# The Fungus-Yeast Connection



## PollyH

I agree that the production of D-lactic acid by the intestinal bacteria is quite detrimental. I also agree that the exposure to LPS from gram negative bacteria is very inflammatory. Those two problems --- excess D-lactic acid and exposure to LPS --- are at the heart of the intestinal problems suffered by people with Small Bowel Bacterial Overgrowth (SIBO).  (I'm a moderator on a SIBO group. We are talking about Crohn's, right now, so I stopped by your group to see what the connection was to Crohn's.)   

I believe the inflammation characteristic of Crohn's can initiate a case of SIBO. Also, I think SIBO can alter hormones and the immune system in such a way as to make a case of Crohn's more serious. Yet, there must be something else unique going on with Crohn's, or all the people with SIBO would be showing up with Crohn's and colitis.  

From what I've read, it is the way the immune system deals with yeast / fungus that is unique to Crohn's and colitis. There is an increased load of yeast / fungus in those with Crohn's and colitis, partly because the immune system is having a difficult time removing it. For instance, the MAP bacteria interfere with the removal of yeast by macrophages. This interference increases inflammation. 

A lack of Dectin-1 has been associated with increased severity of colitis in humans and mice. A lack of Dectin-1 can be genetic, and a lack of this has been shown to interfere with the removal of yeast by macrophages. This immune weakness increases inflammation. When you induce colitis in dectin-1 deficient mice, the colitis isn't as severe if you give an anti-fungal. 

The AIEC bacteria replicates within macrophages. I would assume that this would also interfere with the removal of yeast by macrophages. 

There is a full text article available for free that talks about colitis and an impairment in the ability of the macrophages to remove yeast/fungus. Here is the link and a quote.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3432565/ 

"Fungi are recognized by a number of immune receptors among which Dectin-1 has emerged as key for phagocytosis and killing by myeloid phagocytes. Dectin-1 is a C-type lectin receptor that recognizes β-1,3-glucans found in the cell walls of nearly all fungi. Dectin-1 activates intracellular signals through CARD9 leading to inflammatory cytokine production and induction of T helper 17 (Th17) immune responses (10-13). Deficiencies in either Dectin-1 or CARD9 result in enhanced susceptibility to pathogenic fungal infections in humans and mice (14-16). Polymorphic variants in the gene for CARD9 are strongly associated with Crohn’s disease and ulcerative colitis in humans (17, 18). Furthermore, anti-Saccharomyces cerevisiae antibodies (ASCA) against yeast mannan have been strongly associated with Crohn’s disease (19, 20). Together, these later findings suggest a possible link between immune responses to commensal fungi and intestinal disease."


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## nitty

Speaking as a lay person, and not very scientifically knowledgable, please can you explain how, if CD is caused by a weakened immune system, how is it that drugs which suppress the immune system then improve my symptoms?

Please note: I am not asking this to doubt your information, it's just that I don't really understand how it works.


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## Spooky1

Interesting stuff here!  I have major dental issues and have had since crohns started.  Just out of interest does too much lactic acid cause extreme muscle fatigue?  not sure on this, but perhaps someone can answer for me.

thanks


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## PollyH

nitty said:


> Speaking as a lay person, and not very scientifically knowledgable, please can you explain how, if CD is caused by a weakened immune system, how is it that drugs which suppress the immune system then improve my symptoms?


There are different parts of the immune system. It is like one part is yelling fire, fire, help, help, and the other part isn't strong enough to put out the fire. So, the first part just keeps yelling louder and louder and causing more inflammation. Your doctor then gives you something to control the inflammation. Your doctor often doesn't have a drug to give you that will put out the fire on a permanent basis. However, you can change your body chemistry such that it is able to put out most fires.

When there is yeast overgrowth, the humoral arm of the immune system tends to be over-active and the cellular arm of the immune system tends to be too weak to remove the yeast. When the humoral arm of the immune system is overactive, you often end up with allergies and inflammation. When the cellular immune system is underactive, the body has a hard time getting rid of yeast and certain other infections.

To get rid of yeast, you want to improve the strength of the cellular immune system. One way to do this is to bring up the energy of the cells. Anything you can do to improve the energy producing capacity of your cells should help. This means making sure the cells have vitamins, minerals, and amino acids in the correct balance; making sure the cells have fuel and enough thyroid to produce energy; and making sure there aren't too many heavy metals and toxins in the body that may throw a monkey wrench into the energy making machinery. 

Unfortunately, yeast and bacteria create toxins that interfere with your vitamins, minerals, amino acids, and fuel. They are smart. They don't want your cellular immune system to be too strong. Yeast go about this in some very devious ways. For one thing, they create Prostaglandin PGE2, which increases inflammation and increases the body's production of estrogen. Estrogen lowers thyroid and cellular immunity. Estrogen encourages the growth of yeast. Yeast even create estradiol, a strong estrogen.

Yeast also interfere with your body's absorption of coenzyme Q10. They take the coenzyme Q10 in your food, and turn it into a different form --- one that they can use, but not you. Coenzyme Q10 / ubiquinol is one of the things you need for cellular energy. 

Yeast also create acetaldehyde. The acetaldehyde really does a number on your body. Have you ever felt like you couldn't think easily? That could be due to the yeast's acetaldehyde lowering your acetylcholine. With lowered acetylcholine, you have difficulty thinking, your vagus nerve isn't able to trigger proper digestive actions, your spleen isn't activated to produce anti-inflammatory substances, and you feel tired.

The acetaldehyde also interferes with the body's ability to turn vitamin B6 into its active form (pyridoxal-5-phosphate, or P5P). Acetaldehyde causes you to dump the amino acid taurine into your urine. The acetaldehyde interferes with your ability to create methyl-folate. You need the methyl-folate to turn your niacin into its active forms of NAD and NADH. These are needed for energy production and clear thinking. You also need the methyl-folate for clearing toxins out of your body. You need the methyl-folate to create your neurotransmitters, like serotonin and dopamine. The acetaldehyde interferes with the creation of your Tregs which are needed to help calm things down after an infection.

The acetaldehyde also lowers your cholesterol. You might say good, finally something good about the acetaldehyde that is produced by yeast. Nope. Not so fast. The cholesterol protects your body from the toxins generated in your gut. The cholesterol helps your body eliminate things like strep, staph and TB. Cholesterol is needed for your T cell formation. Cholesterol is also very important for your brain's functioning. If your total cholesterol drops below 160, you can get sick, depressed and not able to think well.  Here is a video on why you want your cholesterol levels above 160 mg/dl. http://vimeo.com/12616011  If need be, you can purchase supplements of cholesterol to help bring it up. Vitamin C, fruit and coconut oil can be helpful in bringing cholesterol levels up. (Coconut oil will lower high cholesterol, but bring up cholesterol when it is too low.)

The acetaldehyde breaks down elastin. (It activates MMP-9) The acetaldehyde attaches to / forms adducts with your neurotransmitters like serotonin, dopamine and norepinephrine, making them unavailable for your use. The acetaldehyde gets rid of your asparagine, alpha ketoglutaric acid, glutamine and glutamate. The acetladehyde alters your ratio of NAD/NADH, which are forms of niacin.

To get rid of the yeast / fungus on a permanent basis, you need to get rid of the reason it started and correct all the imbalances and nutritional deficiencies it created. 

I used to have yeast overgrowth in my intestines. Fortunately, I never got Crohn's like my cousin did. However, the yeast overgrowth has been the bane of my life. That is why I've studied it and tried so many different things to get rid of it. If it wouldn't be too forward, in another post, I will outline some ideas that may help keep fungus / yeast levels down in the body. Is that acceptable on this list? If not, I can just give you some links to look at.


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## PollyH

Spooky1 said:


> Just out of interest does too much lactic acid cause extreme muscle fatigue?  thanks


Yes. Lactic acid will increase muscle fatigue. The lactic acid may be coming from the gut. It can also be manufactured locally if the cells are having trouble getting enough oxygen and creating energy.

Do you have fibromyalgia? People with fibromyalgia have muscle pain, joint pain, and trouble sleeping. There are tender trigger points near areas where blood flow may be restricted. There is fibrin formation that may be interfering with circulation. According to the work of Dr. Pimentel, his fibromyalgia patients had very bad cases of Small Bowel Bacterial Overgrowth (SIBO).  The small intestine is not supposed to have a lot of bacteria in it. However, if there is an overgrowth of bacteria there, the bacteria get to your food before you do. They turn your carbohydrates into D-lactic acid.

With fibromyalgia, a person is exposed to excessive serotonin in its free state. This increases fibrin formation. In general, to control the way serotonin is used, and to reduce fibrin formation, Raymond Peat suggests the following:  magnesium, niacinamide, taurine, glycine, saturated fats, thyroid hormone, antihistamines, antioxidants and other anti-inflammatory agents to help reduce or reverse fibrogenic processes. 

I would like to add, that you will need methyl-folate to use your niacinamide. The methyl-folate may be low due to mercury, acetaldehyde from yeast, or a genetic polymorphism of the MTHFr gene. There is a lot of information about MTHFr and the various forms of folate at mthfr.net

I'm presently a moderator at a yahoo group called SIBOnation. If you have fibromyalgia, join us and ask a few questions.


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## Beach

PollyH said:


> I used to have yeast overgrowth in my intestines. Fortunately, I never got Crohn's like my cousin did. However, the yeast overgrowth has been the bane of my life. That is why I've studied it and tried so many different things to get rid of it. If it wouldn't be too forward, in another post, I will outline some ideas that may help keep fungus / yeast levels down in the body. Is that acceptable on this list? If not, I can just give you some links to look at.


Nice post, and I'd find it interesting to learn further about the nutrient robbing properties yeast can bring about, along with ways to deal with it.  Along similar lines, something I've taken an interest in of late is learning about anti-nutrients found in different foods, such as wheat, beans, nightshades, etc.


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## PollyH

Ihurt said:


> I  I also have a disease of the bladder called interstitial cystits in which "they" say is autoimmune. But oddly enough, I only get relief while on certain antibiotics! I have had to be on low dose antibitoics for over 4 years now as that is the ONLY thing that brings me relief.


I know someone who got rid of her interstitial cystitis by clearing up her gut. I think it is because certain bacteria create toxins that affect the tight junctions (cause leaky gut). Those toxins show up in the urine. I assume they do the same thing to the bladder. However, most people with IC say it is due to high oxylates in their urine. You can get your urine tested for oxlylates at the Great Plains Laboratory. The oxalates are created by certain bacteria and yeast. It is a fairly common problem in autism. There is a low oxalate diet that some of the kids with autism must follow. If you join one of their lists, you can find out what they do about it. For instance, right now, the best probiotic to use is VSL#3 for this condition. Later, they are hoping for a better one. 20 minutes before a meal, you take some calcium and magnesium taurate or citrate. The minerals will combine with the oxylates in your food and those created by the bacteria / yeast.

Here is a video by Dr. Kurt Woeller on the subject of oxalates and what to do about them. It is available for free for the next few days.

Chronic Pain, Fibromyalgia Autism and the Oxalate Connection (1 hr 10 
min) 
http://www.greatplainslaboratory.com/home/eng/recorded_webinars.asp 

It will be removed shortly from this webpage. When that happens, it will still be available, but you need to pay for it at www.AutismSeminarsonDemand.com


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## PollyH

Beach said:


> Nice post, and I'd find it interesting to learn further about the nutrient robbing properties yeast can bring about, along with ways to deal with it.  Along similar lines, something I've taken an interest in of late is learning about anti-nutrients found in different foods, such as wheat, beans, nightshades, etc.


This is my current understanding of things that will help eliminate yeast overgrowth. This isn’t a perfect list, especially since I’m not that familiar with Crohn’s and colitis. The list doesn’t represent medical advice. Use the list with caution and with the advice of your physician.

This list of remedies is based mainly on replacing the nutrients that yeast deplete, and removing the factors that contribute to yeast overgrowth. However, you may not tolerate everything on this list. There are genetics to consider and past toxin exposures. So, this list needs to be used with some testing and/or experimentation in mind. Slowly introduce a supplement that seems to be what you need. Then if you feel worse, stop and try something different on the list. Later, you may be able to tolerate the original supplement. Everything needs balance.    

I believe a general strategy for controlling yeast should address the following: 

1.	Remove much of the fuel for yeast growth, acetaldehyde production, and biofilm production. 
2.	Repair the nutritional damage caused by the yeast’s acetaldehyde.
3.	Soak up the acetaldehyde before it does additional damage.
4.	Remove heavy metals and toxins that encourage yeast growth.
5.	Reduce the size of yeast colonies with the use of antifungals and things to degrade their biofilms.
6.	Alter the environment in the intestines to discourage yeast colonization.  
7.	Remove viruses, bacteria and parasites that interfere with the body’s ability to attack and control the yeast.  
8.	Support thyroid, liver and kidney function to help eliminate toxins.
9.	Support the cellular immune system. 

LIMIT SUGAR AND CARBOHYDRATES

These allow the yeast to flourish and to create their acetaldehyde. Don’t eliminate sugars and carbohydrates completely though. Your body needs them. In particular, it would be very hard on the kidneys if you eliminated sugar and carbohydrates altogether. Besides, cutting out all sugar and carbohydrates would not kill the yeast. Yeast can live on fat and protein. If your upper intestine is clear, then you may be able to tolerate more sugars than someone else. Thyroid and natural progesterone will help your intestines absorb the sugars, leaving less for the bacteria and yeast.

RESTRICT INTAKE OF POLYUNSATURATED OILS

These increase yeast growth in low oxygen environments like the intestines. Polyunsaturated oils also encourage the formation of yeast biofilms. However, a small amount of fish oil and / or primrose oil may be of some help even though they are polyunsaturated. Use mainly saturated and monosaturated oils. Use mainly olive oil, coconut oil, palm oil and organic butter. (Animals store pesticides in their fat. That is why you want organic butter.) Get organic grass fed butter if possible, because the butter from grass fed animals will contain the anti-inflammatory vitamin K2.

FAT SOLUBLE VITAMINS (A, D, E AND K2)

These work best when kept in balance. These are all anti-inflammatory and they help to improve the gut flora. In particular, vitamin K2 lowers PGE2. Yeast create PGE2. You don’t want excess PGE2 because it increases the body’s production of estrogen and encourages yeast growth. (If you don’t tolerate vitamin A, you might want to change brands and/ or try some zinc first.) 

REDUCE ESTROGEN EXPOSURE

Birth control pills are notorious for causing yeast overgrowth. So, if possible, get rid of them. However, I realize that with Crohn’s sometimes the birth control pills are helpful. I don’t fully understand that.

Many women who are ill have an imbalance between estrogen and progesterone. During the last two weeks of a woman’s cycle, one will often find an excess of estrogen relative to progesterone. This encourages yeast growth. (Dr. John Lee has several books about this. There is also a good book by Raymond Peat, PhD about this.)

There was an experiment done with mice. They removed the ovaries, then they treated one group with estrogen and the other group with natural progesterone. Those treated with estrogen got yeast infections. Those treated with progesterone did not. So, to balance a woman’s hormones, you might think it safe to give some natural progesterone during the last two weeks of her cycle. However, anecdotal evidence suggests that when this is first tried, there may be an initial flare of yeast symptoms. I’m speculating that this many have to do with the progesterone pushing stored estrogen out of cells. (When progesterone goes in, estrogen comes out mainly in the sulfated form.) 

