# Juicing as a Viable Treatment option!



## Gianni

*Juicing as a Viable Treatment Option!*

Juicing!

In this juicing thread I will be going over a few points including the basics of juicing, juicing vs making smoothies, and juicing as a viable treatment option for crohns and other autoimmune diseases and then last but certainly not least i will be talking about organic versus non organic produce and why you want organic! I will be diving in deep on why Juicing is a Viable treatment option so please keep an open mind as you read. It's better to read this post with no preconceived notions.

If you just read the first paragraph and said to yourself  “I just want some juice recipes”… then click here.

First the BASICS OF JUICING: Juicing is essentially the liquefying of fruits and vegetables by grinding up fruits and veggies and extracting the pulp from them and separating the juice from the rest of the fruit or vegetable. This is very useful because you are able to super concentrate the amount of fruits and veggies that go into an 8oz glass of juice. By juicing you are turning 8 carrots (or anything else) into a fast and easily drinkable juice that utilizes all of the enzymes, vitamins, and minerals of the carrot. 

*Smoothies Versus Juicing!*

Smoothies provide great nutritional benefit any way you look at it. The main argument for smoothies is that smoothies retain the beneficial fiber that juices do not. This is very true but there are two main reasons why I chose to juice rather than make smoothies.

1. By removing the fiber from the liquid you are adding more concentrated doses of the juice. While it might take 4 carrots to make a full glass of carrot smoothie, it takes about 7 or 8 carrots to make a full glass of carrot juice. By extracting the pulp you are getting a super concentrated dose of the vitamins, enzymes and minerals within the carrots. Also when talking about crohns patients, fiber becomes somewhat of a scary word for some so juicing becomes a clear cut better option. 

2. Have you ever noticed in nature that when an animal gets sick, like maybe your house dog, that the first thing they do is either stop eating entirely or only eat plants in the backyard? Well its no coincidence. When animals get sick the first thing they do is stop eating. They do this because they realize that their body needs all the energy it can utilize to put towards fighting off the illness. Digestion is the greatest energy burner in the human body and the animals realize that eating will only tire the body out and spend way too much energy and consequently won’t be able to fight off the ailment with its full strength. The animals also might eat plants during this time because the animals also realizes that plants contain the highest level of energy while expending very little to digest. So by replenishing the body’s energy source with high energy/low energy cost foods, the animal is now giving the body the best shot at defeating the illness. Well people, we are animals, animals indeed. And just like your housedog our body needs to use a large portion of our energy to fight off our disease and give it the best fighting shot. So by excluding the fiber from the vegetables and just drinking the juice you are essentially fasting but at the same time replenishing your body with an extreme concentrated dose of energy so that it can go into superman mode and take care of your body. This is precisely why I am a proponent of 10+day juice fasts. 


*Juicing as a viable treatment option!*

I am someone who absolutely believes that crohn’s is cure-able through diet and lifestyle change. Call me a romantic, a dreamer, or a crazy, I don’t care but just read and research and find out for yourself. 

_After a long week in the hospital and having a camera stuck in my butt my doctor finally came in and explained to me I have a severe case of Crohn’s Disease. I look puzzled and confused and he proceeds to explain that Crohn’s is an abnormal response by your immune system as it attacks healthy tissue in your intestines. 
_
I’m sure a lot of you also had a similar explanation given; something about your immune system acting out of place or being broken in one-way or the other. 

I believe this line of thought is completely flawed. Our immune systems aren’t dumb, they aren’t confused, our immune systems aren’t double agents whom pulled a gun on us after years of loyal service, they are still doing their jobs! I believe that the immune system is attacking our intestines for a reason and that it isn’t strong enough to beat whatever it is attacking but it continues to rage war. If you get an infection on a cut after falling off your bike as a kid, the area around the cut gets inflamed and painful but the body does this to sanction the infection off so that the rest of the body isn’t in jeopardy. By inflaming the area, blood flow is restricted and the infection can’t spread. Now imagine we have a massive infection in our intestines, a strong infection, and our immune systems just can’t get a handle on it so it inflames the area but the infection fights back and creates ulcers, and abscesses and the like. 

Imagine for the remainder of the post that M.A.P. bacteria is responsible for crohn’s (I do not personally believe this, this is simply just to make the post flow easier, any possible cause could be placed in it’s place). 

