• Welcome to Crohn's Forum, a support group for people with all forms of IBD. While this community is not a substitute for doctor's advice and we cannot treat or diagnose, we find being able to communicate with others who have IBD is invaluable as we navigate our struggles and celebrate our successes. We invite you to join us.

New study vaccine and immunosuppressants

my little penguin

Moderator
Staff member

So some response just 1/3 of a nonsuppressed person
 
Location
San Diego
The "booster" and the "3rd dose" are exactly the same in terms of what is being injected. Where they differ is in who is receiving the injection.

"Boosters" are for healthy people in order to boost up their immune response and thus increase the concentration of anti-COVID antibodies in the blood that may have slowly waned over time. "Third doses" are for patients suffering from some medical condition or receiving some drug(s) that have the effect of weakening the immune response, and thus they may have mounted a poor response in the first place to the first two injections.

I'm getting my 3rd dose this afternoon after work.
 

Lisa

Adminstrator
Staff member
Location
New York, USA
To give some reference numbers - to show how the body responds to the shots and booster/3rd shot -

I received my 2nd shot 3/15 - here are my antibody levels..

4/13 - over 250 U/ml
6/15 - 451.0 U/ml
9/30 - 188.0 U/ml

Received my 3rd shot/booster on 9/30 AFTER the blood draw above -
10/15 - 1426.0

So the 3rd shot definitely did 'something' - it will be interesting to see how levels change as time goes on - I will be getting bloods drawn again at 1, 3, 6 and 12 months out.....
 

Maya142

Moderator
Staff member
There is a difference between the third shot and booster for Moderna recipients. The doses are different. A third shot, for an immunocompromised person, is exactly the same as the first and second shots in terms of dose - 100 micrograms. The booster that has just been authorized is half that - 50 micrograms and is for those populations that are eligible for a booster (65+ etc).
 

my little penguin

Moderator
Staff member
Ds got his results back
Cov2IGG quantitative test through labcorp and university of North Carolina ibd PREVENT. Study
After 2 shots —92
After 3 shots —148
Anything above 1 is considered positive for antibodies
Anything over 30 is considered very high
He was outside their reference range high both times
 
Wow, so I knew my antibodies were low to begin with (thanks Humira + AZA!), but seeing how high some of your antibody levels were is amazing!

My initial antibodies were 3.4 after 2 doses and after 3 doses is now 14.:confused:

I’m assuming mine is so low due to being on combination meds that suppress my immune system and those of you with higher levels maybe are on lesser meds? I do wish the Prevent COVID study provided a breakdown of where people landed on the antibody spectrum based on the types of meds they were taking. That would be interesting to see.
 
@dreamintwilight
For my kiddo
Takes Stelara high dose (90 mg every 4 weeks ) plus mtx
And a second IL-1 biologic for an auto inflammatory condition
And has been on Uceris foam since July ???
Wow! I’m also on high dose Humira (weekly
as opposed to every other week) + 75-100mg azathioprine daily.

It would be nice to know if there was a specific trend in terms of antibodies based on each medication type or combination. Like, is it possible for someone else taking the same type of meds as me to have antibody levels as high as your kiddo’s and I’m just one of the unlucky ones who have low counts? ;) Or are certain meds just more likely to cause much lower antibodies? I know we still have no idea if there is a specific threshold to indicate protection either, but I cant help but wish my levels were much higher since thats the only piece of data we have to look at so far!
 

Lisa

Adminstrator
Staff member
Location
New York, USA
Wow, so I knew my antibodies were low to begin with (thanks Humira + AZA!), but seeing how high some of your antibody levels were is amazing!

My initial antibodies were 3.4 after 2 doses and after 3 doses is now 14.:confused:

I’m assuming mine is so low due to being on combination meds that suppress my immune system and those of you with higher levels maybe are on lesser meds? I do wish the Prevent COVID study provided a breakdown of where people landed on the antibody spectrum based on the types of meds they were taking. That would be interesting to see.
I'm on Remicade - 5 mg/kg with no other meds (Imuran/6mp etc).....
 
