd hand smoke. Stale beer, or b/o, well.. that stays with the territory. But at least no 2nd hand smoke.. Then your tips drop by 30% or more, then they cut back your hours.. or even have to reduce staff and let you go.
Kev your numbers sound amazing! But I know a lot of non-smokers who are going out more because of the smoking ban.

Is this a hypothetical example that you came up with or is it based on facts? And, If you are correct and smokers will stay home, don't you need to point out that the quantity of non-smokers going out will likely increase?

Regarding your statement that you need to be around second hand smoke all of the time for it to hurt you. I ask you to think about the young kids working to serve you. They are in those establishments every night!

The majority of smokers I know don't mind having to go outside for a smoke. I have read a lot of your posts, you seem to be a reasonable guy who is very intelligent. Obviously you are looking at this issue from the smoker perspective. If you put your self in the shoes of a non-smoker, isn't it better to walk outside in order to reduce the risk of hurting others?
 
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Kev

Senior Member
Hey, its not a hypothetical situation... business is way down in bars and taverns.
Staff are losing tips, hours, even jobs. As for bias, hey.. I'm a non smoker now. It would be easy for me to take the non smoker perspective. Problem is I didn't take the smoker perspective in my earlier post... I was taking it from the perspective of the bar owners and workers.. Hey, in my early days I worked a lot of taverns and bars... Yes, working around 2nd smoke is risky.. can lead to a lot of health problems... but so can working in coal mines, or in a factory. In my position with LSI, the air quality in our plant was monitored. Still, everyone had to have their blood tested every so often to check for elevated lead levels.
Here in Canada, the law allows people to refuse to work in any situation that can be shown to be a risk to life/limb, without repercussion. Yet, everyday, at least one worker is hurt or killed on the job. Removing smokers from taverns does remove a potential risk from the folks working there, but they were ready to take that risk... Now, their pays are less, they've even lost their 'safer' job, and the influx of non smokers that was supposed to make up the difference is not there... not in the same quantity as the lost customers. Maybe smokers did more drinking, or socializing, or maybe they needed a place outside of home to smoke... whatever the reasons, places that were SRO before the ban, today they have room to spare. That is neither pro or anti smoking, it just is what it is
 
even though, as we speak, i am still a smoker (planning on changing that very soon), i'm not saying this with the viewpoint of either a smoker, nor a non-smoker. this is just my opinion, for what it's worth.

since the 'no smoking' laws came into effect here in the UK last July, we are seeing more and more pubs with "For Lease" signs outside. something i have never witnessed before. talking to landlords, they all blame the fact that it is uncomfortable for their smoker customers to go outside, very often in the rain & cold, every so often for a cig. many pubs, mainly those belonging to large chains, have erected a covered area for this purpose, but it's still cold out there... so people are not frequenting these places any more..

i know the point of the 'no smoking' law is twofold, ie: to protect non-smokers from inhaling 2nd hand smoke, and to deter smokers from smoking, hopefully giving up. there is a massive anti-smoking drive here, with many avenues of support, funded by the NHS. HOWEVER - people do smoke. people at the moment have the right to smoke, and wherever there is going to be a gathering in a building, i think there should be a provision - a room with air extraction, where smokers can go.

i very often see, when attending outpatient appointments, patients who have dragged their drip stands all the way from the ward, across car parks, just to light up - often in bad weather.

it's almost as if the government thinks "if we can't see the problem, it's not there". but it is, and people WILL smoke, if they want to. to me, it smacks of the Big Brother mentality. plus, if there weren't the addictive additives put into cigarettes in the first place, smokers would not have the problem giving up that they do have.


ok, stepping off my soapbox now, and creeping away quietly... lol
 

Kev

Senior Member
Kevin steps up, breaks the soapbox.. just wasn't designed for 240 lbs.. oh well.

anyway, I was referring to pubs and taverns... even worse, these places spent thousands (typically to meet the laws that were introduced, they spent $10,000+)
just 2 years earlier.. when the law was first into'ed.. to set up separate smoking areas.

Just two years later, the law was replaced with a total ban.. these businesses did not stand a chance to re-coup their investments, no warning was given. It was essentially government responding to a lobby group without any thought of the long term impact. When governments are dancing to lobbyists instead of the people, whether you happen to agree with the lobby group or not, it isn't real representation. Two wrongs don't make a right. As for restaurants, even smokers didn't have an issue with them... Its absurd, a person who smokes is not allowed to sit in a separate room, or on an outdoor patio, smoke and have a drink... but if they step arcoss the rope dividing the patio from the sidewalk, leaving their drink on the table, they can light up and smoke perfectly legally. Regardless of pro or con... that is just totally infantile .. but it is the law. Duh!!
 
yup, i wasn't referring to eating places.. i completely agree - there should be no smoking around food, or children. or for that matter, around anyone who does not want to inhale cigarette smoke. i just think there should be provision for those who do want to smoke, whist respecting everyone else, and the laws.

Kev - you may like this one.. here, we cannot stand outside our places of work within (i think) 8 feet... so in office areas, do we just cross the road & stand outside each other's buildings? you're right - the law is an ass.
 
Over the last few years most of the towns and cities around where I live have passed ordinances that banned smoking in bars and restaurants. Initially I noticed a few of the places that I frequent had less customers but that didn't seem to last very long. I think they might be selling less alcohol but a lot more food due to the fact that more families are showing up. Once a week I meet up with a group of about 6 people that go biking on a nearby trail. After our ride we usually stop at a restaurant/pub just off the trail to get some dinner and a couple of drinks. Each time we have had to wait for a table.

IMO, I don't think that it should be up to the local gov't to make these decisions. It should be up to the individual restaurant and bar owners. If they want a smoke-free restaurant they should be able to and vice-versa.
 

Kev

Senior Member
One of the real tragedies of the law here was there was a 'Tobacco' bar, where folks went to purchase a fine cigar, and sit down and smoke it with cognac, etc..
There were no non-smokers in the place. because all it did was cater to smokers.
It sold cigars, imported cigarettes, it rented out humidor space to tobacconists, etc .. Know how old the place was.. it was historic, tracing back to the days of the privateers (licensed pirates).. Right or wrong, pro or con, when anyone goes to extremes... left or right... no government, too much government, the fact is people get hurt, rights get eroded or trampled on. George Orwells take on big government gets closer to reality. And I'm still a non smoker... so there!
 
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