For those who have researched M.A.P. bacterium, you know it a very resistant strain and is not easily beat. So if our immune systems aren’t strong enough to defeat the bacteria because of a weak genome (because of years of abuse on our bodies through horrible diet, antibiotics, and other environmental factors) then our immune system needs aid in order to get the upper hand. 

_So then two days later, after the biopsies confirmed a crohn’s diagnosis, my doctor walks into my hospital room and talks to me about treatment option. He talks to me about remicade, a  “good drug” but he warns me that it will SUPRESS my immune system and that I could be susceptible to infections or illness. I decide to trust my Doctor, I mean after all he studied for 8+ years on health... ... ... ... is health the right word? _

*After a year of treatment I had 3 bouts of pneumonia and constant colds. 

So instead of supporting our immune system and giving it the best chance it has to beat whatever it’s trying to get at, the doctors want us to suppress the immune system to alleviate SYMPTOMS. Well in some cases that’s all people want, hey if you can tell me that I can take this pill or shot and I will never have symptoms again, I’m in. But we all know that isn’t the case. The drugs work for only limited period of time and when you run out of drugs the disease comes back often with a vengeance.

Why does it always comeback with a vengeance!? WHY?!

Now imagine you are the M.A.P. bacteria and nothing would make you more happy but to destroy the hosts entire digestive tract. Well you have been raging hard in a war against the host’s immune system and things are getting heated. And just when your supplies start to run low…. Low and behold a miracle!!! Some magic reinforcement specimen named remicade came and attacked the immune system from the left flank and weakened it for the foreseeable future.:banana: You know what they say… when opportunity knocks…. So you gather all your strength and you get stronger and stronger because the immune system isn’t bothering you any longer and now because there is no inflammation you are free to spread to different areas of the body! YAYYY! 

_I wait about an hour to see my G.I. doc (Aren’t they always late?! What is with that?!) He goes over my recent test results and tells me I am showing high inflammation markers again. “The medicine isn’t working as well any longer”. “The CT scan shows it has spread to involve about 10 more inches of your small intestine” 
“What can I do doc?” …. …. …. … … “Have you heard of Humira?” _

So now pretend for this paragraph you are the Immune system. Some jerk named Remicade just cheap shotted you and after 3 months of recovery and battle you finally defeated Remicade. Now it’s time to get back at M.A.P. You look over the battle field and OH MY GOSH! THEY ARE EVERYWHERE! So now the M.A.P. has spread and gotten stronger so the immune system needs to involve more histamines and more inflammation to more parts of the intestines! 

And that is exactly what often happens after people have run their course of medication; Not only does crohn’s come back but it comes back with a vengeance because you allotted it the time to get stronger by taking the immunosuppressants.  

Now lets flip the treatment plan shall we? 

Imagine you are the immune system fighting this awful M.A.P. Bacterium and you just can’t do it. You are too weak. It is a David and Goliath situation but this time David isn’t going to win. So you send histamines to block off the infection through inflammation and just pray that reinforcements come through before it is too late! TADA! just when everything seems lost low and behold it’s the Vitamin Regiment and the Mineral Core! :luigi:

Organic natural Vitamins and minerals are what create a healthy and strong immune system.  I am sure most of you were Vitamin D deficient as well as other Vitamins. Vitamin D just happens to be one of the most important vitamins for a healthy immune system, along with Vitamin C. With years and years of abusing your body through antiobiotcs, which kill beneficial floral in the gut that helps synthesize and assimilate nutrients, junk food and other factors your immune system will be substantially weakened. 

When you juice you are getting a super concentrated dose of Vitamins and Minerals that are raw and natural. And with these new nutrients your body starts to detox and get rid of all harmful toxins. As toxins are being removed from your body, your liver starts to gain strength and when your liver gains strength your immune system starts getting strong. Vitamins are oh so important when it comes to health. Vitamins have sustained our genome through millions of years of evolution. Drugs are an invention that has only been around for a century and a half, yet we trust drugs more than we do million year old vitamins. 

Why juice though!?!?

You are the immune system again and you notice broccoli, carrots, spinach, and kale all coming down the digestive tract. An already fatigued body because of an intense battle being raged all of a sudden has to digest this large amount of food. So the body, instead of saving the energy for the battle at hand with M.A.P., has to put the energy to digesting the foods ( like I stated at the beginning). 

