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My Experience with Methotrexate & Pentasa

Hello Everyone,

I am new to this forum and would like to share my experience with Crohn's treatments. I was first diagnosed with Crohn's in Spring 2009 after a bloody stool. A colonoscopy and small bowel fall-through determined there were ulcers in the terminal ilieum. The GI doctor prescribed Pentasa (eight 500 mg capsules per day). A couple of years later after no Crohn's symptoms or side effects from Pentasa, I proposed reducing the dosage to six capsules per day. The GI doctor concurred. By the Summer of 2013, I questioned whether I actually had Crohn's. I stopped the Pentasa with the GI doctor's concurrence, but he warned me that the bleeding may return. It did ~1.5 months later. I restarted Pentasa (six capsules per day). In July 2015, the bleeding returned. Since I was on blood thinners for a DVT condition in my leg, the best course of treatment was determined to be a small bowel resection. After the surgery, I went to see a Crohn's specialist at UVA. She suggested that I should stop the Pentasa and start methotrexate as the best course of treatment to keep Crohn's in remission. I started methotrexate (25 mg weekly subcutaneously) in early September 2015. After 2 months, I couldn't take the side effects any more (diarrhea, nausea, very tired). The UVA GI doctor recommended reducing the dosage to 15 mg. I had the same side effects (3 bad days instead of 4 with the full dose after the weekly injection). Then, I searched the literature, especially the findings from clinical trials with methotrexate. The article, "Methotrexate in Crohn's Disease" by Christina Ha, Prasanna Kumaranayake, and Brian G. Fegan is found on pages 667-671 of the book, "Advanced Therapy in Inflammatory Bowel Disease" and is supported by 41 references. For any of you interested in the deeper medical side of Crohn's Disease, I understand this book is excellent. Here is some key points:

- Methotrexate (MTX) was originally created to treat Leukemia
- It is a, "Competitive antagonist of folic acid" -- it inhibits dihydrofolate reductase however they don't think that is what makes it work considering supplementation with folic acid doesn't cause MTX not to work.
- Methotrexate has been shown to suppress inflammatory molecules, decrease cytotoxic t-cell function, and reduce neutrophil activity.
- MTX is available in oral, IV, intramuscular, and subcutaneous forms.
- Doses less than 15mg are well absorbed. Greater than 15mg and the absorption rate is varied.
- Oral doses of MTX between 15-25mg given orally were absorbed 73% less than subcutaneous doses.
- The main metabolite of MTX (what it turns into) is 7-hydroyxy-MTX -- it is converted to this in the liver by hepatic aldehyde
- NSAIDs and 5-ASA may increase the levels of MTX in the blood.
- MTX is excreted through the kidneys so anyone with kidney issues are at increased risk of toxicity.
- The most common side effects are nausea, vomiting, headache, myelosuppression, leukopenia, hypersensitivity pneumonitis (lung inflammation), fatigue, liver problems, hepatic fibrosis.
- Split dosing may help alleviate some side effects
- If fatigue is a problem, taking it at night may be beneficial
- Daily dosing can lead to hepatoxicity thus the weekly dosing.
- Routine liver enzyme tests should be done while on MTX.
- It's rare that liver issues arise for IBD patients on MTX. Often there will be some fluctuation in liver enzymes but those usually normalize.
- Due to the potential for liver problems, MTX should be used with caution if people consume a lot of alcohol, already have levated liver enzymes, have diabetes, or are obese.
- Routine blood levels should be taken to monitor for myelosuppression.
- Folate is often given as a supplement while on MTX.
- MTX can cause sterility in men but not women.
- MTX is pregnancy category X and shouldn't be given to women who may have kids or during breast feeding.
- There have been five controlled studies of Methotrexate in Crohn's Disease patients but there was varied dosing and administration so they're not all that sure what its true efficacy is.
- In one study of 141 patients who were given 25mg intramuscularly, 39% were in remission at 16 weeks versus 19% of placebos.
- In an israeli study with 12.5mg oral dose there was no difference to placebo.
- Another study of oral doses between 15 and 22.5mg showed only 46% had "disease exacerbations" whereas 80% of placebo did.
- Two studies comparing AZA/6-MP to MTX showed about the same remission rates but MTX has a lot more side effects.
- Another study showed 25mg subcutaneously had clinical response AND mucosal healing.
- A study showed that low dose (15mg intramuscularly) is an effective maintenance therapy with 65% still in remission versus 39% of placebo at 40 weeks.
- Another maintenance therapy study using oral MTX (10mg) showed 67% in remission at week 76.
- Relapse rates on MTX showcased via a meta analysis were 29%, 41%, and 48% at the 1,2,3 year marks.
- In a study of MTX in combination with Infliximab, remission rates between Infliximab and placebo and Infliximab and MTX were not different however patients were less likely to develop Infliximab antibodies while on MTX.