I'm on Remicade - 5 mg/kg with no other meds (Imuran/6mp etc).....
Thanks, Lisa. Seems my particular med combo is pretty suppressing compared to others. 😟 I was hoping to hear from others on here enrolled in the studies also on Humira to see how it varies, but haven't heard from too many participants overall.
 
Good Grief.

I have to request a new lab slip from Johns Hopkins so that I can go back to LabCorp to have my last blood draw for their study.

I went to LabCorp after my first vaccination, ( which was in April ) but did not return after my 2nd vaccination ( which was in May ) because I lost my slip, over a month had passed and because of the crowded waiting rooms at the labs ( I stayed away from crowds due to Covid.)

Now I have had my 3rd vaccine ( in September ) and all of a sudden today I receive an e-mail from Johns Hopkins regarding their study.
I will be requesting a new slip so I can get my second LabCorp blood draw to check antibodies.

I was on Humira for over 3 years and my last Humira Injection was Oct 7th.
I started Budesonide and MTX in May.
And I just had my Stelara infusion on Oct 29th.

After my first blood draw I received a paper in the mail from Johns Hopkins that said I did have antibodies but the paper did not include the number.
How did you guys get your exact number ? Did you pay to have your antibodies tested ?

Take Care 🦋
 
Good Grief.

I have to request a new lab slip from Johns Hopkins so that I can go back to LabCorp to have my last blood draw for their study.

I went to LabCorp after my first vaccination, ( which was in April ) but did not return after my 2nd vaccination ( which was in May ) because I lost my slip, over a month had passed and because of the crowded waiting rooms at the labs ( I stayed away from crowds due to Covid.)

Now I have had my 3rd vaccine ( in September ) and all of a sudden today I receive an e-mail from Johns Hopkins regarding their study.
I will be requesting a new slip so I can get my second LabCorp blood draw to check antibodies.

I was on Humira for over 3 years and my last Humira Injection was Oct 7th.
I started Budesonide and MTX in May.
And I just had my Stelara infusion on Oct 29th.

After my first blood draw I received a paper in the mail from Johns Hopkins that said I did have antibodies but the paper did not include the number.
How did you guys get your exact number ? Did you pay to have your antibodies tested ?

Take Care 🦋
The Prevent COVID study sends a copy of the Labcorp results directly to study participants. So I got a secure email from UNC that had the document attached with the exact numbers. Tests are paid for by the study, so no payment was required from me (they told us to indicate a third party was paying at checkin).

The first time, I printed a copy of the lab order to bring with me, but was told Labcorp should have a copy in their system they could look up. I’m glad I did because their whole system was down when I went in for my lab draw so they wouldnt have been able to look it up for me if I hadnt had the physical copy with me. The 2nd time, I didnt receive a copy I could print and was told Labcorp had it in their system already. I was so worried I’d show up and the system would be down again, but thankfully everything went smoothly.

I wonder if you could contact someone with the Johns Hopkins study to find out if you can get a copy of the Labcorp results. Or if you created an account on Labcorp’s website, I wonder if that would give you access to the results through their system directly.
 

my little penguin

Moderator
Staff member
If you create a patient portal in labcorp you will get the results but only if was created before the blood draw I believe
Labcorp has a digtsl
Copy of all doc orders including the unc one
 
I'm in the John Hopkins Study.

My first Covid vaccine was in April, second in May and third in September. 💉
I have the full report from my LabCorp blood draw in May. I have an e-mail, but no official report from my recent blood draw.
I am in shock over these numbers. 😲

During the past two weeks I have had a Stelara Infusion, a Reclast Infusion, two blood draws and a flu shot. 😳
 

Attachments

Lisa

Adminstrator
Staff member
Location
New York, USA
I'm in the John Hopkins Study.

My first Covid vaccine was in April, second in May and third in September. 💉
I have the full report from my LabCorp blood draw in May. I have an e-mail, but no official report from my recent blood draw.
I am in shock over these numbers. 😲

During the past two weeks I have had a Stelara Infusion, a Reclast Infusion, two blood draws and a flu shot. 😳
I've been informed by LabCorp that they are no longer providing antibody levels to the patient for the JH study.....
 
My son had a positive home COVID-19 test this morning after 3 doses of Moderna; he only takes a normal dose of Inflectra for Crohn's. He previously had an antibody test done locally which showed a normal level of antibodies with the caveat that they couldn't say that he was immune.
 