Now instead imagine fresh organic green vegetable juice comes down the digestive tract. YAYY!! A huge dose of energy is being assimilated and only a very very very little amount of energy needs to be used to digest the nutrients because its already in liquid form!!! So not only are you resting your gut and saving energy, but also you are giving your body an intense dose of energy and fresh vitamins and minerals so the immune system can use it at war!!! HOORAH! 


So after reading this you at the back of the class room asks “well can’t I just take multivitamins instead of having to juice for my vitamins” 


Well no you can’t just take a multivitamin and get all of the benfits because, an apple is much more than a nutritional facts chart containing this % of Vitamin that and that % of Vitamin this, an apple is a perfectly welded machine, built over thousands of years containing thousands of other chemicals to help the body. Scientists and researchers always try to separate the beneficial parts of a plant without realizing the importance of keeping the parts together. For example take Swiss Chard... Swiss Chard contains copper and Vitamin B2. Now copper alone plays an important role but to much copper can be very dangerous. Vitamin B2 doesn't do much alone. Add in mineral Molybdenum. Molybdenum is cool because it regulates copper (will force detox copper if it reaches high levels) and will also work with B2 in conversion of food to energy. There are a number of different cases like swiss chard in which alone, these chemicals are limited, but together these chemicals are strong.

Also it is estimated by many scientists that there are as many as 10,000 phytochemicals (or food chemicals) yet to be discovered. Furthermore many discovered Vitamins are left out of multi-vitamins like Vitamins B13-B17 (Vitamin b17 one of the more useful of all vitamins), vitamin Bp,Bt. Vitamin J, N, Q, T, and U... to name a few. So by taking multi vitamins you would be missing out on all of that!! 



*Organic versus non organic. *

Many people will think of organic verse non organic produce and think “I don’t see what the big deal is, pesticides are all around us” or “they wouldn’t put pesticides on plants if they harmed humans” 

First off, they would put pesticides on plants even if it harms humans, money talks not health… but that’s not what I’m going to talk about in this portion…

While the pesticide problem is a main reason why I choose to exclusively buy organic, it absolutely is not the only important factor at hand.. 

We start with the fertilizers, these so called fertilizers contain essentially three elements N, P, and K, (Nitrogen, Phosphorous, and Potassium). Let me be clear here, these elements are great and essential but they are the bare minimum in order for a plant to grow and bear fruit. The soil requires approximately 52 chemicals, not 3! Iron, Magnesium, Manganese, Copper, selenium, zinc, and so on and so forth are all missing. So what happens is the plants grow and because they aren’t achieving their own form on nutrition, their defenses weaken and they are now susceptible to bugs. So the bugs come and start eating the plants and so the farmers throw a fit or two and call the chemical companies up and tell them to fix it. So of course the Chemical companies are like:emot-dance: because nothing would make them more happy than to sell all these toxins that they are just sitting on. 

Now I want to tell a story, a story of an orange tree. Now this orange tree has come from a line of many other healthy orange trees but what’s different about this orange tree is that it isn’t in the same environment as its ancestors. Instead of being surrounded by healthy soil containing the 52 different elements, there are only 3 elements now. Hey but life goes on, you get lemons you make lemonade right? ( I would just plant a lemon tree with that lemon and have 40 more lemons) But anyways the tree begins to grow and its big and appears strong and it bears fruit like a champ but when the bugs come the next season his own form of an immune system (yes plants have immune systems too) is failing and isn’t strong enough to ward off the bugs. So the farmer calls the local dust cropper and wabam all the bugs are dead but now not only is the tree deficient but now it is toxic! And now the fruit that it bears will only contain very very few minerals (because that is how fruits and veggies get minerals, from the soil) and very few vitamins not to even mention the very large toxic elephant in the room. 