Considering the above findings, I think the relapse rates for patients on Methotrexate (increase to 48% after 3 years) is especially important. I presented these findings to the UVA GI doctor and requested that I restart Pentasa. She concurred and I am now taking eight 500 mg capsules per day. My thinking is I would rather take my chances with a drug (Pentasa) that was effective for more than six years (discounting the bleeding episode after I stopped taking it) with no side effects than one (Methotrexate) where there is an increasing chance of relapse with time with serious side effects.

Best of luck to everyone with their respective treatments.
 

fuzzy butterfly

Well-known member
Hi thanks for the post very interesting. It maybe something i need to think about in the future so again thanks ..
Hope it works for you this time too 💕
 
David posted several threads related to the book you mention.

Here is the link to the main thread:

http://www.crohnsforum.com/showthread.php?t=36155&highlight=Advanced+IBD

From there, in the first post, you can click on links to the different chapters and his analysis.

The 5ASAs Cochrane Review that can be found in the mesalamine link in David's first post is very interesting:

A Cochrane review (very strict) of 1420 patients found there was no improvement over placebo and didn't feel further study was justified. Ouch.
- Another study of 1305 patients found some benefit over placebo. A 6% benefit.
I'm glad to hear that pentasa is working for you. I think for most it is just not enough since it acts as a topical affecting only the top layer and CD is transmural affecting all layers.
 

Lady Organic

Moderator
Staff member
I would suggest you combine your pentasa decision with a diet approach such as IBD-AID diet which you can find in my signature. I would further suggest you do very close monitoring on a regular basis of your condition with your GI. (blood test, fecal calprotectine, colonoscopy and biopsies, etc.) Disease has to be in real full remission and not wait to see blood in stools to declare disease activity. Otherwise even minimal inflammation we sometimes do not even feel can lead to possible unfortunate events. good luck and let us know how it goes :).
 
This is great to read. I'm on 8 Pentasa a day and lactulose to help soften my stools. I was formally diagnosed last year after an MR scan and other tests. I suspect I've had it much longer than that undiagnosed. Blood reappeared in my stool recently and hence the intro of methotrexate. I'm worried about side effects however. Thanks for all the info. M
 
I ate 1000's of Pentasa, over the years, they did not stop me from getting a fistula into my bladder= resection. 2 years ago another resection due to blockage. Current GI says Pentasa is not effective, now on mtx for a year now. Seems to be working, nausea all the time however, esp 2nd,3rd day after injection.
pentatsa does have the fewest side effects, great if it works for you and a first try drug to see if it is effective.
 
Hi Rick, I just had my first ever injection of mtx today, 25mg, at 10:45. Around 5pm I started to feel nauseous and knackered tired. Didn't feel like eating much. Drank a load of water all day because of a dull daylong headache. But not the worst. Beats acute pancreatitis (my last awful experience on Aza!). Im still on Pentasa but not actually sure how that's going. I guess I'm hooked on it. Does anyone know how often MRI scans should happen to assess the situation internally? I apparently have 20cm of active BD in my terminal ileum.
 
Hi m86,

I hope mtx works out for you. I seem to be doing okay on it.
Who gave you the injection?
I was told and do take it at night before bed, Sunday night, that way the nausea is supposed to happen when you sleep. I have never taken it through the day, so do not know how I would feel.
iirc when i started mtx, it was after 3 months I got a scope, to see if it was working. I have never had an mri, for crohns investigation, only a ct with barium once upon a time. lots of scopes however.