You need the sulfates for the estrogen to leave the cells and get transported to the liver for disposal. If you are low on sulfates, you might have some trouble with adding in the natural progesterone.

I believe natural progesterone can be helpful if there is an estrogen / progesterone imbalance. However, I would start with correcting a thyroid problem first, assuming it exists. Correcting the thyroid should help correct the estrogen / progesterone ratio. If the adrenals are weak, you may need to add the progesterone, since natural progesterone is very good support for the adrenals.

Stop using the artificial progesterone shot for birth control. This shot contains a form of progesterone that is foreign to the body. It ends up reducing your indigenous levels of natural progesterone. This creates an imbalance between natural progesterone and estrogen in the body. (Natural progesterone is the kind of progesterone that the body produces. It is different than the kind of progesterone found in the birth control shot and in most pharmaceuticals.) 

Pesticides and plastics are also estrogen-like. Remove as much of them as possible from the diet. Stop using styrofoam cups for your hot drinks. They are a source of estrogen like compounds. Be careful with herbs that contain phytoestrogens. Large amounts of phytoestrogens are just as bad as estrogen.

CALCIUM-D-GLUCARATE

If you also have Small Intestine Bacterial Overgrowth (SIBO), consider using calcium-d-glucarate to counteract the bacteria’s effect on your body’s elimination system. Calcium-d-glucarate helps the body eliminate excess estrogen by blocking an enzyme that the SIBO bacteria create. Gradually work up the dose of calcium-d-glucarate to 3 pills, three times a day, with your meals. If you wish to stop the calcium-d-glucarate, do so gradually to avoid a spike in estrogen.

THYROID

This helps keep estrogen levels under control. It also improves the immune system and helps the body get rid of the yeast. It is often low when one has yeast overgrowth. (For one reason, the yeast’s production of acetaldehyde interferes with the g proteins signaling of the thyroid gland.) Read about thyroid first and then seek an alternative doctor for a trial of natural thyroid. (Broda Barnes, MD has a good introductory book called Hypothyroidism: the Unsuspected Illness.)

NIACINAMIDE

This disrupts the growth of yeast and their creation of biofilms. Byron Richards, ND, has found that 250 mg to 1000 mg is helpful for his yeast patients. The niacinamide may also help control anxiety. 

METHYL-FOLATE

The creation of methyl-folate is hampered by the yeast toxin acetaldehyde. You need methyl-folate to provide the methyl groups to process the niacinamide into its active NAD and NADH forms. Methyl-folate is also important for blood flow in the brain and peripheral circulation. Methyl-folate is the only form of folate that crosses the blood brain barrier. There it is needed to create your neurotransmitters. 

INOSITOL AND CHOLINE

These don’t directly help get rid of the yeast. Instead, they help balance the effects of niacinamide on the body. Choline may be low if the body hasn’t had enough methyl-folate for a while. The body will use your choline to provide methyl groups if it doesn’t have the methyl-folate. Inositol tends to increase movement in the intestines. Niacinamide tends to slow things down. You need a proper balance of these two vitamins for proper motor control.

PANTETHINE AND MOLYBDENUM

These help the body dispose of acetaldehyde. The pantethine also helps your body create taurine and acetylcholine. The acetylcholine is important for cognition, for stomach acid production, and for the functioning of the vagus nerve. Pantethine also helps create coenzyme A. Coenzyme A is important for energy production and for the detoxification of acetaldehyde. Byron Richards, ND, has found that pantethine is particularly helpful in eliminating yeast overgrowth. The pantethine is also helpful in increasing the growth of Bifido bacteria.  Here is an important quote from a excellent article on using pantethine and molybdenum to remove acetaldehyde. 

“Dr. Cooter and Dr. Schmtt suggest 300 micrograms of Molybdenum in three divided doses per day, and further suggests staying on it for at least 4 months" http://www.candidapage.com/aldehyde.shtml 

THEANINE

This is found in tea, but you can also get pills of it. Theanine accelerates the liver’s removal of acetaldehyde. It also protects the liver by reducing the liver’s loss of glutathione. Theanine has a calming / anti-anxiety effect for many who try this. http://www.lef.org/magazine/mag2006/jan2006_report_theanine_01.htm 

MSM SULFUR

Many people have found this helpful. This kills yeast and certain parasites. MSM will also help your body replace the sulfur that the yeast toxin acetaldehyde has removed. Start slow and gradually work up to more. Be consistent. MSM crystals are supposedly best. 

MSM should be balanced with other minerals, including zinc, copper, molybdenum, selenium and calcium. (Eg, if you take a lot of sulfur, then you may need more copper, molybdenum, selenium and calcium.) However, if you are low on sulfur, your body will substitute selenium for some of the usual purposes of sulfur. Hence low sulfur may mean you are also low on selenium.  

MSM isn’t always tolerated. Sometimes this occurs if one is mercury poisoned. If this happens, try sulfates instead. (Epsom salt baths are a source of sulfates. Before embarking on these baths, test your bathtub to make sure your tub glaze does not have lead in it.) If you don’t tolerate MSM, you might want to try some molybdenum first. It might help you tolerate the MSM.

PANCREATIC and DIGESTIVE ENZYMES

This helps to break up yeast biofilms, and it helps you to digest your food. Many people find this helpful. Be careful with the “plant enzymes” or the enzymes that are not from dried pancreas. These enzymes are made using a mold. You may be allergic. Be especially careful if you have asthma.

COPPER / ZINC RATIO

If you don’t know your zinc / copper ratio, it would probably be best to take both these minerals along with a little manganese. The usual supplementation ratio is one part copper to between seven and fourteen parts zinc. The Great Plains Laboratory has a test for the ratio of zinc to copper, and it also measures the amount of bound and unbound copper.

ZINC

Zinc is often low. One reason is that the aldehydes from yeast will release zinc from protein sites. Estrogen also wastes zinc. You need the zinc for healthy intestines, including the ability to transport the vitamin A from the liver. However, be careful with the amount of zinc you use. If your zinc goes too high, you are more likely to have trouble with yeast growth. Too much zinc can also be a problem because it may lower copper, iron, manganese and molybdenum levels too far. A convenient, albeit not perfect, way to monitor zinc is with Zinc Tally by Metagenics. To increase your zinc levels, consider using the Metagentics Zinc Drink, as this liquid form is easier for your body to absorb. 

COPPER

Copper is often high. If copper is high, then you can use vitamin C, zinc, sulfur, B6 and/or molybdenum to bring copper levels down. Cysteine will also lower copper, but it is important not to use cysteine for this purpose, at least not at first. Cysteine supplementation may make you sick if copper levels are quite high. Cysteine sometimes will increase yeast growth. Like with other minerals, balance is key. Not too much copper and not too little. You need copper for many purposes in the body. If copper is low, a good way to bring it up, in my opinion, is with copper bound to sebacate. For me personally, copper measured low, but I got worse when I took plain copper. Yet, copper sebacate made me healthier. This form is easier for your cells to use. Liver is a good source of copper and the B vitamins your body needs to use the copper.

CAREFUL WITH CYSTEINE

Cysteine attaches to acetaldehyde. It is very protective for this reason. However, some people have noticed that a supplement of cysteine increases yeast growth in them. Cysteine may not be tolerated if you are high in copper.  

VITAMIN C

Most of the time, high dose vitamin C can be helpful when you have yeast overgrowth. Vitamin C counters the oxidative stress caused by the yeast’s acetaldehyde. Vitamin C also helps lower histamine, which may be high due to the allergies associated with yeast overgrowth. 

However, caution is warranted with high dose vitamin C if you also have high oxalates along with high free copper. It may make the oxalate problem worse. A moderate amount of vitamin C would be fine in this situation though.

MAGNESIUM

This is very important for many functions in the body. It may be low because of the lack of taurine and because magnesium is poorly absorbed when the gut is inflamed. (Taurine helps you retain magnesium. Taurine is lost due to the yeast.)

LOW OXYLATE DIET  

This diet may be necessarily if your urinary oxalate level is high. Oxalates lower your biotin and interfere with your coenzyme A. Coenzyme A is already quite low due to the yeast’s acetaldehyde. (Coenzyme A is not related to vitamin A. It is a substance needed for energy production and to create acetylcholine.) If you have high oxylates, join one of the discussion lists that talk about this problem. One of the things you can do is take your magnesium and calcium in the form of citrate or taurate. Using these minerals 20 minutes before a meal will help bind / mop up oxylates.  

CHOLESTEROL

Get enough cholesterol in your diet. Cholesterol protects the body from bacterial toxins generated in the gut. It helps kill staph, strep and tuberculosis. It helps create T cells. It is needed for the formation of bile and for the creation of all your hormones. The body doesn’t function well if the cholesterol blood levels drop below 160 mg/dl. When rats are injected with the yeast toxin acetaldehyde, their cholesterol levels drop.

ELIMINATE H. PYLORI

The H. pylori keeps you from creating stomach acid. The stomach acid helps you to get rid of yeast. Unfortunately, you can’t just add in a stomach acid supplement when you have H. pylori, because that may make the infection worse. (You need to work on the H. pylori and the yeast at the same time, since H. pylori can hide within yeast.) 

Often the tests for H. pylori don't find it, even though it is present. So, doctors sometimes resort to checking for H. pylori markers. For instance, H. pylori gets rid of your manganese, lithium, copper, iron, B12, carnitine, phospholipids and arginine. If some of these are low, your doctor's suspicions might be raised. (Some of these markers might still look normal for various reasons.) There is also possible high readings of ammonia, seberic or taurine. Cadmium and bismuth readings may be high, even without chelation.

H. pylori can hide within yeast cells. So, part of your strategy for eliminating H. pylori should include reducing the yeast population. Lactoferrin is useful here because it helps break up yeast biofilms and it stops the growth of H. pylori. Adding in lactoferrin to your usual triple antibiotic treatment improves the outcome considerably. When you take lactoferrin along with the triple antibiotics, you have a 92% cure rate compared to a 71% cure rate without it.

Two antifungal drugs, Diflucan and Nizoral are also particularly useful. Diflucan and Nizoral kill many types of yeast and they also kill H. pylori. (We often think of antifungals as only killing yeast and fungus, but they also have some antibacterial properties.)

Taking some bicarbonates along with your therapy also helps with the eradication of the H. pylori. The bicarbonates disorient the H. pylori and make them more vulnerable.

Glycine is inexpensive, and might be of use here too. 

"When combined with amoxicillin, a common generic antibiotic, glycine reduced by a factor of 10 the amount of amoxicillin needed to kill the troublesome bacteria."

http://www.lifeextensionvitamins.com/glpoforinand.html 

There is a whole host of things you can use to get rid of H. pylori without resorting to prescription antibiotics. In this long video, Dr. Amy Yasko explains the nature of H. pylori infection and how to get rid of it. 

http://www.dramyyasko.com/resources/webisodes/h-pylori-another-piece-to-the-puzzle/

Her protocol for getting rid of H. pylori can become quite involved. However, from the lecture, I gather that the basic components are the following:

1. Baking soda or Bicarbonates with each meal.

2. Peptimycin (contains mastic gum from the pistachio tree) 

3. HELX RNA from www.holisticheal.com/microbial-helx.html 

4. Air Power (Guafenesin, an over-the-counter cough medication)

5. Range of specific enzymes

6. Range of very specific normal flora probiotics

If you want to know more about this, it is probably best to join the discussion group for Dr. Amy Yasko’s protocols. I get the impression that there can be a lot more to this. 

GENETICALLY MODIFIED FOOD 

Avoid food that has been genetically modified. Doctors and scientists have found that these foods increase gut inflammation and are more likely to cause allergies. The Roundup pesticide, which is used on most of these GMO foods, is also particularly hard on the gut.  Doctors who tell their patients to remove these GMO foods are getting faster improvements in their patients with gut problems. Later, the patients are able to reintroduce these foods in their natural non-GMO form without relapsing.

Currently, in the United States, food that has been genetically modified is not labeled as such. However, there is a way to avoid using it. Almost all the corn and soy grown in the USA is genetically modified. So, don’t eat corn or soy unless it is labeled organic. (Organic products are not genetically modified.) Sugar beets, crook neck squash, zucchini, and papaya might also be genetically modified unless they are labeled organic. Canola and cotton seed oils are often from genetically modified plants. Don’t eat them.

Here is a link to a video talking about how the Roundup pesticide and genetically modified foods can cause SIBO. Roundup and GM food can cause an increase in allergies, leaky gut, Clostridia and E. coli overgrowth, and gluten intolerance. Also Roundup and GM foods can cause a decrease in pancreatic enzymes, a decrease in the ability to detoxify, and a decrease in fat soluble vitamins. (Roundup interferes with CCK, which then causes less bile release or gallbladder stasis. Without the release of bile, the liver can’t get rid of toxins and the intestines can absorb fat soluble vitamins.) 

The Roundup pesticide kills off bacteria in the gut, but leaves Clostridia and E. coli alone. Thus, when you are exposed to this pesticide, Clostridia and E. coli will have less competition; and you are more likely to end up with an overgrowth of Clostridia or E. coli bacteria. This could make you quite ill. They have already seen an increased problem with Clostridia overgrowth in animals fed Roundup ready plants. I wonder if that is why our hospitals are dealing with an increased problem with Clostridia. 

http://vimeo.com/51259453

STOMACH ACID 

This will help eliminate yeast. However, don’t supplement with this if you have H. pylori. 

BENFOTIAMINE

This is a form of vitamin B1. It will help repair the nervous system. It is also anti-inflammatory, and it helps eliminate heavy metals. The yeast’s acetaldehyde has depleted vitamin B1. (Mercury will deplete this vitamin as well.) If you are low on vitamin B1, you may want to start replacing it slowly to allow the body a chance to get used to having it again.

TAURINE

This has been depleted by yeast. Start slow if you try this. It will release some toxins from storage. It has many benefits, including reducing allergic reactions and migraines. However, if you have H. pylori, taurine might be high. If you have certain genetics, taurine might be high. If you don’t tolerate taurine, start with some molybdenum to help your body convert possibly high taurine into sulfates.

UBIQUINOL OR COENZYME Q10

The absorption of this has been lowered by the presence of yeast. It will help you bring your cellular energy levels back up. Cellular energy is important for your cell mediated immune system. That is the arm of the immune system that fights yeast. I believe ubiquinol is usually a better supplement than coenzyme Q10.

ALPHA KETOGLUTARATE AND MALATE

These may be low. They are needed to bring your cellular energy back up. The alpha ketoglutarate doesn’t keep well, so don’t purchase more than you need for immediate use.

GELATIN

This will help repair the gut lining. However, not everyone can tolerate it.

COENZYME B6 (PYRIDOXAL-5-PHOSPHATE

This is low because of the yeast. It is important for many functions in the body, including energy production. It is delicate, so take it at a separate time from your other supplements.

ANTI-VIRALS

Some viruses alter your prostaglandin profile in such a way that encourages yeast growth. Therefore an anti-viral program may help you eliminate the yeast.