Now I want you to think about the story of the orange tree and basically fit your name in wherever I said orange tree. Now it’s a story of you and you came from a line of very strong you’s but you aren’t in the same environment. Instead of eating healthy unaltered foods, you are now eating toxic and deficient foods that contain very little vitamins and even fewer minerals. But hey life goes on. Yada yada yada something about a lemon or lime or something. But you grow up tall and maybe you appear strong but then the bugs come. The rheumatoid arthritis bug, the colitis bug, the lupus bug, the CROHNS BUG, and while your healthier ancestors would have combated these bugs no problem because of their sidekicks Vitamin D , B12, Magnesium, Copper and Zinc, you don’t find yourself so strong. You have been eating deficient toxic food your whole life much like the orange tree so the bugs infiltrate and you get sick. So you examine yourself and throw a fit or two and go crying to the pharmaceutical industry ( I swear you must be related to the orange, you are doing the exact same things! Talk about Deja vu!) just how the orange went crying to the chemical companies. Pharma is more than happy to sell you chemicals and then you let the cycle continue. 


That is why organic is so very important, I realize I may have took it a bit farther than many of you were prepared for but either way I think it is very educational. 



So I hope you read the ENTIRE thread and maybe you learned a bit of information. If you read this and maybe agree with me on a lot of my points, it is important for you to do research on your own. Don’t take my word for it, DO YOUR OWN RESEARCH. Knowledge is power. 

I hope I at least helped one person. And if you disagree with me on just about every point, I think the most important point that I believe in is that the immune system isn’t acting out of turn and isn’t stupid. It is attacking something, and if you believe that then maybe you will stay away from immunosuppressants.  

Anyways trying Juicing it can’t hurt you, what do you have to lose?!?!

Be the healthiest you can be, 
Gianni


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## NikkiMae

Thanks for posting this.  I was recently diagnosed (literally 9 days ago) with Crohn's.  I just discussed the possibility of juicing with a friend of mine.  I, of course, was put on medication right away.  40mg Prednisone and 750mg Metronidazole.  I'd like to finish my medication and then explore the option of juicing.

I have a few concerns.  The major one is, my BM's are already liquid and hard to control.  I'm afraid that if all I consume is liquids, my trips to the bathroom will be more frequent.  Another concern is that my schedule is extremely packed.  I'm afraid I won't have the time or means to constantly take juice with me every where.  I practically live in my car or at my college.

Also, do you attribute your remission or cure of Crohn's to juicing?  Again, thanks for the post.


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## Gianni

Hey Nikki,

You are very welcome, Glad i could help

To answer your questions:

Juice is liquid form but the fiber is removed and your body will literally absorb all of the juice. The whole principal behind diarrhea is that your body doesn't like what you gave it and it will try to get rid of it as soon as possible so the intestines don't take the time to digest the water that is mixed in with the food ( thats what makes diarrhea watery). While I'm on a juice fast i literally don't even have BM's. 

Time is a big issue for many. And it was a issue for me for a long time as-well. For when i know I am going to have a busy week what i do is on Sundays I will juice for the whole week and store the juice in jars and in the fridge. The nutrient loss will be minimal in air tight glass jars. So each day just open the fridge and grab a juice. 

I attribute my "almost cure" of crohn's to juicing and a plant based diet. I think juicing is the main reason but i also think raw fibrous vegetation is also extremely important. I say "almost cure" because I think it takes a long time to cure yourself especially because i had severe crohn's disease. I know that i am well on my way to being cured, i just don't think im quite there yet

Hope this helped

Gianni


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## CelesteStarr

I was scared that joining this forum i'd only have people suggesting steroids to me... Thank you for posting this! I have an amazing high quality juicer that I haven't taken advantage of  I'll get right to it tomorrow! Thanks again!


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## Gianni

CelesteStarr said:


> I was scared that joining this forum i'd only have people suggesting steroids to me... Thank you for posting this! I have an amazing high quality juicer that I haven't taken advantage of  I'll get right to it tomorrow! Thanks again!


You are very welcome! let me know how it goes!


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## Beach bum

I am a massive fan of juicing .
I do it every morning for breakfast. To answer the time issue question - it takes me about 5 minutes to juice a glass , give the dogs the left over pulp and rinse my machine parts - I give it a good soapy clean at the weekend when I do have a bit more time.

I believe that juicing and stopping people smoking around me are the two best things I did to help my disease. And I heartily recommend everyone at least tries it for all the reasons you have listed. Or even just to support the body while you receive treatment, it could alleviate side effects.

Whether it is enough on its own I cannot say as I am also taking immune suppressing drugs, But I will continue to juice whether I am on drugs or not, I am into it for life now I am sure.
In fact I am nearly having a panic attack about going on holiday in a couple of weeks ( where will I get my pure, fresh juice ! Nothing that comes in a bottle can compare ).