Good luck
Rick
 
Little update from me. Day 2 on mtx. Last night was Friday night and I had 2 small glasses of white wine. This morning I've a throbbing headache as if I had a whole bottle! My heart beat feels louder, if that makes sense. Also drank tonnes of water. My BMs aren't easy. On the constipated side. Maybe lactulose will help me? Still on 8 Pentasa a day.

Rick, the nurse gave me the injection first time, to show me. They'll be taking bloods weekly for 4 wks. It's precautionary because of my reaction to aza last time (nights on drip in Hosp because it gave me acute pancreatitis). So the next 3 weeks I'll be going in for bloods anyway, and they'll watch me do the injection myself. After that, they give me the 'equipment' for me to do it at home, for 4 months. During that time I get fortnightly bloods with my GP.

I'd be interested in getting scope to monitor progress. Even though they're extremely uncomfortable. Is that a sigmoid fibroscopy? I had some of those 2 years ago, they pointed out the ulceration in my small bowel. I was like "thanks guys! Hello insides". I found that unpleasant, anything up the back passage with an audience is a bit humiliating. Even though I know they're just doing their job. There's nothing special about my ass. They prob see 100s a week.

The MR scan I had late last year showed my consultant the severity of the inflammation and that it was consistent with active BD , Crohn's. Barium juice thing is horrendous.

It's good to talk / write about CD. I just had a dream last night about me getting angry / upset at a friend's lack of understanding. Actually wait, that's real life! "Oh I had something like that once!"

Have a nice weekend all x
 
It is going to take a while to see what the full effects of mtx will be, hang in there. make sure you keep an eye on the side effects.
bit alarming, but per the course, my new GI says Pentasa is a waste of time/money, I tend to agree. if you are paying out of pocket, for pentasa, makes you wonder.
Even though they're extremely uncomfortable.
I do not feel a thing, I am out like a light. I do remember my first scope, 20 years ago, awake on demerol watching it on the monitor = once is good enough thank you = old school. they have good drugs these days, very few side effects. it is the prep that I dislike. I can not drink the colyte stuff anymore, as it makes me gag, duclax and the other drink stuff works out okay. i shall see in feb if the GI wants to do another look.

good health
 
Just an update. Second week of MTX and I'm proud (?) to say I injected it myself. Today (Sunday) took folic acid. I don't feel bad at all. Felt mildly nauseous a few hours after injection but that didn't stop me from enjoying a surprise 3 course fancy meal and a few glasses of wine. I had taken 2 days leave from work so I'm pretty sure that was a contributing factor! Still on standard 8 Pentasa a day. BMs are not 100% easy but at least I'm going. Not drinking enough water (note to self). Need to watch my fat / sugar intake and boost my veg/fruit juicing again. Signed up to my first 10km with my colleague at work. Getting married in August so trying to stay motivated!! How's everyone else doing? M
 

fuzzy butterfly

Well-known member
Well done on your self injecting. Glad you enjoyed your meal. Yes drink more water to help the bm's..nice once on signing up for the 10km. Hope that goes well. Congrats on the wedding,hope you are in really good shape for that , as well as possible for your special day. ☺💕
 
This is slightly off point but does anyone have any leads for studies on effectiveness of hyperbaric chamber treatment for Crohn's disease? My mum's cousin said it's very good but it's £20 a pop and that its excellent for inflammatory diseases including MS. She advised that I ask my consultant for a letter so that I could claim from my private healthcare. He basically fobbed it off as waste of time and asked why I would pursue something that want proven. I've seen a good few studies but not sure which are the best examples to share with him. I'm annoyed because his letter is littered with caveats - just be bloody well upfront. Annoyed. Any tips welcome.
 
hi everyone,

hope your doin okay. good to hear m86 is doing injection. I prefer my chunk of flesh in my upper thigh. seems to make a good pin cushion :)
i'll see if I can remember to ask my GI about your hyperbolic chamber treatment, when I see him next week. just to see the look on his face will make it worth it.
did you search the net/this forum for answers? have to read up on it myself.