Location
San Diego
My son had a positive home COVID-19 test this morning after 3 doses of Moderna; he only takes a normal dose of Inflectra for Crohn's. He previously had an antibody test done locally which showed a normal level of antibodies with the caveat that they couldn't say that he was immune.
Yes, unfortunately breakthrough infections after vaccination are a real thing. My daughter caught COVID some months after being fully vaccinated with the Pfizer vaccine. But like most breakthrough cases, the infection was mild and did not require hospitalization - which is what the vaccines continue to prevent at a high rate even after the antibody levels have started to drop.
 
The booster was a month ago so I can’t attribute this breakthrough case to waning antibody levels.
It was a home test but he now has a pending PCR test.
The info on the home test says very very few false positives. There are many false negatives.
 
Location
San Diego
The booster was a month ago so I can’t attribute this breakthrough case to waning antibody levels.
True enough. The COVID vaccines have never been 100% effective. The best they ever scored in trials was around 95% effective. So that means out of every 100 cases observed in the trials, 5 of them occured in people who, like your son, were recently fully vaccinated. But still, 95% effective is a huge win and provides a very useful tool in controlling the infection.

The first vaccines developed for any disease are usually far less effective than that. But they ususally get better over time as the vaccine scientists get better at figuring out the types, formulations, and doses that work the best.
 
The latest research out of israel is showing an order of magnitude more antibodies after a booster as compared to after the second dose. There's also a t-cell vaccine in development that would offer long-lasting protection to supplement the current ones
 
The booster reduces the chances of infection by 80% and the whole series otherwise both reduces the severity keeps me alive quite reliably if I do get infected, so, yeah, absolutely. If it's every six months until they finish developing the t-cell vaccine that provides longer-lasting immunity, so be it. Small price to pay for not wrecking my lungs, heart and brain. Gonna get the bacterial pneumonia vaccine early next year, too, and if need be after I check if I still have antibodies, an MMR booster.
 

my little penguin

Moderator
Staff member
The thing to note
Crohns itself does not increase the risk but the immunosuppressants and biologics taken by most crohns patients makes them immunocompromised
This Increases the risk of opportunistic infections
This means the person is not more likely to catch a cold ,the flu ,or Covid etc….
But once they catch a virus they don’t have reserves left
That means secondary infections that a normal person can easily fight off afterwards an immunocompromised person does not
So they are more likely to get severe pneumonia etc…

so everyone around my child has gotten all of the shots (Covid flu etc.. ) plus the boosters and will get anything else offered
My child has gotten three full doses and will get the booster 6 months after his last shot plus anything else recommended by his specialists
Anything to lower the risk -not eliminate

Some folks get flu alone and are fine
My child isn’t one of those. We have seen how hard his body has to fight for something as simple as the flu (before he ever got a flu shot at age 2 - it was beyond horrible to watch a child struggle to breath ) children can and do die from flu every year - small percentage but when it’s your child .
So for him the benefit of shot outweighs the risk
 
VAERS reports are enitrely unverified and aren't a reliable source, especially with the way they've been weaponized and flooded with bad info. The disclaimer on it specifically says, "The reports may contain information that is incomplete, inaccurate, coincidental, or unverifiable" https://www.reuters.com/article/factcheck-vaers-9318-idUSL1N2P21CV

Considering nothing's being harvested when vaccines are administered, that's unverifiable nonsense. It's not corporations I trust, it's the incentives in place - they can't keep siphoning our money if we're dead or unable to work, after all - and the scientists who've worked on this, and the 8.67 billion doses administered globally with roughly 20 verified deaths that I could find in all my research, either from an allergic reaction where rescue meds didn't work or from blood clots before we knew the very specific type of blood clots they could cause and that need a completely different treatment from common ones. Even if every single report in VAERS were true, though, you'd still be roughly 350 times more likely to die of COVID, even without counting the likely undercounted COVID deaths. If I calculate it from the best available estimate from modeling, it would go up to being about 1200 times more likely. I can't stop you from doing anything, but you're sowing doubt and spreading misinformation that leads to bad risk assessment.

Talk to your doctor - that's the only part of all that I can agree with.
 
Top