SELENIUM

Selenium will be low if you have mercury or certain viruses. The form of selenium called selenocysteine may be particularly low because the yeast toxin acetaldehyde lowers P5P. P5P is required for the enzymes that convert selenium into selenocysteine. Bringing your selenium levels back up will help your body convert thyroid into its active form. Selenium will also help eliminate certain viruses.

ELIMINATE HEAVY METALS

Mercury is notorious for causing yeast overgrowth. It interferes with the enzyme that removes the yeast’s acetaldehyde. Clean the mercury and other heavy metals out of the body. 

SUPPORT LIVER AND KIDNEYS

These organs help you eliminate toxins from your body. Toxins interfere with your ability to eliminate yeast. Saunas, homeopathics and mild exercise are some of the ways to eliminate the toxins.

BREAK UP YEAST BIOFILMS

These are shelters for infections / pathogens. More than one infection can coexist in a biofilm. Think of a biofilm as sticky substances secreted by the pathogens in which they hide. This is a shelter that your body can't easily attack. The shelter uses minerals for its structural stability and sticky stuff to hold it together. Sort of like building a house out of bricks and mortar. When the biofilm is broken up, sometimes there is a significant release of heavy metals that had been trapped in the biofilm. Sometimes that will trigger growth of yeast or other pathogens. Sometimes the person will experience a reaction to the pathogens that can now be recognized by the immune system. When using a biofilm removal protocol, one must be prepared for new symptoms and new pathogens that need to be treated.

If antibiotics and antifungals, and chelation doesn’t seem to be doing their job, then you need to go to the next step --- that is the removal of biofilms. This will make the antifungals, anti-virals, and antibiotics work better. Since biofilms can be harboring toxic metals, when you break these biofilms up, sometimes there will be a dramatic release of toxic metals that weren’t reached with simple chelation approaches.

There are several different biofilm removal protocols. They consist of enzymes and things to pull out minerals from the biofilms (EDTA or lactoferrin), followed by things to kill the organisms hiding in the biofilms, followed by things to absorb the toxins, metals and debri released. (A separation of anywhere from 20 minutes to two hours is used between each supplement.) However, before going on this full biofilm removal protocol, you need to test each product to see if it is tolerated. The first one to check is your tolerance to the absorptive materials. That way, if you have a bad reaction to one of the other products, you will have something safe to help stop the reaction.  

Here is a very good presentation on biofilms by Anju Usman, MD. www.scribd.com/doc/18583142/Gut-Rec...-Treating-Chronic-Gastrointestinal-Infections

Dr. Anju Usman suggests:

Products works best on an empty stomach

Start one supplement at a time, go slow

Do not give Enzymes on an empty stomach to patients with severe GI issues

Do not give lactoferrin to patients with dairy allergy

Avoid giving Iron, Calcium or Magnesium at same time

Here is a biofilm removal protocol that is loosely based on Dr. Kurt Woeller’s approach: 

1. Take enzyme products like nattokinase, lubrokinase, Interfase, Biofilm Defense, bromelain and/or chitosan. Sometimes add in lactoferrin and / or Na-EDTA (not Ca-EDTA).  

2. Thirty minutes later, take your anti-microbials. (Rotate the non-prescriptive anti-microbials every 5 days.)

3. One or two hours later, take absorptive products to mop up the toxins released.  (At first, I’d suggest that you start with less time in-between, for a more gentle protocol.)  Absorptive material may include charcoal, Pectasol (modified citrus pectin),Brown Algae, Destroxin zeolite, TruFiber (New Beginnings product), and / or apple pectin.

The amount of these products to take will depend on the individual.  Always start with a little and work up to more.  You don’t want to make yourself sick.  Here is a post by someone who tried too much at first. However, with time, she was able to tolerate a full dose of the products.   www.cpnhelp.org/interphaseplus_and_biofil 

Here is another biofilm removal protocol that mentions the use of homeopathics. This one is by Dr. Ettinger. 

www.advancedhealing.com/blog/2009/09/25/dr-ettingers-biofilm-protocol-for-lyme-and-gut-pathogens 

The interfase product is a mixture of enzymes. The biofilm Reduction Activity of InterFase ® has been documented invitro for these organisms:

Escherichia coli 

Staphylococcus aureus MRSA

Helicobacter pylori 

Streptococcus pneumoniae

Klebsiella pneumoniae 

Streptococcus pyogenes

Pseudomonas aeruginosa 

Candida paratropicalis

Staphylococcus aureus

FATS AND BIOFILM

Polyunsaturated fats provide the raw material for biofilm formation. Here is an excerpt from one of Byron Richard’s articles. In this article Byron is refuting someone’s assertion that stearic acid ( a saturated fatty acid) will increase biofilm formation. Saturated fats do not contribute to the biofilm.

http://www.wellnessresources.com/he...nesium_stearate/?source=Email&camp=news040909

“Biofilms are germ gangs.  They assemble based on a quorum-sensing signal, like a bell tolling in the field telling farmers to come to town and pick up weapons and go to war.  Biofilms in your digestive tract, such as Candida albicans biofilms or other bacterial biofilms are extremely problematic to human health.

These biofilm gangs need a fuel source to keep reproducing and growing. That fuel source is never a saturated fat because there is no point of biochemistry interaction in a saturated fat.

For example, a Candida albicans biofilm fuels its reproduction based on your intake of highly polyunsaturated fatty acids. This means that if you eat a bag of potato chips, corn chips, or French fries and you have a Candida biofilm, you just poured gas on the fire. Candida inserts oxygen molecules into the unsaturated bonds of the fatty acids (the more unsaturated bonds the better from Candida’s point of view) forming a highly toxic inflammatory signal called an oxylipin. Oxylipins are reproductive growth factors for the biofilm. It is technically impossible to insert an oxygen molecule into a saturated fat, which is why it is not possible for stearic acid to promote biofilm growth.”

PROBIOTICS

Use probiotics after you have eliminated protozoa. Some protozoa feed on probiotics. Add in some colostrum at the same time. 

ANTI-FUNGALS

Use anti-fungal herbs and prescriptions. If you first get a test to see which yeast is present, you can do a better job of choosing an effective anti-fungal. Often the lab will tell you which anti-fungal is most effective against your type of yeast. If you don’t have lab results, try one anti-fungal, and if it doesn’t help, try another.

CURCUMIN

This may be particularly helpful in that it is anti-inflammatory, kills yeast, and eliminates certain parasites. However, curcumin might reduce iron levels. You need enough iron, but not too much. If you are low on iron, lactoferrin is a good way to bring up iron levels without letting bacteria and pathogens get to the iron first. The lactoferrin also helps get rid of biofilms. 

BERBERINE

This is anti-fungal and it lowers blood sugar. If one is diabetic, this antifungal is a decent consideration. Be careful though. It may lower blood sugar too much.

IODINE

This has antifungal properties. However, it is very important to use the correct amount. Not too much and not too little. Also a steady small dose is easier on the body than occasional large doses. Unfortunately, the yeast toxin acetaldehyde reacts with iodine making the iodine unavailable for the enzymes in the body. The most accurate measurement of iodine is via urine.

COCONUT OIL, PALM OIL, LAURACIDIN

These kill yeast and some viruses. Start slowly. Don’t use more than a teaspoon per day to start. If you add the warmed oil to a grated carrot salad, the roughage will help bring the oil into the latter part of the intestines.

WONDRO

This is an old remedy that removes acetaldehyde and breaks up yeast biofilms. Wondro is something that can be made at home, so long as it is done in small batches. It has many strikingly good testimonials to its credit. However, I don’t have any personal experience with this. Here is a link to an old testimonial booklet and another link to a modern ebook about why Wondro works. 

http://www.scribd.com/doc/76584628/Wondro-Historical-Testimonials-Pamphlet 

http://www.scribd.com/doc/101099776/Wondro-Inside-Out


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## Beach

PollyH - Greatly appreciated, and thanks for taking the time give your thoughts on this!  I've printed the information out.  It will give me new future ideas to experiment with.


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## Spooky1

Polly, i think congratulations might be in order!  is that the longest post on Crohns forum?  lol, it will take me a while to assimilate that, think i shall print it out and go through it slowly.  But thanks a great deal for bothering to share information with us that haven't come across such research.


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## CeeCeeGo

WOW Polly - thanks for all that!
A lot of bedtime reading this week.


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## PollyH

I'm going to give you some more late night reading material.  I hope it is helpful.

You might want to pay special attention to the methyl-folate supplement. Not only does the yeast toxin interfere with its formation, but a genetic problem with creating it seems to be prevalent in Crohn's and colitis. 

Start slow with adding in methyl-folate. If you don't feel right with it, try taking some niacinamide. You need to balance your methyl-folate with niacinamide. There is also a need to balance your methyl-folate with methyl-B12. 

"A total of 17.5% of ulcerative colitis and 16.8% of Crohn's disease patients were homozygous for the C677T variant compared with 7.3% of controls." 
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1727640/

This means that both your mom and dad may have given you a genetic weakness in creating methyl-folate. In the conclusion of that abstract, the author suggested that people with Crohn's and colitis may need more folic acid and B12. However, you need to be careful with which forms of these you use. Folic acid is not the same thing as folate or methyl-folate. In fact if you inherit the same C677T weakness from both your parents, you should probably try to avoid sources of folic acid. Folic acid is the form of the vitamin they put in bread and enriched flour products. It is also the form found in most vitamin supplements. Folic acid can build up in the blood and interfere with the use of your methyl-folate. When you hear about a study saying folic acid supplementation was associated with colon cancer, that may very well be true, because it was folic acid, not folate. Excess "folic acid" is toxic and cancer causing. (This is talked about at the MTHFR.net website.)

You may need some methyl-B12 to balance your methyl-folate. Each person will be different in the proportions they need to supplement. The lack of B12 may be related to excess bacteria in the small intestine (SIBO). It is hard to say which vitamin you need the most. Here is something I wrote for a SIBO group about methyl-folate and methyl-B12.

B12 AND FOLATE BALANCE

With SIBO, folic acid /folate levels are sometimes high. We don’t know if it is caused by the bacteria creating folates or something else. One potential reason is that you need B12 to use the folates, and B12 is often low with SIBO. Another potential problem is the presence of antibodies to folate receptors. This may cause high levels of folates in the blood, but low levels in the cells.  

Methyl-folate should be kept in balance with methyl-B12. The two work together. An excess of one may suppress the other. With SIBO, usually it is the B12 that is low, and the folic acid / folate that is high. Therefore, perhaps start your experimentation with the methyl-B12 or the hydroxy-B12. (The hydroxyl-B12 converts into methyl-B12 and adenosyl-B12 in the body.) There is another reason to start with the B12. According to Wikipedia, 

 “Patients with megaloblastic anemia need to be tested for vitamin B12 deficiency before folate treatment, because if the patient has vitamin B12 deficiency, folate supplementation can remove the anemia, but can also worsen neurologic problems.” 

However, there is always the possibility that you may need more folate. Antibodies to milk casein are known to interfere with the use of folates. Acetaldehyde from yeast overgrowth will interfere with the absorption of folate and its conversion to methyl-folate. (The acetylaldehyde lowers Coenzyme A, which is needed for the enzyme that catalyzes the conversion of formyl-folate into methyl-folate.) Heavy metals, especially arsenic, will interfere with the folates. Certain drugs will interfere with the absorption or metabolism of folate. Some of these are Metformin / Glucophage, Warfarin/Coumadin, Methyltrexate, Triamterene, sulfasalazine, trimethoprim-sulfamethoxazole, anti-seizure drugs, retinoid acne pills and birth control pills Dialysis will remove folates. Alcohol consumption will lower methyl-folate.

TYPES OF FOLIC ACID / FOLATE / VITAMIN B9 

Vitamin B9 is usually referred to as folic acid, even though folic acid is just the synthetic form of this vitamin. If one were to be more exact, the term folic acid would only be used to refer to the fully oxidized synthetic compound known as pteroylmonoglutamic acid. This is the form of vitamin B9 found in most vitamin supplements and in fortified flour.  

The body will try to convert the synthetic folic acid into dihydrofolate and then into 5-formyl-tetrahydrofolate and then into 5-methyl-tetrahydrofolate. Unfortunately, up to 60 percent of the people in the USA have at least some genetic trouble converting folic acid into these various folates. This conversion process can also be thwarted by heavy metals, alcohol, solvents, chemicals, toxins, certain antibiotics or drugs, and the acetaldehyde produced by yeast. Because of these conversion problems, other forms of vitamin B9 have now become available on the market. 

If the body is having trouble converting folic acid into a more useable form, then ingesting folic acid may result in a build-up of folic acid in the blood. Some people are very sensitive to this build-up of folic acid and feel better when they avoid all food and supplements that have been fortified with the synthetic folic acid. One possible reason for their sensitivity is that a build-up of folic acid in the blood can actually interfere with methyl-folate (5-methyl-tetrahydrofolate) crossing the blood brain barrier.  Methyl-folate is the only form of vitamin B9 that crosses the blood-brain barrier. There it is needed to help create your brain’s neurotransmitters, like serotonin, dopamine and norepinephrine. When the brain doesn’t get enough methyl-folate, one may suffer from depression, migraines, foggy thinking, irritability and many other brain symptoms. 

According to Wikipedia, 

“Common symptoms of folate deficiency include diarrhea, macrocytic anemia with weakness or shortness of breath, nerve damage with weakness and limb numbness (peripheral neuropathy)[citation needed], pregnancy complications, mental confusion, forgetfulness or other cognitive declines, mental depression, sore or swollen tongue, peptic or mouth ulcers, headaches, heart palpitations, irritability, and behavioral disorders. Low levels of folate can also lead to homocysteine accumulation.[7] DNA synthesis and repair are impaired and this could lead to cancer development.” 

Dr. Ben Lynch has a surprisingly long list of things that could be caused by the lack of methyl-folate. This is his list as of December 6, 2012

Autism
Addictions: smoking, drugs, alcohol
Down's syndrome
Miscarriages
Pulmonary embolisms
Depression in Post-Menopausal Women
Schizophrenia
Fibromyalgia
Chronic Fatigue Syndrome
Chemical Sensitivity
Parkinson's
Irritable Bowel Syndrome
Pre-eclampsia
Stroke
Spina bifida
Esophageal Squamous cell carcinoma
Acute Lymphoblastic Leukemia
Vascular Dementia
Bipolar disorder
Colorectal Adenoma
Idiopathic male infertility
Blood clots
Rectal cancer
Meningioma
Glioma
Congenital Heart Defects
Infant depression via epigenetic processes caused by maternal depression
Deficits in childhood cognitive development
Gastric Cancer
Migraines with aura
Low HDL
High homocysteine
Post-menopausal breast cancer
Atherosclerosis
Oral Clefts
Type 1 Diabetes
Epilepsy
Primary Closed Angle Glaucoma
Alzheimer's
Tetralogy of Fallot
Decreased telomere length
Potential drug toxicities: methotrexate, anti-epileptics
Cervical dysplasia
Increased bone fracture risk in post-menopausal women
Multiple Sclerosis
Essential Hypertension
Differentiated Thyroid Carcinoma
Prostate Cancer
Premature Death
Placental Abruption
Myocardial Infarction (Heart Attack)
Methotrexate Toxicity
Nitrous Oxide Toxicity
Heart Murmurs
Tight Anal Sphincters
Tongue Tie
Midline Defects (many are listed above)
Behcet's Disease
Ischemic Stroke in Children
Unexplained Neurologic Disease
Asthma
Shortness of Breath
Bladder Cancer
Anecephaly

http://mthfr.net/mthfr-mutations-and-the-conditions-they-cause/2011/09/07/

One might be able to add Raynaud’s to that list, since folate is low and it is needed for circulation.
WHEN NOT TO TAKE METHYL-FOLATE
http://mthfr.net/taking-folate-and-feeling-badly-methylation-requires-balance/2011/11/15/
According to this reference, if you methionine levels are high, then you might not tolerate the methyl-folate because it could raise methionine levels even higher. If your methionine levels are high, this doctor suggests trying P5P and magnesium first to help bring methionine levels down. Then you may be able to tolerate the methyl-folate. 
Some people may have to start slowly, because the methyl-folate may open up microcirculation. When you first open up microcirculation, you may experience some inflammation or uncomfortable reactions.