i myself have gotten a lung infection, started last week, itchy throat, continual coughing, sore left lung from coughing so much, by friday fever, not going away, body was not going to do fix itself, so went to see the dr, put me on azithromycin, 6 tabs, 2 to start, 1 each day after. sweated the bed sheets soaking wet on saturday night. gee, just like a cd attack, but i know it ain't a cd attack or i'd know it. i seem to be getting better, no more continuous coughing, bit of throat itch still , but not like before, small fever, sweating, dizzy, mild headache, fixed that with extra strength tylenol.
I think I got the bug from my gf, she had similar issues two weeks ago. i guess the bugs were living in her pillow or around the house:) should have refrained on the kissing action = trouble.
i hope it is not the mtx, time will tell.
take care
Rick
 
Hi all

I hope Rick's feeling better - sounds like you've had a hard time.

My third week on MTX - 2nd week injecting it myself. I took a while to get ready this morning was so tired. Cried in the clinic because I was just emotional and needed to have a cry about it all. The nurse was friendly, held my hand and said "it's hard to put a brave face on all the time". She's right. You all remember that too - it's okay to vent sometimes. She took my bloods and I took the injection - made my way to work and was productive for a few hours despite being exhausted. My colleagues said I should go home and rest (they're really understanding, but I mostly cause no problems!).

So I just got a call from the clinic saying that my haemoglobin was unusually low. They want to make sure there's nothing weird going on, so have to go in again tomorrow.

Have any of you have similar experience with your bloods? Why does that happen I wonder...
 
Hi,

i am better now in the lung infection dept, but i know my cd is acting up, I can feel it in the illium, dull pain, odd throb, diarrhea again. no piercing pain.
i am guessing the gi says to go back up to a 1cc weekly injection again and another scope, i am losing count of them.

my blood work up till now has been okay, just gave more samples on friday so will get results when I see the GI next thurs. so no experiences or answers to share.
they keep an eye on your liver function, enzymes? to see how you are doing so something is up. good to know that you are on to it asap.

my advise, especially if you are going to work, is to give yourself injections at night and on the weekends, like I do, so that you can sleep after initial dose and if you do it on friday night, you have 2 days to get over the initial hit.
it is a trade off, when do you want to feel the worst, at work during the week or at home on the weekend?

take care and hang in there everyone, the best you can.
 
Hi,



i am better now in the lung infection dept, but i know my cd is acting up, I can feel it in the illium, dull pain, odd throb, diarrhea again. no piercing pain.

i am guessing the gi says to go back up to a 1cc weekly injection again and another scope, i am losing count of them.



my blood work up till now has been okay, just gave more samples on friday so will get results when I see the GI next thurs. so no experiences or answers to share.

they keep an eye on your liver function, enzymes? to see how you are doing so something is up. good to know that you are on to it asap.



my advise, especially if you are going to work, is to give yourself injections at night and on the weekends, like I do, so that you can sleep after initial dose and if you do it on friday night, you have 2 days to get over the initial hit.

it is a trade off, when do you want to feel the worst, at work during the week or at home on the weekend?



take care and hang in there everyone, the best you can.

Hi again, little update from me. Last week my consultant took me off MTX because the side effects were so extreme. Tiredness. Fatigue. Depressed. So he's now saying I should start infliximab infusions, in the interim I'm to take steroids to control the inflammation and the occasional sharp pains in my lower right hand stomach. I'm worried about steroids. I've never had them and I know it sounds lame but, I don't want my body to react like getting a moon face or whatever. I've already had such a hard time on everything else. Getting married and want to look like myself. So. This is exactly what the gi nurse said: Budesonide . you should take 9mgs per day for two weeks then 6mgs per day for two weeks and then 3mgs per day for two weeks. Anyone have any experience of this steroid and/or the infliximab? Hope you're okay. x I'm so happy to be off MTX.
 
Thanks for the info. I am new to mexthotraxte just did my third injection last week. I take it in the evening and notice I get tired so I think it helps to take at night and sleep it off. I do feel tired and weak the next couple days and I had my first mild headache the day after injection last week. All in all it is alot better than the last medication I was on which made me throw up after taking it.