WHERE TO PURCHASE METHYL-FOLATE AND FORMYL-FOLATE

Formyl-folate also goes by the names of formyltetrahydrofolate, folinic acid and leucovorin (prescription). If you are looking to purchase some formyl-folate, most vitamin supplements call it folinic acid. The other form available as a supplement is methyl-folate. It also goes by the names of 5-methyltetrahydrofolate, and 5-MTHF.  The vitamin supplements using this form call it a whole host of different names. 
Life Extension calls their methyl-folate product Optimized Folate, and Metagenics calls their product FolaPro. Solgar calls their product just Folate. Nutricology calls their product QuatreActiv Folate. Jarrow calls their product Methyl-folate. Vitacost calls their product Bioavailable Folate.  Thorne Research calls their product 5-MTHF. XYMOGEN® also calls their product 5-MTHF. These products contain anywhere from 0.4 to 1 mg per pill.  

However, there are a couple of higher dose products if you need them. The price per unit active ingredient is cheaper with these. So, if you need a higher dose, use these instead of taking a lot of the lower dose pills.   Neurobiologix sells Methyl-folate Plus and 5-MTHF. Each of these contains 5 mg per pill as well. However, there is also some folinic acid and niacinamide in the Methyl-folate Plus product. (So, it costs a bit more.) When you take into account the dose, these two Neurobiologix methyl-folate products are considerably cheaper per unit than the other products that I’ve seen on the market.

There are two prescription products that contain methyl-folate --- Deplin and Metanx.  Deplin is specifically marketed as useful for treating depression. It is a high potency product containing 7.5 or 15 mg of methyl-folate per pill.  (Rather expensive.) Another prescription that contains methyl-folate is Metanx. This prescription is used to treat diabetic neuropathy. It contains about 3 mg of methyl-folate per pill along with some other B vitamins in their active coenzyme form.  
If you find something else on the market, make sure it is the pure L form, and that it doesn’t contain the D form. Someplace on the label, the product should say L-methyltetrahydrofolate, Metafolin or Quatrefolic. 

VITAMIN B12

SIBO can interfere with the absorption of vitamin B12. (The bacteria can bind intrinsic factor that is required for absorption of B12.) B12 is needed for the health of the intestinal villi and is also required for good sleep. B12 helps the body dispose of nitric oxide, and thus helps reduce inflammation. Low B12 is associated with many autoimmune diseases like Hashimoto’s.  The common parasites called Giardia and Diphylobothrium latum interfere with the absorption of B12.

There are different forms of B12 including cyano, methyl, adenosyl, and hydroxy. The cyano form of B12, which contains cyanide, isn’t a good bet, especially if one is mercury poisoned. The hydroxyl converts into the methyl and the adenosyl forms in the body. So, if you have no trouble with this conversion, hydroxyl-B12 is great. Get your doctor to give you some shots of this. However, to make thing simple, probably, the best thing to try would be a combination of adenosyl-B12 and methyl-B12. 

For the methyl-B12, consider using a nasal spray. This is absorbed ten times better than the sublingual. (See Stan Kurtz’s website.) Currently, there seems to be only one brand of methyl-B12 liquid on the market. It is New Beginnings Methyl-Mate.  Adult dose is two sprays per day in the nostril. Sometimes improved cognitive ability is seen within as little as a minute.

There is also a more recent B12 product which is a skin cream that is absorbed very well. It is called neuro immune stabilizer cream and sold at the Neurobiologix website. There is also a liquid adenosyl-B12 available that can be used under the tongue.

Vitamin B12 and curcumin are strong scavengers of nitric oxide. Therefore they may help reduce the intestinal inflammatory response to the SIBO bacteria’s LPS (lipopolysaccaride). Niacinamide is also helpful here. It reduces the amount of nitric oxide created when the body is exposed to LPS. Together, they may be  of some use when there is danger of sepsis. With sepsis, excessive nitric oxide production expands blood vessels and creates  extremely low blood pressure and hence heart failure.

Another consideration. When rats are exposed to LPS, they are able to survive the onslaught with much less damage to their intestines and organs if they are on a diet that excludes polyunsaturated omega-3 and omega-6 oils. [1] Much fewer deaths result. This is another reason to avoid corn, soy, safflower, canola, peanut, flax and cottonseed oils. 

1.	Cook JA, Wise WC, Knapp DR, Halushka PV. “Essential fatty acid deficient rats: a new model for evaluating arachidonate metabolism in shock.” Adv Shock Res 1981;6:93-105; and  Li EJ, Cook JA, Spicer KM, Wise WC, Rokach J, Halushka PV “Resistance of essential fatty acid-deficient rats to endotoxin-induced increases in vascular permeability.” Circ Shock 1990 Jun;31(2):159-170; and  Autore G, Cicala C, Cirino G, Maiello FM, Mascolo N, Capasso F, “Essential fatty acid-deficient diet modifies PAF levels in stomach and duodenum of endotoxin-treated rats.” J Lipid Mediat Cell Signal 1994 Mar;9(2):145-5


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## Spooky1

Wow!!! i'm pleased my gastro bloke doesn't speak to me with all that info!!!  at leasst here i can take my time over it, lol.


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## PollyH

Niacin or niacinamide seems to play an important role in colitis. Deficiency of niacin can cause colitis, and conversely, colitis can cause a deficiency of niacin.

If you add on top of that an inability to use niacin, due to a lack of methyl-folate, then I think you are asking for trouble.

I've already mentioned a few other benefits of adequate niacinamide. These are the fact it is anti-inflammatory and it helps slow down yeast growth and slow the formation of the yeast biofilms.

===============================
references:

"Niacin (vitamin B3) deficiency is known to cause diarrhea and colitis. ...Niacin deficiency after bariatric surgery is supported by finding low plasma niacin levels and by resolution of the symptoms of colitis during oral niacin therapy." 

http://www.eventscribe.com/2012/acg/ajaxcalls/postersinfo.asp?title=6654

The Potential Role of Niacin in the Development of Indeterminant Colitis After Bariatric Surgery

Divyanshoo R. Kohli1, Raj Majithia1, I David Shocket1, Frederick C. Finelli1, Timothy R. Koch1
1. Washington Hospital Center, Washington, DC, United States. 
======================
Pellagra is caused by a lack of niacin.

"Pellagra also occurred in the Southeastern United States in the early 1900’s and throughout the depression, when incomes were very low and corn products again played the major dietary role.

This deficiency can also be caused by conditions or diseases that either prevent or interfere with the absorption of niacin such as chronic alcoholism, prolonged bouts of diarrhea, and gastrointestinal diseases such as ulcerative colitis. "

Read more: http://healthmad.com/conditions-and-diseases/niacin-deficiency/#ixzz2J9SGTFdG


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## Samboi

I have neutropenia - which means my immune system is almost non-existant. 
When I challenged my GI about putting me on an immune suppressing biologic drug to manage my CD - she advised (after chuckling) that the immune supressor attacks totally different cells - presumably TNF cells. 
Apparently my logic and deductive reasoning that a suppressed immune system was enough to minimize CD symptoms was extremely flawed! 

Historically - I have noticed that each time I have an extra shot of neupogen to boost my immune system, I get a slight increase in diarrhea and mild cramping. My dose has just been increased to manage severe mouth ulcers - I will be interested in seeing what impact this has on my CD symptoms.


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## Beach

PollyH said:


> Niacin or niacinamide seems to play an important role in colitis. Deficiency of niacin can cause colitis, and conversely, colitis can cause a deficiency of niacin.
> 
> If you add on top of that an inability to use niacin, due to a lack of methyl-folate, then I think you are asking for trouble.
> 
> I've already mentioned a few other benefits of adequate niacinamide. These are the fact it is anti-inflammatory and it helps slow down yeast growth and slow the formation of the yeast biofilms.
> 
> ===============================
> references:
> 
> "Niacin (vitamin B3) deficiency is known to cause diarrhea and colitis. ...Niacin deficiency after bariatric surgery is supported by finding low plasma niacin levels and by resolution of the symptoms of colitis during oral niacin therapy."
> 
> http://www.eventscribe.com/2012/acg/ajaxcalls/postersinfo.asp?title=6654
> 
> The Potential Role of Niacin in the Development of Indeterminant Colitis After Bariatric Surgery
> 
> Divyanshoo R. Kohli1, Raj Majithia1, I David Shocket1, Frederick C. Finelli1, Timothy R. Koch1
> 1. Washington Hospital Center, Washington, DC, United States.
> ======================
> Pellagra is caused by a lack of niacin.
> 
> "Pellagra also occurred in the Southeastern United States in the early 1900’s and throughout the depression, when incomes were very low and corn products again played the major dietary role.
> 
> This deficiency can also be caused by conditions or diseases that either prevent or interfere with the absorption of niacin such as chronic alcoholism, prolonged bouts of diarrhea, and gastrointestinal diseases such as ulcerative colitis. "
> 
> Read more: http://healthmad.com/conditions-and-diseases/niacin-deficiency/#ixzz2J9SGTFdG


Interesting about the niacin.  That is something I've been taking of late, so it isn't something I can rule out as helping.  My D has all but stopped this past week.  I'm a bit tired this morning, but of late I've been doing well to the gut and experiencing better energy.  During this improved health time I also began taking some niacin, 500mgs twice a week.  I've taken the brand Slo Niacin in the past to help with cholesterol control.  (Slo Niacin found in most drug stores is pretty much the same product as prescription niacin.) This time I had a different idea in mind.  I've noticed that niacin can sometimes give me very shinny hair and a nice attractive skin tone.  I wondered why niacin only helped sometimes with appearance - so thought possibly this could be as a way to discover food allergies.  An offending food would hurt my absorption abilities causing a poor appearance,  while the opposite happens once the offending food is out of the diet - and niacin would exaggerate this.  So far so good with the theory, might have found an "ugly" food. More work needs to be done though.  (If, and it is a big if, the food I'm thinking is a problem maker for me, it could explain why I've gotten well to the gut in the past, but never felt I could fully recover.  I apparently can eat a little of this food and not become terribly ill.)  

Wanted to mention that while niacin pills are generally safe to take, if taken wrong can cause liver issues.  Your doctor can test for this if concerned (liver testing is done once 1000mgs of more of niacin is taken per day.).  Avoid slow release niacin.  Also do not buy no flush niacin.  This is a rip off, it does not work.  Additionally niacin often causes an intense flushing for most that take it.  The best way to limit the niacin flush is to eat some nuts with the pill, plus drink lots of water.  For me, in the past before my body became used to niacin, it would cause me to turn bright red for around an hour, with a feeling of pins and needles sticking me all over.  It wasn't terribly awful to experience, but I wanted to avoid being in public when it happened.  I would joke that I looked like an Umpa lumpa with shinny hair. :redface: 

Something else also, niacin at high doses can raise blood sugar levels.  It is best to exercise after taking.  

Thought this a nice article about ways to deal with a niacin flush.  

"The dreaded niacin “flush”"

http://blog.trackyourplaque.com/2007/05/the-dreaded-niacin-flush.html


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## PollyH

Samboi said:


> I have neutropenia - which means my immune system is almost non-existant.


I assume you have looked at wikipedia and found that a lack of folate and/or B12, or copper could be the reason for the neutrapenia. If you need the copper, my personal experience was that I felt better using copper sebacate. If you need the folate, then consider the methyl-folate because it is more likely you have a MTHFr problem common in Crohn's and colitis. Folic acid might not be good for you. People with a type of cancer called MDS find that vitamin D3 and high dose vitamin K2 can be helpful in bringing up the platelet and red blood cell counts. The type of vitamin K2 used in studies is the MK-4 form of it. The studies have been using a lot of the MK-4 form, 50 mg. You can get 15 mg pills of the MK-4 vitamin K2 from Relentless Improvement or Advanced Orthomolecular Research (AOR). Of course, the cheaper MK-7 form might work. I'm not implying that you have cancer. Don't worry. However, if it works for the people with cancer, it might work for you. Besides bringing up your vitamin D3 and K2 levels would be helpful because they are anti-inflammatory. Here is a forum where they are talking about a study involving vitamin D3 and K2 to bring up the white blood count. http://forums.marrowforums.org/showthread.php?p=25075 

(It is also important to use both vitamins, along with a little vitamin A. The fat soluble vitamins need balance. By the way, carotene isn't always a good way to bring up your vitamin A. Children and those with low thyroid are unable to use the carotene to increase vitamin A. So use the real vitamin A.)  

If you are deficient in vitamin D, a doctor may give you a high dose vitamin D2. However, the natural vitamin D3 works better. The only place I know to get the high dose vitamin D3, is from International Anti-aging Systems. A typical protocol is to give you 50,000 IU three times a week for a month. Then they retest in 3 months. (That is how often insurance will pay for testing.) However, you can order vitamin D testing yourself. Then you can find out more quickly if the therapy is working. The vitamin D council has referrals on where to get the testing. Here is a very entertaining video by Dr. Stasha Gominak's, a sleep doctor, on the amount of vitamin D that you need. (Not too much and not too little.) She talks about getting her patient’s vitamin D 25(OH) levels into a narrow range of between 60 and 80 mg/mL. 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h7cbBB1c0IM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1APENOUWxBQ&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_JUq4fphjC0&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qeb3PtkCd_c&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YOUybbVOoRU&feature=related

Wikipedia also mentioned arsenic poisoning from ground water as a possible reason for the neutropenia. (The people in Southern California are at risk for this in the USA.) The arsenic interferes with your folates.

There are other sources of arsenic. In the USA, they legally feed chickens arsenic. This is allowed because arsenic can kill parasites. However, the arsenic also makes the chickens grow faster, and hence the farmers make more money. Fortunately, one of the major feed producers has recently stopped putting arsenic in their chicken feed. They stopped when it was shown that the arsenic was present in the livers of chickens. (It was easier to test for it in the liver. We don't know if it accumulates in the meat. However, the meat does become more pink.) I'd read that Tyson doesn't feed their chickens arsenic, because Russia refuses to by the meat. You might call and find out if they still have that policy. Of course, your other option is organic chickens.

Another source of arsenic is rice if it is grown in soil high in arsenic. Rice preferentially takes up arsenic from the soil. Unfortunately, they used a lot of arsenic pesticides on some of the cotton fields in the Southern US states. So, rice grown there may be high in arsenic. You can do a search for the arsenic content of rice and where it was grown. 