I have AS also and I noticed the hip pain and stiffness after injecting for 24 to 48 hrs but not near as bad as what I felt before recently being diagnosed. I am interested to see if this medication will control both after I am done with the decreasing steriod.
 
Thanks for the info. I am new to mexthotraxte just did my third injection last week. I take it in the evening and notice I get tired so I think it helps to take at night and sleep it off. I do feel tired and weak the next couple days and I had my first mild headache the day after injection last week. All in all it is alot better than the last medication I was on which made me throw up after taking it.

I have AS also and I noticed the hip pain and stiffness after injecting for 24 to 48 hrs but not near as bad as what I felt before recently being diagnosed. I am interested to see if this medication will control both after I am done with the decreasing steriod.
Best to you
 

fuzzy butterfly

Well-known member
Hi m86 i have been on both. Budesonide is a mild ish steroid and if u are only on it for a few weeks,you are unlikely to have side effects. Infliximab is really good if it suits you. I had no side effects from it. It did not help me tho. I know that plenty of people do really well on it tho. Best wishes 💕
 
I had the same side effects with Budesonide as I do with Pred. Green Bay Packer in drag. I was on it only for four weeks....quickly pulled off of it.

Anaphylactic reaction to Remicade.
 
Thanks for the info. I am new to mexthotraxte just did my third injection last week. I take it in the evening and notice I get tired so I think it helps to take at night and sleep it off. I do feel tired and weak the next couple days and I had my first mild headache the day after injection last week. All in all it is alot better than the last medication I was on which made me throw up after taking it.



I have AS also and I noticed the hip pain and stiffness after injecting for 24 to 48 hrs but not near as bad as what I felt before recently being diagnosed. I am interested to see if this medication will control both after I am done with the decreasing steriod.

That's exactly how I was on MTX . Good luck with your treatment x
 
Hi m86 i have been on both. Budesonide is a mild ish steroid and if u are only on it for a few weeks,you are unlikely to have side effects. Infliximab is really good if it suits you. I had no side effects from it. It did not help me tho. I know that plenty of people do really well on it tho. Best wishes [emoji177]

Thanks fuzzy butterfly! That's a relief. I had my first budesonide last night and couldn't sleep. Maybe that's just a coincidence because my mind was preoccupied / stimulated recording music. Yesterday I ate yummy Vietnamese pho. I forgot to ask for it without bean sprouts and I think that's making my stomach make that weird gassy / gurgle sound. Your reply makes me feel positive. Getting IV remicade for the first time in a few weeks = scary but hope it works and induces remission!!
 

fuzzy butterfly

Well-known member
Hi, i slept ok with budesonide. So hopefuly it was just preoccupation as u say. I hope it works really well for you. If it does you will see a great improvement in your condiction. Bear in mind it may take a few months to get the full effect. So hang in there ☺ 💕
 
Thanks fuzzy butterfly! That's a relief. I had my first budesonide last night and couldn't sleep. Maybe that's just a coincidence because my mind was preoccupied / stimulated recording music. Yesterday I ate yummy Vietnamese pho. I forgot to ask for it without bean sprouts and I think that's making my stomach make that weird gassy / gurgle sound. Your reply makes me feel positive. Getting IV remicade for the first time in a few weeks = scary but hope it works and induces remission!!
I hope the Remicade works wonders for you.
 

Scipio

Well-known member
Location
San Diego
"Thanks fuzzy butterfly! That's a relief. I had my first budesonide last night and couldn't sleep"

Budesonide, and other corticosteroids, are known to interfere with sleep. For this reason it is better to take your full daily dose of budesonide in the morning - first thing right after you wake up.
 
"Thanks fuzzy butterfly! That's a relief. I had my first budesonide last night and couldn't sleep"

Budesonide, and other corticosteroids, are known to interfere with sleep. For this reason it is better to take your full daily dose of budesonide in the morning - first thing right after you wake up.
I usually take mine early in the morning or early afternoon
 
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