You can get rid of the arsenic with the typical chelation protocols.

The mouth sores may be related to the viruses typically associated with Crohn's and colitis. These viruses are particularly hard on your selenium stores. Also, selenium and sometimes lysine will help get rid of them.


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## CeeCeeGo

Just logging into this thread so I can keep up with it.
Thanks


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## PollyH

> I am at a bit of a loss on how to take carbs out of my diet though. I know I need to limit at least the simple sugars due to effects that I have noticed.


The book on Wondro mentions that when using this product, some people seem to be able to heal their gut without limiting carbohydrates. I assume this is because even if the yeast do get to some of the sugars, your body won't have to deal with the acetaldehyde. The Wondro remedy would have already absorbed the acetaldehyde. Unfortunately, I don't  have any idea of how bad off these people were who kept up their normal carbohydrate intake and still healed. 

I do know, that when I was sick with yeast overgrowth, I could eat bread, without feeling worse. That was the only high carbohydrate food I was using. I put lots of raw butter on it. Perhaps you have limited your carbohydrate intake enough. You don't want to get down to zero carbs. 

As for your problem getting enough calories. If you can tolerate coconut oil, that might help. It is easily absorbed. You can even put it on your skin and get some calories that way. Just start with no more than a teaspoon. A full therapeutic dose is 3 tablespoons per day. If combined with some roughage, it should do a better job of reaching the whole length of the intestines. However, when you increase the amount of coconut oil in your diet, your body will need more zinc, B6 and other minerals and vitamins, in order to run at a faster pace.

Several people on a different forum  have noticed that the coconut oil helps quite a bit with constipation. The coconut oil, especially the lauric acid in it, will kill off methane producing bacteria. High methane levels will cause constipation.


----------



## PollyH

Beach said:


> Interesting about the niacin.  That is something I've been taking of late, so it isn't something I can rule out as helping.  My D has all but stopped this past week.
> 
> Thought this a nice article about ways to deal with a niacin flush.
> 
> "The dreaded niacin “flush”"
> 
> http://blog.trackyourplaque.com/2007/05/the-dreaded-niacin-flush.html


Glad you are feeling better as of late. Also, thank you for the information on how to deal with a niacin flush. 

Niacin gives a flush, but niacinamide does not. Must you use the niacin? I think for most purposes, niacinamide would be just fine. With Crohn’s and colitis, the niacinamide would fulfill the primary needs of lowering inflammation and helping to remove the acetaldehyde, yeast and yeast biofilms. Why make the body go through the extra step of converting niacin into niacinamide? The niacinamide should also be a little easier on the liver. 

In the case of Crohn’s and colitis, I think sometimes niacin could be the wrong thing to use. Some people use niacin to lower cholesterol, especially the “bad” LDL cholesterol. (Niacinamide doesn’t lower cholesterol but niacin does.) Yet, is that what you want? Lower cholesterol? You need to be careful here. It is the LDL cholesterol that protects the body from the toxins generated in the gut. LDL cholesterol should not be allowed to drop too low. Also, if your total cholesterol drops below 160 mg/dl, then there are general health problems that ensue. You are more susceptible to staph, strep and tuberculosis infections. You are more likely to suffer from depression or poor brain function. So, before using niacin, you need to look at your LDL cholesterol and your total cholesterol levels. If those are super high, then perhaps you want to use niacin. If not, then maybe you are better off using the niacinamide.

According to the following references, cholesterol is low during active or acute Crohn’s. Cholesterol levels may be low due to a decreased dietary intake and/or decreased synthesis. Either way, low cholesterol is associated with a poorer outcome in many critical diseases.

Cholesterol metabolism in active Crohn's disease.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19562284

[Changes in lipid metabolism in patients in the active phase of Crohn's disease].  http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18072426 

LIPID METABOLISM IN ACTIVE CROHN’S DISEASE: PRE-RESULTS
http://mefanet.upol.cz/BP/2006/2/363.pdf

We detected lower serum levels of total cholesterol (P < 0.001), LDL- and HDL-cholesterol (P < 0.05) in the patients with active Crohn's disease than in the control group. 

The serum total cholesterol, LDL and HDL cholesterol, and triglyceride concentrations were lower in patients with acute Crohn's disease than in the control group.  … Alteration in lipid metabolism has been described in patients after trauma, surgery, burn injury or in sepsis and low level of cholesterol in critically ill patients is associated with poor prognosis1–3.


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## Beach

Sure, I can give the no flush niacin a try to see if it helps further with the gut, and effects energy levels.  Thanks for the article links.  I'm no longer much of a believer in cholesterol being majorly involved with heart disease, and that played a part in my stoping the niacin too.  I'm now under the impression that it is best to have a CT heart scan to see if plaque is present, and if so find out why, testing the many risk factors that make heart disease plaque possible.   

I follow a number of physician blogs.  Have enjoyed some of Dr. Briffa's concerning cholesterol.  

"Researchers question evidence for ‘the lower the cholesterol, the better’ mantra"

http://www.drbriffa.com/2012/08/03/...-the-lower-the-cholesterol-the-better-mantra/

&

"‘Raised’ cholesterol linked with improved survival in the elderly"

http://www.drbriffa.com/2013/01/25/raised-cholesterol-linked-with-improved-survival-in-the-elderly/


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## PollyH

There is another reason to consider niacinamide over niacin. Niacin reduces insulin sensitivity, but niacinamide increases insulin sensitivity.

Here is just another reminder. You need methyl-folate to convert the niacinamide or niacin into NAD and NADH. For genetic reasons, and due to the yeast acetaldehyde, you may be low on methyl-folate. So, you may need to do some experimentation on what balance of these nutrients to supplement. The niacin and niacinamide can be toxic if you don't have enough methyl groups from choline and methyl-folate. 

http://mthfr.net/forums/reply/reply-to-mthfr-tt-suppliments-niacin-concern 

If the niacinamide and methyl-folate combination is not tolerated, there is an option of supplementing directly with NAD or NADH. That would be easiest on the liver. Albeit, not a perfect solution. The NADH is somewhat expensive. The NAD has to be dissolved under the tongue.


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## PollyH

The general topic of this thread is how yeast and fungus are part of the problem in Crohn's and colitis. I would like to take a moment to present how yeast and the genetics of Crohn's can be part of the reason that uveitis (eye inflammation and often loss of vision) is more common in Crohn's and colitis. Also, I would like to direct your attention to the the supplements of methyl-folate, CDP choline and benfotiamine if you have uveitis.

Uveitis is swelling and irritation of the uvea, the middle layer of the eye. The uvea provides most of the blood supply to the retina. Therefore, uveitis can cause vision loss. Uveitis is more common in Crohn's and colitis. People with Crohn's or colitis are more likely to have a MTHFr problem that interferes with the formation of methyl-folate. (Yeast will also interfere with the creation of methyl-folate.) You need the methyl-folate for good microcirculation / blood supply to the eye. You also need the methyl-folate to spare your choline. Without methyl-folate, the body takes the methyl groups from your choline. You need the choline for good nerve health. Benfotiamine is also very important in the treatment of uveitis. (The yeast toxin acetaldehyde gets rid of this vitamin.)

I'm not saying that uveitis is only an issue with yeast and the lack of these three vitamins. Uveitis can be induced in rats with LPS from gram negative bacteria. (So, SIBO, which is also more common with Crohn's, may be another part of the problem.)  http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2937908/?tool=pmcentrez&rendertype=abstract   Heavy metals is probably part of the problem as well. However, the lack of these three vitamins is likely one reason uveitis is more common in Crohn's and colitis.

Here is something I posted on another list about the importance of CDP choline and benfotiamine in the treatment of my friend's uveitis. Her eyesight improved significantly with the addition of these nutrients and the removal of mercury. Last month, her doctor declared that all of the uveitis is gone.

==============

Good news. My friend's eyesight has improved significantly in the last two
months. During the last two months, every two weeks she was tested, and
every two weeks, she was better.  Previously, she could barely see the top
line in the eye chart. Now she can read the fourth line down. Her "bad eye"
is now her "good eye." At her last visit to the doctor, her ophthalmologist
told her that most of the uveitis / inflammation is now gone.

This is what has been happening in her treatment plan, as far as I'm aware. 

Her insurance changed, so she changed opthalmologists. Her new
opthalmologist said that since she was getting progressively worse even
though the eye pressure was controlled, that perhaps the problem wasn't so
much the eye pressure but the inflammation. The doctor took her off of the
methyltrexate and eye pressure drops and instead tried cortisone. It didn't
make much difference. (Cortisone had been tried by her former
ophthalmologist as well.) 

Then the following four things were changed all at the same time. That is
exactly when the progressive improvement started. These are the four things
that changed.

1. The new ophthalmologist started her on some eye drops to reduce
inflammation. 

2. My friend finished getting the mercury out of her teeth and started DMPS
IV chelation treatments with an alternative doctor. She was doing
approximately one chelation treatment every two weeks during this two
month time period. (Chelation therapy removes heavy metals like mercury from the soft tissue in the body.) 

3. My friend started large doses of benfotiamine. Benfotiamine is a fat
soluble form of vitamin B1. Benfotiamine helps the body remove mercury and
other heavy metals. Benfotiamine is depleted by mercury. (Mercury gets rid
of this vitamin when it attaches to the sulfur in the vitamin.) Benfotiamine
has been shown to be effective in the rat model of uveitis / eye
inflammation.  

4. My friend started large doses of citicoline / CDP choline. This has been
shown to help repair the retina of the eye. Theoretically, it may also help
reduce inflammation because it increases the formation of
phosphotidylcholine, which is needed in the repair of any damaged
mitochondria membranes. (Repairing the membranes helps to reduce
inflammation because when the mitochondria membranes are damaged,
inflammatory substances leak out of the mitochondria.) 

If I remember correctly, my friend is taking 6 pills a day of benfotiamine,
where each pill is 250 mg. (Life Extension's Mega Benfotiamine.) I believe
she is taking 9 pills a day of the CDP choline / citicoline. Each pill is
250 mg, and it is the Jarrow Formulas brand. (I know the brands because I
ordered them for her.)

My friend went through all the trouble and expense of getting the mercury
removed from her mouth and starting the chelation therapy for the following
reasons:

1. Her first attack occurred two months after having 10 mercury amalgams
placed in her mouth.

2. Her second attack occurred a year and a half later. This was just after
having more mercury put in her mouth.

3. She has always been sensitive to metals. She gets a rash if her jewlry is
anything other than gold or silver. Nothing else in her medical history was
unusual. 

We can't say for sure what made the difference in her eyesight. However,
maybe, just maybe, my friend's effort at mercury removal was well rewarded
with much improved eyesight.

PS: Please be aware that if you get the mercury removed from your mouth,
you must see a biological dentist. They will take the proper precautions to
reduce your exposure to the mercury during the removal procedure.  Improper
removal of the mercury by a regular dentist can ruin your health. (There was
an autistic kid who had his mercury removed by a regular dentist, and he got
much worse instead of better. Fortunately, with chelation therapy, the kid
is finally doing better.) Please note that you can't start IV chelation
therapy until after the mercury is out of your mouth. If you do IV chelation
while the mercury is still in the teeth, then the chelation drug appears in
the saliva and moves mercury out of your teeth fillings and into your
tissue. This would make you sick. Another precaution. You don't remove all
the mercury from all the teeth in one session. You remove the mercury from
one quadrant at a time. Then you wait between removal procedures to give
the body a chance to recover. Depending on your doctor, this might be a wait
of two weeks to two months between working on each of the 4 mouth quadrants.


----------



## PollyH

To make the story about my friend's uveitis more complete, I should have mentioned the non-prescription supplements she was taking before that miraculous 2 months. Before she started the chelation, she was taking things to help deal with the mercury in her body. She was taking 

Chlorella (This absorbed the mercury being released from her fillings.)

Vitamin A and D (These vitamins are important for most auto-immune illnesses.) 

Selenite (Selenium is depleted by mercury. Selenium is needed to keep glutathione active. Glutathione protects the nerves.)

Epsom Salts baths (Mercury causes sulfates to be lost in urine. The magnesium sulfate of Epsom Salts helps to replenish her sulfates.)

Methyl-B12 nasal spray. (The methyl form of B12 is depleted by mercury. This form of B12 is essential for nerve health and repair. It also helps to keep glutathione levels up.)

Methyl-folate  (Mercury interferes with this. It is needed for blood flow in the eyes. People of Mexican decent often have a MTHFr weakness and need the methyl-folate. She was taking a lot of this, about 9 mg at the time. However, never start with this much. You might have a bad reaction.)

Vitamin C. (About 1,000 mg. This helps with interocular eye pressure.)


----------



## Beach

PollyH said:


> There is another reason to consider niacinamide over niacin. Niacin reduces insulin sensitivity, but niacinamide increases insulin sensitivity.
> 
> Here is just another reminder. You need methyl-folate to convert the niacinamide or niacin into NAD and NADH. For genetic reasons, and due to the yeast acetaldehyde, you may be low on methyl-folate. So, you may need to do some experimentation on what balance of these nutrients to supplement. The niacin and niacinamide can be toxic if you don't have enough methyl groups from choline and methyl-folate.
> 
> http://mthfr.net/forums/reply/reply-to-mthfr-tt-suppliments-niacin-concern
> 
> If the niacinamide and methyl-folate combination is not tolerated, there is an option of supplementing directly with NAD or NADH. That would be easiest on the liver. Albeit, not a perfect solution. The NADH is somewhat expensive. The NAD has to be dissolved under the tongue.


I'm fairly sure I've seen a product called NAD for sale at the health store I visit.  Next time I'm there I'll pick up a bottle.  Once I give NAD a try, I'll report back on how things are going.  Fingers crossed, hope it helps further.


----------



## 723crossroads

I know this is all helpful, but it is too much to try and take in and understand. How does one do that???


----------



## David

Thank you for continuing to share your insights Polly.


723crossroads said:


> I know this is all helpful, but it is too much to try and take in and understand. How does one do that???


In many ways, it's learning a new language.  It has taken me a long time to learn this new language and I'm very much learning new words everyday.  Sometimes you have to read things multiple times and look up words you don't understand and ask questions.  Over time, you'll find yourself learning the new language and understanding what you read.

It is a commitment though.  A commitment to learning.  I personally enjoy it which no doubt makes it a bit easier.


----------



## kiny

nitty said:


> Speaking as a lay person, and not very scientifically knowledgable, please can you explain how, if CD is caused by a weakened immune system, how is it that drugs which suppress the immune system then improve my symptoms?


It's easy to say it was that simple.

Recognition, both the innate and adaptive immune system can do this, the innate immune system can recognise proteins typical for bacteria, the adaptive immune system used lymphocytes, T cell and B cell, signal the body by pointing out these bacteria with chemical marks.

Isolation and destruction, macrophages and neutrophils are able to contain bacteria, and they are able to destroy them through autophagy and apoptosis steps, they also release signaling cytokine that can upregulate or downregulate inflammation, regulate body temperature etc.

After the inflammatory response, inflammation has to go down again, but if your immune system is unable to clear the bacteria, the inflammatory response will not end, so a weak immune system would cause too much inflammation.

I know it sounds contradictory, but once you put autophagy first in crohn's disease it is easier to understand. Most important genes related to genetic predisposition are related to that autophagy step that destroys bacteria.

Autophagy is one of the most important things related to crohn's disease in my opinion.

Lowering the inflammatory response, is not a solution to this problem, it's throwing a bandaid on a gaping wound. The innate inflammatory response is underreactive in people with crohn's disease, which results in the adaptive immune system spiraling out of control, granuloma and macrophages releases tons of pro-inflammatory signaling cytokine to make up for it.


----------



## kiny

723crossroads said:


> I know this is all helpful, but it is too much to try and take in and understand. How does one do that???


The first day I joined the forum I did not know the difference between colon and small intestine.


----------



## PollyH

One study of Crohn’s and colitis found an indication of Epstein Barr virus present in diseased intestinal tissue but not in healthy tissue, even when taking samples from the same patient. Is there a connection to yeast here? Possibly. The Epstein Barr virus can replicate inside of yeast cells. [1] (The virus uses the DNA replication machinery of the yeast cells to make copies of itself.) Therefore, yeast might be providing a nice home for the Epstein Barr virus. 

Note that the Epstein Barr Virus can be present in intestinal tissue, but not be detected in the blood. Never-the-less, it may be instructive to examine a treatment protocol used to eliminate a more general Epstein Barr infection. (The Epstein-Barr Virus sometimes causes mononucleosis, but most Epstein-Barr infections are less severe.) I’ve included a list of the supplements used in Dr. Dana Flavin’s treatment protocol for Epstein-Barr. Afterwards, I‘ve include a couple of my own comments about the listed supplements. 
--------------------------
Allergy Research Group's October 2006 newsletter (page 8 www.ezdesignsite.com/pdf/ARGFocusAsthma.pdf  ) has an article outlining Dr. Dana Flavin's nutritional treatment protocol for an Epstein Barr Virus infection. It is a particular combination of nutrients that creates an intricate interaction in the immune system. The result is often a rapid return to health in 24 to 48 hours. This is what he uses:

14.8 ml of licorice root twice a day or 500 mg glycyrrhicinic acid three times per day ----- (Note, the spice anise tastes like licorice, but it isn't licorice. You will often find anise rather than licorice in licorice candy. Be aware that licorice will raise blood pressure. You can purchase licorice on the internet. Just type "real licorice" into a search engine. It tastes wonderful -- much better than the anise in my opinion.) 

500 to 750 mg of N-acetyl-cysteine (NAC) three times a day or 500 mg of methionine twice a day.

40 to 60 mg of zinc per day (Note, this much zinc might not be healthy for long term use. However, this treatment protocol is only for a few days. If you wish to continue on zinc supplements for a longer period, use the RDA of 15 mg per day, or get your zinc levels monitored.)

800 IU of vitamin E with mixed tocopherols per day

1 gram of vitamin C three times a day (the hypoallergenic non-corn vitamin C works best)

500 mcg of sodium selenite per day (only 200 mcg for children)
==============

One of the supplements in his protocol is licorice. Note that licorice contains cortisols. The cortisols are similar to the prednisone that is used to control a flare of Crohn’s or colitis. However, the amount is much less in licorice. Large amounts of prednisone will suppress thyroid. So, when you come off of prednisone, you have to taper it down, to help make sure there isn’t too big a change in thyroid all at once. A small amount of prednisone or cortisols doesn’t suppress thyroid. In fact, a small amount can help the thyroid hormones work better.

The licorice also contains some phytoestrogens. Since phytoestrogens aren’t good for you in large amounts, I wonder if for long term use, you could instead employ some dried adrenal gland or even the stronger adrenal cortical extract (ACE). Both of these over-the-counter products are common means of supporting the adrenal glands. It is usually best to take them in the morning.  

In the same Focus Newsletter, in which the Epstein Barr removal protocol appeared, there is an article about using a Chinese herbal product as a substitute for prednisone in cases of asthma. The herbal product is called Antiasthma Herbal Medicine Intervention or ASHMI. It contains a synergistic combination of Reishi, Shrubby Sophora and Chinese Licorice. Someone should test that and see if it would help keep the IBD in remission for a longer period of time.  

As you know, prednisone is used during a flare of Crohn’s or colitis to bring the inflammation down. One of the things the prednisone is doing is reducing the release of arachidonic acid (AA) from the intestinal lining (or so it is hypothesized).[2] Less available AA should help the body deal with the yeast. The yeast take the AA and create PGE2 and other oxylipins.[3] The yeast oxylipins alter the immune system so that it is harder to get rid of the yeast. Also, the oxylipins increase the virulence of the yeast and allow them to convert into their more invasive fungal form. This means that the yeast dig into the tissue and hold on tenaciously; and at the same time your immune system is weakened. [4]You will have a very difficult time getting rid of them. (Some yeast make less of these oxylipins than other yeasts, making these yeast less troublesome. Sometimes the less troublesome yeast are even used as a probiotic.)

There is another nutrient in that protocol that I’d like to make a comment on. The doctor suggests 500 to 750 mg of N-acetyl-cysteine (NAC) three times a day or 500 mg of methionine twice a day. The NAC might not be tolerated if you have high copper levels. There have also been reports from very ill patients with AIDS that cysteine causes the yeast problem to increase. (Cysteine is a food that yeast can use for growth. Notice that sometimes you will see it added to bread products to help the yeast grow.) Therefore, it might be a bit easier on the body to try the methionine. On the other hand, the NAC helps protect you from acetaldehyde exposure. It is best to experiment on how these affect you. Everyone is a bit different.

In Crohn’s, the body’s delta-6-desaturase enzyme seems to be up-regulated.[5] That means that whenever you eat corn oil, safflower oil, or any of the typical omega-6 salad dressing oils, your body will turn a lot of it into AA for the yeast. In this context, I wonder what service or dis-service to the yeast is being provided by the Epstein Barr Virus. The Epstein Barr Virus down-regulates the delta-6-desaturase enzyme. [6] 

The Cytomegalovirus (CMV) is often found in the intestines of Crohn’s and colitis patients, at least more so than healthy people. [7] There is something interesting that the CMV virus does. It increases the release of AA from tissue. [8] (Certain bacteria, like Clostridium perfringens, do this, too.[2]) Question. Is Epstein Barr doing something similar? 

Please note. I’m not a practitioner. Plus, my total background in biology is self taught. Please don’t interpret my writing as medical advice. 
========================
References

1. Pyiya Kapoor and Lori Frappier,EBNA1 Partitions Epstein-Barr Virus Plasmids in Yeast Cells by Attaching to Human EBNA1-Binding Protein 2 on Mitotic Chromosomes (This is how Epstein Barr can replicate in yeast cells.) http://jvi.asm.org/content/77/12/6946 

2. Gustafson C, Sjödahl R, Tagesson C. Phospholipase activation and arachidonic acid release in intestinal epithelial cells from patients with Crohn's disease. 1990 Nov;25(11):1151-60. Scand J Gastroenterol. “There was no difference between cells from Crohn patients and controls in the 14C-AA amounts released, but unstimulated and phospholipase C-stimulated cells from prednisolone-treated Crohn patients released less AA than cells from control patients.” http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/2274737 

3. Noverr M.C., Phare S.M., Toews G.B., Coffey M.J., Huffnagle G.B. Pathogenic yeasts Cryptococcus neoformans and Candida albicans produce immunomodulatory prostaglandins. Infect. Immun., 69:2957-2963, 2001. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC98248   I believe this was the first discovery of the oxylipins created by yeast. She has other interesting papers listed here.   http://www.med.wayne.edu/immunology/pages/Faculty_Web_Pages/noverr.html

4. Kock1, Jacobus Albertyn1 and Carolina H Pohl1,2* Arachidonic acid metabolites in pathogenic yeasts, Ruan Ells1, Johan LF Aug 8, 2012  (This is a free full text review.) www.lipidworld.com/content/pdf/1476-511X-11-100.pdf

5. Donald R. Yance, j r.,C.N., M.H., A.H.G., with Arlene Valentine, book Herbal Medicine, Healing and Cancer: A Comprehensive Program for Prevention and Treatment. 
“Red root raises the activity of T-cells and is a good herb to include in a compound to treat low-grade infections such as epstein-barr virus. … Many cancer-cell lines are known to be totally devoid of delta-6 desaturase, and many viral infections, such as the epstein-barr virus, are known to have significant inhibitor effects on this important enzyme. Omega-3 essential fatty acids and eicosapentaenoic acids (EPA) also play a pivotal role in eicosanoid formation, a potent inhibitor of AA. (See table 5.2). Omega-3 Fatty Acids Flaxseed oil is rich in essential fatty acids, particularly ALA, which, when taken in combination with sulfur-rich proteins, actually works to create a new food.” 

6. The Fatty Acid Profile of the Erythrocyte Membrane in Initial-Onset Inflammatory Bowel Disease Patients. Dig Dis Sci. 2013 Jan 11. [Epub ahead of print] Uchiyama K, et al. 

7. Wakefield AJ, et al,  Detection of herpesvirus DNA in the large intestine of patients with ulcerative colitis and Crohn's disease using the nested polymerase chain reaction. J Med Virol. 1992 Nov;38(3):183-90. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1287131

8. AbuBakar S, Boldogh I, Albrecht T. Human cytomegalovirus stimulates arachidonic acid metabolism through pathways that are affected by inhibitors of phospholipase A2 and protein kinase C. Biochem Biophys Res Commun. 1990 Jan 30;166(2):953-9.


----------



## Beach

Thanks for the Epstein Barr mention and treatment regime!  That could be worth an experiment in the future.  

Different idea, but along the lines of the main theme of fungus and yeast connection, the ARA fatty acid mention I thought interesting in light of the controversy over an article concerning a mouse study this week.  It was brought up that possibly omega 3 oils, along with omega 6 fatty acids could negatively influence our gut flora.  

Over the years I've tended to avoid omega 6 oils, believing an excess of them negative for health.   I thought though that fish oil helped my GI issues.  Possibly that is not the case.       

"Of mice and men: Experts challenge omega-6, omega-3 mouse gut health study"



> Leading omega-3 experts have challenged results of a study with mice that found that a diet rich in omega-6 fatty acids may disrupt gut microbiota, and that supplemental fish oil may make things worse.


http://www.nutraingredients-usa.com...llenge-omega-6-omega-3-mouse-gut-health-study


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## 723crossroads

Well, now I don't know what to do. I've been taking them for 20 yrs. and my heart is very healthy!:frown:


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## Beach

Yeah, it certainly can be confusing with all the contradictory information out there.  

Wanted to mention, I was told my heart was healthy also at one time.  I ate well due to the gut, and did what I could to exercise.  Cholesterol tests always came back fantastic.  Overall I received good health marks for heart health.  

Well, one day a friend was telling me about heart CT scans.  A traveling scanner came to his place of work.  CT scans are able to detect calcium plaque growth in arteries, which is the very best indication of cardiac risk.  

So I knew this was something my aging parents were concerned about, heart health.  I called a neighboring cities hospital to sign up for a heart scan.  We decided to make a day of it with the family, as I drove us all over to the facility.  Thankfully, my parents tested out great - which then brought about many jokes on long life and delayed inheritance for me.  I didn't plan to have a CT heart scanning done.  At the time I was only 36, younger then a typical scan is done.  Figured though since I was there, the facility nurse said she had time, and the CT scanner was lower radiation than a typical, it didn't hurt that the facility was having a sale at the time costing around $150 per scan, I would have a plaque detection done too.  And wouldn't you know, lucky me, I had high plaque growth.  I figure my IBD contributed to my coronary plaque development.  Now I not only watch my gut health, but need to be careful about heart health too.  Thankfully the two prevention methods tend to overlap - other than possibly this recent fish oil mention.  Figure I'll keep taking the fish oil.  Not sure if it helps the heart, as the cholesterol theory seems to be loosing some favor of late, but lower triglycerides probably does not hurt.


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## 723crossroads

Beach said:


> Yeah, it certainly can be confusing with all the contradictory information out there.
> 
> Wanted to mention, I was told my heart was healthy also at one time.  I ate well due to the gut, and did what I could to exercise.  Cholesterol tests always came back fantastic.  Overall I received good health marks for heart health.
> 
> Well, one day a friend was telling me about heart CT scans.  A traveling scanner came to his place of work.  CT scans are able to detect calcium plaque growth in arteries, which is the very best indication of cardiac risk.
> 
> So I knew this was something my aging parents were concerned about, heart health.  I called a neighboring cities hospital to sign up for a heart scan.  We decided to make a day of it with the family, as I drove us all over to the facility.  Thankfully, my parents tested out great - which then brought about many jokes on long life and delayed inheritance for me.  I didn't plan to have a CT heart scanning done.  At the time I was only 36, younger then a typical scan is done.  Figured though since I was there, the facility nurse said she had time, and the CT scanner was lower radiation than a typical, it didn't hurt that the facility was having a sale at the time costing around $150 per scan, I would have a plaque detection done too.  And wouldn't you know, lucky me, I had high plaque growth.  I figure my IBD contributed to my coronary plaque development.  Now I not only watch my gut health, but need to be careful about heart health too.  Thankfully the two prevention methods tend to overlap - other than possibly this recent fish oil mention.  Figure I'll keep taking the fish oil.  Not sure if it helps the heart, as the cholesterol theory seems to be loosing some favor of late, but lower triglycerides probably does not hurt.


 I had a heart cath. done because of chestpains and mine was totally plaqyefree. Which surprised them and me. I am overweight, but always ate good foods.


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## Beach

You're lucky, not for the chest pains obviously, but not having plaque!  

Fingers crossed on my part.  I've was told I was at a 5% risk of a cardiac per year - if I didn't take preventive measures.


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## 723crossroads

Beach said:


> You're lucky, not for the chest pains obviously, but not having plaque!
> 
> Fingers crossed on my part.  I've was told I was at a 5% risk of a cardiac per year - if I didn't take preventive measures.


Stick with xtra-virgin olive oil and heart healthy foods. You can eat alot of good foods that are still heart healthy. Avacado's if you like guacamoli is really good for your heart. Also pnut butter and whole grains. Beef is even ok once a week if it is lean. Sad thing is I can't get away with raw veg anymore. I used to have that as a snack at night with light ranch dressing watered down with skim milk.:heart:


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## Beach

Thanks.  I've been following cardiologist Dr. Davis's Track Your Plaque dietary plan for keeping plaque from rupturing.  He's been having success with patients and followers at preventing heart attacks.  

Another plan that looks interesting is Dr. Agatston.  He is the author of South Beach diet and has done a good amount of work with plaque scoring.   Both low carb plans, avoiding whole grains, are somewhat similar.   He reports few heart attacks with patients also.  

"Heart Disease Prevention and Reversal"  

http://www.trackyourplaque.com/


----------



## PollyH

Beach said:


> Different idea, but along the lines of the main theme of fungus and yeast connection, the ARA fatty acid mention I thought interesting in light of the controversy over an article concerning a mouse study this week.  It was brought up that possibly omega 3 oils, along with omega 6 fatty acids could negatively influence our gut flora.
> 
> Over the years I've tended to avoid omega 6 oils, believing an excess of them negative for health.   I thought though that fish oil helped my GI issues.  Possibly that is not the case.


Thank you for the reference. Here is another link with a little more information on the study.

https://news.ok.ubc.ca/2013/01/23/findings-link-polyunsaturated-fat-to-heart-health-risk/ 

However, the results really don’t surprise me. Raymond Peat, Ph.D. has long contended that excessive polyunsaturated oils from any source can be harmful. He says that a little polyunsaturated oil in the diet isn’t going to hurt you. What you need to do is keep the ratio of polyunsaturated to saturated fat low. You also have to be careful in the young not to restrict polyunsaturated oils too much. We really don’t know what that would do to their development. He also contends that when you restrict polyunsaturated oils, you need to increase your vitamin and mineral consumption, especially more B6 and zinc. You need those to support an increased metabolism. 

I heard a very interesting story about 10 years ago. There was a man dying of AIDS. Before he died, he wanted to fulfill a dream of living in a native culture. So, he went to South America and did just that. Within a few weeks, he felt a lot better. He even felt like running through the jungle. When he came back to the US, he was a lot healthier and his T-cell count was considerably higher than when he left. While living with that tribe, his diet consisted of coconut for breakfast, lunch and dinner. For lunch, he also had some fish.

My own experience was that fish made me feel better. So, I started eating it every day. After about a month I noticed that I was starting to feel worse. So, after that, I limited fish consumption to once a week. When I had digestive trouble, I also noticed that raw butter made me feel better, so I was eating a pound of that per week. I didn’t know about coconut oil at that time. 

I contend that my battle with yeast overgrowth was due in large part to all the polyunsaturated oils and margarine I ate as a kid. Mom was feeding her kids what “scientists” had told her to do. We ate margarine, Crisco, and French fries cooked in Wesson oil. That was great profits for the seed oil industry, but bad health for the people. “Scientists” had also told my mom not to breast feed her kids. It wasn’t good for the babies. How fucked up is that! If something has been done since the beginning of time, how can one declare it is bad?

We have been duped over and over again by big business. Any time there is even a hint by scientists that a product might be beneficial, marketing campaigns jump on it as solid science. They will say if you don’t agree with them, you are being irrational and against scientific progress. Or if you are a scientist that disagrees, you may lose your job. If olive oil and butter has been used for hundreds of years, why introduce corn oil and say that it is obviously better? Why introduce genetically modified food and say there is nothing wrong with that? Why tell the public there is nothing wrong with irradiated food? You get the picture. If something hasn’t been a part of a traditional diet, then be extremely wary of it. Honestly, I really think people shouldn’t be eating lots of polyunsaturated oils, genetically modified food or irradiated food.  

Even if something like soy has been part of a traditional diet, you have to be careful. The Japanese eat soy as a side dish and often it is fermented. They also eat seaweed. The seaweed contains iodine. Since soy gets rid of your iodine, the seaweed counters one of the problems of soy. So, it is how the food is traditionally prepared along with what else is in the diet that is important. Eg. The protein in beans and rice complement each other. If interested, there is an outstanding cookbook you may wish to read called Nourishing Traditions by Sally Fallon and Mary Enig. 

Okay. Back to the topic at hand. Fish oil. Have you noticed that all the studies on “omega-3” oils are done with fish oil? They aren’t just creating pure omega-3 fatty acids in a lab and feeding those to animals. They are using fish oil. Besides omega-3 fatty acids, there are other things in fish oil, hormone like components. Fish oil has the property of making platelets less sticky. There are situations where this can be helpful, including digestive diseases. Yet, too much unbalanced fish oil, and you get all the bad properties of excessive polyunsaturated oils in the diet, including leaky gut. Notice that the South Sea Islanders eat lots of fish, but they also eat coconut. Maybe, they have a good combination in their diet. :ysmile:


----------



## Beach

Coconut oil is good stuff!  It goes well with just about everything.  I think most people around here have a tough time digesting it though.  I've read a number mention that.  For what ever reason coconut doesn't bother me much.  Probably if I ate heaping spoonfuls as some do I'd have grumpy gut issues, but a little isn't a problem and adds nice flavoring to dishes.  I think the coconut oil gives me more energy, and not to mention shinny hair, sometimes a little to shinny.          

Well, I had to try it, i avoided fish oil yesterday.  Instead I upped the amount of krill oil I take.  I'm surprised, I was doing better yesterday.  One day doesn't mean much of anything, but didn't expect anything from avoiding fish oil and instead had a nice day.  Figure if anything is to it, might have to do with how unstable fish oil is, oxidizing easily.  Then again it simply could be that fish oil can be problematic for me, as coconut oil is for others.  Another angle I saw was that the fish oil softgels i take have rosemary extract in it.  One of the foods I've been avoiding of late is mint.  Rosemary I guess is in the same genus family as mint.  If one has an issue with one member of the genus family, there is the possibility others are problematic too.  And then there is the gut flora issue, brought up in the mouse study, that might have an effect.  Anyway, I'll have to continue this for awhile longer and see what comes of it.  It's easy to do.  No rock unturned.  

I guess when it comes to our health care system, I've sometimes wondered if 200 years from now, will people laugh and wonder how we put up with some of the treatments we have today - much as we do today when looking back 200 years in time.  

Something that I think most people do not realize with todays medicine is that most doctors do not receive training in nutrition.  During all the years spent in medical school, around 2 weeks is spent on understanding diets and the importance of nutrition.  Many treatments with modern medicine are greatly beneficial to a great many, but all to often these ideas can fall short of ideal.  An unknown part in today health care system is can unique dietary ideas also be helpful in addressing illnesses?     

To further follow up on my story of having a CT heart scan and discovering I had deadly growing plaque in an artery.  After the test I went home and began reading into ways to address the problem.  There really isn't any modern medical treatments to address plaque growth.  Todays answer is, if you survive a heart attack, there is the option of bypass surgery or stents.  That didn't come across as an attractive route.  I wanted to find a possible healthy way to also address plaque growth.  If I have a heart attack, I have the ER.  So I learned of Dr. Davis's heart healthy plan.  I studied up on it.  Then I made an appointment with my local doctor.  I wanted to gain his help.  There are many tests to be done under Dr. Davis's plan that my doctor could arrange.  

When I had the meeting with my doctor, to my surprise he told me that he too has plaque in an artery.  He had been tested the year before at the same facility as me.  He also was familiar with Dr. Davis's plaque reversal ideas and thought well of them.  Then when it came to the nitty gritty, the testing I wanted, my doctor was not helpful.  He only suggested that I take fish oil, some aspirin, and prescribed a statin drug.  He was willing to arrange a simple cholesterol panel and that was pretty much it.  I tried to get more out of him, and later his nurse, why they were not being more helpful.  Never could get an answer.  I suspect I know why though.  The hospital has protocols for addressing different health condition.  To go outside of the protocols could result in law suite liabilities.  

So in someways the situation makes me chuckle.  I suspect there is a decent possibility my former doctor is following the same heart healthy plaque stabilizing plan I am.  And yet, he doesn't help others to follow it.      

I thought this a nice article by doctor Pauline Chen, about her uneasiness in being taught little about nutrition and dietary ideas.     

"Teaching Doctors About Nutrition and Diet"

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/09/16/health/16chen.html?_r=0 

& recall this article

"Lies, Damned Lies, and Medical Science"

http://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2010/11/lies-damned-lies-and-medical-science/308269/


----------



## 723crossroads

Beach said:


> Coconut oil is good stuff!  It goes well with just about everything.  I think most people around here have a tough time digesting it though.  I've read a number mention that.  For what ever reason coconut doesn't bother me much.  Probably if I ate heaping spoonfuls as some do I'd have grumpy gut issues, but a little isn't a problem and adds nice flavoring to dishes.  I think the coconut oil gives me more energy, and not to mention shinny hair, sometimes a little to shinny.
> 
> Well, I had to try it, i avoided fish oil yesterday.  Instead I upped the amount of krill oil I take.  I'm surprised, I was doing better yesterday.  One day doesn't mean much of anything, but didn't expect anything from avoiding fish oil and instead had a nice day.  Figure if anything is to it, might have to do with how unstable fish oil is, oxidizing easily.  Then again it simply could be that fish oil can be problematic for me, as coconut oil is for others.  Another angle I saw was that the fish oil softgels i take have rosemary extract in it.  One of the foods I've been avoiding of late is mint.  Rosemary I guess is in the same genus family as mint.  If one has an issue with one member of the genus family, there is the possibility others are problematic too.  And then there is the gut flora issue, brought up in the mouse study, that might have an effect.  Anyway, I'll have to continue this for awhile longer and see what comes of it.  It's easy to do.  No rock unturned.
> 
> I guess when it comes to our health care system, I've sometimes wondered if 200 years from now, will people laugh and wonder how we put up with some of the treatments we have today - much as we do today when looking back 200 years in time.
> 
> Something that I think most people do not realize with todays medicine is that most doctors do not receive training in nutrition.  During all the years spent in medical school, around 2 weeks is spent on understanding diets and the importance of nutrition.  Many treatments with modern medicine are greatly beneficial to a great many, but all to often these ideas can fall short of ideal.  An unknown part in today health care system is can unique dietary ideas also be helpful in addressing illnesses?
> 
> To further follow up on my story of having a CT heart scan and discovering I had deadly growing plaque in an artery.  After the test I went home and began reading into ways to address the problem.  There really isn't any modern medical treatments to address plaque growth.  Todays answer is, if you survive a heart attack, there is the option of bypass surgery or stents.  That didn't come across as an attractive route.  I wanted to find a possible healthy way to also address plaque growth.  If I have a heart attack, I have the ER.  So I learned of Dr. Davis's heart healthy plan.  I studied up on it.  Then I made an appointment with my local doctor.  I wanted to gain his help.  There are many tests to be done under Dr. Davis's plan that my doctor could arrange.
> 
> When I had the meeting with my doctor, to my surprise he told me that he too has plaque in an artery.  He had been tested the year before at the same facility as me.  He also was familiar with Dr. Davis's plaque reversal ideas and thought well of them.  Then when it came to the nitty gritty, the testing I wanted, my doctor was not helpful.  He only suggested that I take fish oil, some aspirin, and prescribed a statin drug.  He was willing to arrange a simple cholesterol panel and that was pretty much it.  I tried to get more out of him, and later his nurse, why they were not being more helpful.  Never could get an answer.  I suspect I know why though.  The hospital has protocols for addressing different health condition.  To go outside of the protocols could result in law suite liabilities.
> 
> So in someways the situation makes me chuckle.  I suspect there is a decent possibility my former doctor is following the same heart healthy plaque stabilizing plan I am.  And yet, he doesn't help others to follow it.
> 
> I thought this a nice article by doctor Pauline Chen, about her uneasiness in being taught little about nutrition and dietary ideas.
> 
> "Teaching Doctors About Nutrition and Diet"
> 
> http://www.nytimes.com/2010/09/16/health/16chen.html?_r=0
> 
> & recall this article
> 
> "Lies, Damned Lies, and Medical Science"
> 
> http://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2010/11/lies-damned-lies-and-medical-science/308269/


I believe it has alot to do with your insurance companies. They do have a protocol they have to follow for them. One step at a time , as for tests, If you have say a back issue, first you go for xrays. If they give any inclination of a problem, then you maybe allowed the MRI. Then next step if MRI shows problems. Physical therapy. If that doesn't work, then home traction. Then Finally if agreed upon, surgery. I know this because I went thru th whole gammet and so did my husband. That is why your Dr. is doing it this way.


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## Beach

What ever the cause, insurance protocol or hospital/ doctor concerns over liability, I wasn't getting help or answers on why I wasn't being helped in the manner I wished.  The nice part is today it's possible to arrange many of the tests on your own, which in the end is the route I took.


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## PollyH

Beach said:


> You're lucky, not for the chest pains obviously, but not having plaque!  Fingers crossed on my part.  I've was told I was at a 5% risk of a cardiac per year - if I didn't take preventive measures.


The fat found in plaque is mainly polyunsaturated. It really makes you wonder what we have been doing wrong with our diet. Those Islanders eating coconut and fish don't have the plaque problems. In fact, a lot of native diets are heart healthy compared to what we are eating here in the USA.

I'd like to point out an important nutrient that is getting more press as of late -- Vitamin K2. K2 is very important for preventing plaque build-up. As a bonus, it blocks an enzyme that forms PGE2. (Unfortunately, there are other enzymes and ways that yeast can create PGE2. So vitamin K2 isn't a perfect counter to the PGE2 problem of yeast.)

Here is a study of plaque build up caused by Warfarin/Coumadin. Warfarin not only interferes with K1, but also with K2. 

http://wholehealthsource.blogspot.fr/2008/11/can-vitamin-k2-reverse-arterial.html 

(snip...) "Rats are able to convert vitamin K1 to K2 MK-4, whereas humans don't seem to convert well. Conversion efficiency varies between species. Dr. Vermeer's group treated rats with warfarin for 6 weeks, during which they developed extensive arterial calcification. They also received vitamin K1 to keep their blood clotting properly. At 6 weeks, the warfarin-treated rats were broken up into several groups:

·         One continued on the warfarin and K1 diet

·         One was placed on a diet containing a normal amount of K1 (no warfarin)

·         One was placed on a high K1 diet (no warfarin)

·         The last was placed on a high K2 MK-4 diet (no warfarin)

After 6 more weeks, the first two groups developed even more calcification, while the third and fourth groups lost about 40% of their arterial calcium. The high vitamin K groups also saw a decrease in cell death in the artery wall, a decrease in uncarboxylated (inactive), and an increase in arterial elasticity. They also measured the vitamin K content of aortas from each group. The group that received the 12-week warfarin treatment had a huge amount of K1 accumulation in the aorta, but no K2 MK-4. This is expected because warfarin inhibits the conversion of K1 to K2 MK-4. It's notable that when conversion to K2 was blocked, K1 alone was totally ineffective at activating MGP and preventing calcification."  (more...)


----------



## PollyH

Beach said:


> Well, I had to try it, i avoided fish oil yesterday.  Instead I upped the amount of krill oil I take.  I'm surprised, I was doing better yesterday.  One day doesn't mean much of anything, but didn't expect anything from avoiding fish oil and instead had a nice day.  Figure if anything is to it, might have to do with how unstable fish oil is, oxidizing easily.  Then again it simply could be that fish oil can be problematic for me, as coconut oil is for others.  Another angle I saw was that the fish oil softgels i take have rosemary extract in it.  One of the foods I've been avoiding of late is mint.  Rosemary I guess is in the same genus family as mint.  If one has an issue with one member of the genus family, there is the possibility others are problematic too.  And then there is the gut flora issue, brought up in the mouse study, that might have an effect.  Anyway, I'll have to continue this for awhile longer and see what comes of it.  It's easy to do.  No rock unturned.


Possibly for you, the krill oil is what you need, for another person, it may be the fish oil. I think there has been a lot more study with fish oil than krill oil. I wonder what the differences really are. Krill oil isn't a part of a native human diet. So, I'm a bit wary of it.

As I mentioned previously, fish oil makes platelets less sticky, which can be a good thing. I just read a really informative article about pantethine. It has a lot of good properties. However, for the purposes of this IBD discussion, I would like to point out that pantethine not only helps to get rid of yeast, but it improves the integrity of platelets, making them less sticky. 

http://www.wellnessresources.com/ti..._cardio_health_metabolism_and_detoxification/

"In people with chronic inflammation, platelets become sticky, increasing the risk for excessive clotting and stroke. ...pantethine has been shown to improve the health of the cell membrane of platelets, helping them perform much more normally and in a less sticky manner."


----------



## PollyH

Small Intestinal Bacterial Overgrowth (SIBO) is one problem associated with Crohn's and colitis. SIBO increases a person's exposure to LPS from gram negative bacteria and increases a person's expose to more D-lactic acid from bacteria. Both of these properties of SIBO make it harder to heal any type of disease in the body. So, it is important to address this problem as well as just the IBD.

Inflammation increases the chance that you will end up with SIBO. Strictures and scar tissue will also increase the chances that you end up with SIBO. So, it is quite likely that IBD increases the chance of a person ending up with SIBO. Here is a little information on what can cause SIBO, and how yeast fit into this picture.

CAUSES OF SIBO

Some of the causes of SIBO can be a damaged vagus nerve, adhesions, intestinal inflammation, scleroderma, hormonal imbalance or nutritional deficiencies. These in turn can be caused by many different things. 

Vagus nerve damage. This can be caused by certain bacterial or viral infections, heavy metals, MSG (monosodium glutamate), pesticides, or diabetes. A misaligned neck or hiatal hernia could also pinch or put pressure on the nerve. A lack of vitamin B1 is particularly detrimental to the functioning of the vagus nerve.

Adhesions. These may be due to infections, endometriosis or surgery. 

Intestinal inflammation. This may be due to stress, poor food choices or the presence of certain bacteria, parasites, viruses , or yeast. A poorly functioning vagus nerve also leads to increased inflammation. 

Scleroderma. This is a rare disorder and its cause is generally unknown. However, learning a little about it is instructive. Tryptophan and 5-HTP can induce this condition. Natural progesterone and MSM sulfur may be of some help. Avoid fluoride.

Hormonal Imbalance. This often due to a poorly functioning liver or thyroid.  These in turn might be weak due to infections, nutritional deficiencies, toxins and stress. 

Nutritional deficiencies.  All nutrients are important for a healthy body and a healthy functioning intestinal system. However, we should take note that vitamins A and D are particularly important for keeping our gut flora healthy. Without vitamin A and D, the gut becomes populated with harmful residents.  Zinc is also important. It is needed to release stored vitamin A from the liver. Vitamin B12 is also important here. Unfortunately, the SIBO will interfere with the absorption of B12 and your fat soluble vitamins A, D, E, and K. (K1 may be adequate when SIBO is present because bacteria create this. However, I'm concerned about adequate K2 here.)

As you can see, this is a whole body illness. It isn't just a lack of one nutrient or one hormone. It can even be a mechanical injury like a misaligned neck, or a hiatal hernia that is contributing to SIBO. Even stress comes in here, since that will increase your exposure to free serotonin, which will increase fibrin formation.

YEAST and THE HOUSEKEEPER WAVE

Yeast can be a contributor to SIBO. One mechanism is their production of acetaldehyde. Acetaldehyde is the first break down product of alcohol and does much of the damage caused by alcoholism. (Alcoholism is a known cause of SIBO.) Acetaldehyde interferes with the housekeeper wave through multiple mechanisms. The housekeeper wave is a primary way of keeping the bacteria levels down in the small intestine. (The small intestine is not supposed to have a lot of bacteria in it.) Yeast produce acetaldehyde and they even have a few more tricks up their sleeve that interfere with the housekeeper wave and intestinal motility. Here are some of the ways in which yeast do this. 

Prostaglandin E2 (PGE2) inhibits the housekeeper wave. Yeast make PGE2. Yeast also make acetaldehyde. Acetaldehyde inhibits delta-6-desaturase and this inhibition tends to increase the body’s production of PGE2.

Motilin is needed to trigger the housekeeper wave. Some yeast are capable of making somatostatin which inhibits motilin. (Researchers have shown that the yeast called Saccharomyces cerevisiae secretes somatostatin. Other yeast are known to have receptors for somatostatin. http://www.jbc.org/content/263/30/15342.full.pdf  ) 

Thyroid hormone is needed for proper intestinal motility. Yeast products can interfere with the thyroid. Somatostatin from yeast overgrowth could theoretically lower thyroid hormone by lowering TSH. The acetaldehyde from yeast interferes with g proteins that signal the thyroid. Yeast can make estradiol (an estrogen), which lowers thyroid. 

Histamine inhibits the housekeeper wave. An allergic response causes the release of histamine. Yeast overgrowth is associated with an increased number of allergies, including allergies to yeast. 

A lack of stomach acid interferes with the triggering of the housekeeper wave. Yeast overgrowth can lower stomach acid. One way in which yeast do this is by interfering with the production of acetylcholine, which triggers the production of stomach acid. Another way in which yeast do this is by making an H. pylori infection harder to eradicate. (H. pylori can hide within yeast cells.) H. pylori down-regulates the production of stomach acid.

Acetylcholine produced by the vagus nerve is one of the primary triggers for the housekeeper wave. Yeast lower acetylcholine. Also the vagus nerve’s release of acetylcholine acts through the spleen to help control inflammation in the body. Interfering with this is another way in which yeast increase inflammation in the body. (It is the acetaldehyde made by the yeast that interferes with the creation of acetylcholine.)

Opiates increase histamine and interfere with the housekeeper wave. Yeast make acetaldehyde, which promotes the formation of opiate-like substances. (The acetaldehyde from yeast can react with neurotransmitters like serotonin or dopamine to create opiate-like substances called tetrahydroisoquinolines.) 

Serotonin and dopamine are signaling molecules in the intestines. Yeast produce acetaldehyde which forms adducts with serotonin and dopamine and makes them unavailable for their intended purposes. 

The vagus nerve triggers the housekeeper wave. The yeast produce acetaldehyde which gets rid of vitamin B1. A lack of vitamin B1 will affect the functioning of the vagus nerve.


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## mreyn

Is there somewhere on the forum that will give me a simplified list of what my son needs for Crohns.. vitamins, supplements, etc. He is on Remicade and is doing ok, but the thought of him being on that scares us. So if there's someone who has brands, dosages, etc... I have been searching and searching and am so overwhelmed with trying to find what he needs, without  additives he doesn't in the correct doses,  in an easy to absorb formula, etc.  I'm also not sure what he doesn't need to take while on  remicade, and how to know when we can safely take him off of remicade without him getting worse again.

Thanks in advance


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## 723crossroads

mreyn said:


> Is there somewhere on the forum that will give me a simplified list of what my son needs for Crohns.. vitamins, supplements, etc. He is on Remicade and is doing ok, but the thought of him being on that scares us. So if there's someone who has brands, dosages, etc... I have been searching and searching and am so overwhelmed with trying to find what he needs, without  additives he doesn't in the correct doses,  in an easy to absorb formula, etc.  I'm also not sure what he doesn't need to take while on  remicade, and how to know when we can safely take him off of remicade without him getting worse again.
> 
> Thanks in advance


My advice to you would be to contact David, our administrator. He could help you better than anyone.I sent him a PM to contact you so, you should hear from him shortly.


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## CrohnsDaddy

While I didn't take the time to read this entire thread (some of the posts were long enough to reach novel status  ) I did get the overall "yeast is bad" tone.

IMO, that's using an overly broad brush to paint the picture. Just as there are good/bad bacteria, there are good/bad yeasts. Don't throw the baby out with the bathwater; you want to keep the good yeast/bacteria while getting rid of the bad.

I have been taking Sachromyces Boulardii yeast, and it is second only to prednisone on how well it helps control my CD symptoms.

I'll let the research do the talking...

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10961730:

"Abstract

The possible role of Saccharomyces boulardii, a nonpathogenic yeast with beneficial effects on the human intestine, in the maintenance treatment of Crohn's disease has been evaluated. Thirty-two patients with Crohn's disease in clinical remission (CDAI < 150) were randomly treated for six months with either mesalamine 1 g three times a day or mesalamine 1 g two times a day plus a preparation of Saccharomyces boulardii 1 g daily. Clinical relapses as assessed by CDAI values were observed in 37.5% of patients receiving mesalamine alone and in 6.25% of patients in the group treated with mesalamine plus the probiotic agent. Our results suggest that Saccharomyces boulardii may represent a useful tool in the maintenance treatment of Crohn's disease. However, in view of the product's cost, further controlled studies are needed to confirm these preliminary data."

I'm gonna summarize the information from Here (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20440854) to say that this study found Saccharomyces boulardii to be among the most effective of the yeasts and bacteria tested in this study at controlling inflammation.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19706150:

"Abstract

BACKGROUND: Saccharomyces boulardii, a well-studied probiotic, can be effective in inflammatory gastrointestinal diseases with diverse pathophysiology, such as inflammatory bowel disease (IBD), and bacterially mediated or enterotoxin-mediated diarrhoea and inflammation.

AIM: To discuss the mechanisms of action involved in the intestinal anti-inflammatory action of S. boulardii.

METHODS: Review of the literature related to the anti-inflammatory effects of this probiotic.

RESULTS: Several mechanisms of action have been identified directed against the host and pathogenic microorganisms. S. boulardii and S. boulardii secreted-protein(s) inhibit production of proinflammatory cytokines by interfering with the global mediator of inflammation nuclear factor kappaB, and modulating the activity of the mitogen-activated protein kinases ERK1/2 and p38. S. boulardii activates expression of peroxisome proliferator-activated receptor-gamma (PPAR-gamma) that protects from gut inflammation and IBD. S. boulardii also suppresses 'bacteria overgrowth' and host cell adherence, releases a protease that cleaves C. difficile toxin A and its intestinal receptor and stimulates antibody production against toxin A. Recent results indicate that S. boulardii may interfere with IBD pathogenesis by trapping T cells in mesenteric lymph nodes.

CONCLUSIONS: The multiple anti-inflammatory mechanisms exerted by S. boulardii provide molecular explanations supporting its effectiveness in intestinal inflammatory states."

Edit: Darn it, the links to pubmed aren't working anymore. I had the above links/texts saved from a couple years ago when I was researching S. Boulardii, and it looks like pubmed has revamped their cataloging system since that time. The quoted text was accurate from the studies linked to, even though the links themselves no longer point at the studies.

Another Edit: Here's a rather long one that goes in to some very specific detail of how S. Boulardii helps in IBD: http://physiologie.envt.fr/masterEQSA/IMG/pdf/Publi_EQSA_2.pdf


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## PollyH

S. boulardii has its good and bad points. It has been used as a probiotic for over 50 years. It had a nick name of "yeast against yeast." I guess people assumed it replaced a more harmful yeast. As you point out, this yeast may be of use in Crohn's, and can help get rid of a very nasty bacteria called C. difficile. The problem is that this yeast can also overgrow in the intestines. (Report from the Great Plains Laboratory.) It may also end up in the blood as well, making some people very ill. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC262466/  At the very least, if you wish to employ the S. boulardii, I would also try taking some of the bacteria probiotics that are normal intestinal residents, like found in the probiotic VSL#3.

Just because something is an effective probiotic doesn't mean it is entirely safe. There is also a potentially very serious problem with soil-based probiotics. If those overgrow and get into the blood, there are no antibiotics that get rid of them. If you wish to use soil-based probiotics, you might want to employ them for only a brief period of time, and follow up their use with something like the VSL#3 probiotics. Only a small amount of the soil-based probiotics can make a significant difference. From what I've read, there is no need to use high doses. 

VSL#3 probiotics have also been shown to keep Crohn's in remission. VSL#3 won't put a person into remission by itself, but it will extend the time of remission. High doses are needed to get this result.  VSL#3 consists of bacteria that are normal residents of the intestines. For that reason, I think it is a safer probiotic than the S. boulardii or the soil-based bacteria. However, as with anything, you might not tolerate a full therapeutic dose. Start very slow and work up to an amount you can tolerate. If it seems to be making things worse, stop. Even VSL#3 might make things worse.

I know of two reasons that the VSL#3 probiotic might pose a problem. 

1) It will put a high number of bacteria in the small intestine. If the housekeeper wave in the small intestine isn't working as well as it should, then the small intestine will have trouble removing the large amount of bacteria. This can make you ill. 

2) Blastocystis, a protozoan, lives off of bacteria in the intestines. Therefore taking a probiotic like VSL#3 might make that infection worse.

By the way, Blastocystis is a very common infection that is underdiagnosed. The newer DNA testing has found a much higher prevalence of this infection than previously suspected. Oregano oil will help get rid of this protozoa. The study I'm referring to employed 600 mg of oil of oregano per day for 6 weeks. [1] The type of oregano used was Oreganum vulgare, which is sometimes advertised as wild oregano. (You don't want to use other oreganos because they are often not as effective against pathogens.)

1. Force M, Sparks WS, Ronzio RA, Inhibition of enteric parasites by emulsified oil of oregano in vivo.Phytother Res. 2000 May;14(3):213-4.

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10815019 


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## PollyH

CrohnsDaddy said:


> Meds:
> Azathioprine - 100 mg.
> Pentasa - 1 gm.
> S. Boulardi yeast - 1 gm
> Vitamin D - 6,000 IU
> Magnesium - 500 mg
> Calcium - 1,000 mg
> Supportive Wife - 1 unit


What, only one supportive wife? :ysmile: My great great grandfather (Mormon) had 10 wives and 50 children. He had a rule: No more than 10 kids in a house at a time.


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## Ya noy

My God Polly,  

You certainly have done your research.  I'm going to need some time to digest all this.  Thanks!


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## 723crossroads

Is acidophyllis a safe one to take alot?


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## PollyH

723crossroads said:


> Is acidophilus a safe one to take alot?


Acidophilus is a normal resident of the intestines. It is usually found in the small intestine. It is one of the bacteria found in VSL#3. The same general rules apply to acidophilus as the VSL#3.


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## 723crossroads

Thanx Polly, wanted to make sure!!!


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## PollyH

A clinical trial of antifungal treatment in ulcerative colitis showed significantly reduced mucosal inflammation and reduced intensity of symptoms. Out of 89 colitis patients, 20 patients were selected who had a significant amount of fungus in their stool that was susceptible to Diflucan (an antifungal). These 20 patients were treated for 4 weeks with Diflucan. Another 15 of these patients had a significant amount of fungus in their stool that was NOT susceptible to Diflucan.  These 15 patients were treated for 4 weeks with lacidofil (a probiotic).  

“Antifungal treatment or administration of lacidofil in these patients significantly decreased the total mean activity index of colonic mucosa inflammation as compared with those not treated antifungally (8.5 +/-1.2 and 7.7 +/-1.7 vs. 10.6+/-1.8 respectively) (Fig. 2).” 

M. Zwolinska-Wcislo, et al. EFFECT OF CANDIDA COLONIZATION ON HUMAN ULCERATIVE COLITIS AND THE HEALING OF INFLAMMATORY CHANGES OF THE COLON IN THE EXPERIMENTAL MODEL OF COLITIS ULCEROSA

JOURNAL OF PHYSIOLOGY AND PHARMACOLOGY 2009, 60, 1, 107–118

http://www.jpp.krakow.pl/journal/ar...icle.pdf#page=1&zoom=110.00000000000001,0,849


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