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## David

Thank you for putting so much effort into the post, I can tell you're passionate about the subject.  I personally think juicing is great, but in conjunction with other treatments, not as a standalone.  I also feel that you're doing more harm that good by stating you think this type of stuff will cure your IBD.  I believe it can help some people achieve or maintain remission but is not a cure but you and I have already had this debate 

Questions:

1.  What is your opinion on juicing organic fruits and vegetables versus non organic?
2.  Do you try to stay away from vegetables potentially high in nitrates?
3.  Are there any books you recommend for someone just starting out?  A step by step for people who want to get started would be invaluable.  I think there is a lot of interest but many are overwhelmed as to where to start.
4.  Not all Crohnies are alike.  Not all fruit and veggies are a like.  I just wonder if juicing can be taken to a whole new level.  Can we make the approach much more scientific.  For example, if someone has a deficiency in magnesium and calcium, is there a recipe for them.  If someone has Small Intestine Bacterial Overgrowth, are there recipes for them.  If someone is constipated, is there a recipe for them.  If someone is on Prednisone, is there a recipe for them.  If someone is on Methotrexate which interferes with folate, is there a recipe for them.  And on and on.  Thoughts on that?

Thanks again


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## ThanksP

I juice everyday and cannot imagine a day without it.  I do feel it has helped me immensely but it certainly didn't cure my Crohn's.  I believe it has helped in achieving my year long remission and given me a lot more energy.


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## Moe.

I remember on the Forum
That someone told about their 40 day juice FAST.
7 Months after the result he believed he was cured. Its a shame havent seen
him since. But hes been of all meds, and is perfectly health with normal BM.

So yes your "theory" correlates with the Juice Fast. It similiar to the SCD diets way of thinking, that there is definitely a Bacteria that the body is trying to get rid of but keeps on failing. Western Countries are the most susceptible to this.

Could be MAP , could be E.Coli, Could be anything.

I think everyone needs to expand their horizons and think of this example. 
Once a year I get a cold. Take medicine after 7 days all good.

In the future
Once A year i Get crohns, Juice fast for 20 days, back to normal. ( or take a pill which would actually work(one day)).


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## bangarang

Great post nice to see others preaching importance of juicing. Its funny people go on certain liquid_diets with ingredients full of synthetic unnatural crap in it but when you mention juicing real natural foods they usually look at you weird.


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## ctrl z

The first time I drank an all green juice (chard, kale, collards, etc), I had the most energy I've had in a good two years. I took a break from juicing but I'd like to start back. Thanks for the great post!


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## Gianni

David said:


> Thank you for putting so much effort into the post, I can tell you're passionate about the subject.  I personally think juicing is great, but in conjunction with other treatments, not as a standalone.  I also feel that you're doing more harm that good by stating you think this type of stuff will cure your IBD.  I believe it can help some people achieve or maintain remission but is not a cure but you and I have already had this debate
> 
> Questions:
> 
> 1.  What is your opinion on juicing organic fruits and vegetables versus non organic?
> 2.  Do you try to stay away from vegetables potentially high in nitrates?
> 3.  Are there any books you recommend for someone just starting out?  A step by step for people who want to get started would be invaluable.  I think there is a lot of interest but many are overwhelmed as to where to start.
> 4.  Not all Crohnies are alike.  Not all fruit and veggies are a like.  I just wonder if juicing can be taken to a whole new level.  Can we make the approach much more scientific.  For example, if someone has a deficiency in magnesium and calcium, is there a recipe for them.  If someone has Small Intestine Bacterial Overgrowth, are there recipes for them.  If someone is constipated, is there a recipe for them.  If someone is on Prednisone, is there a recipe for them.  If someone is on Methotrexate which interferes with folate, is there a recipe for them.  And on and on.  Thoughts on that?
> 
> Thanks again


Hiya David, 

I guess we will have to agree to disagree (once again, hmphhh) 
Before i answer your questions i'd like to ask you one: Why is it that you don't think diet can cure ailments such as crohns? What about the theory seems flawed to you? Also what is your own theory on crohns, do you believe that the immune system is flawed? Just curious cause I respect your opinions.

Answers: 
1. You know initially i had in my post the importance of organic versus non organic but i thought it would be too overwhelming for some people to have at the top of the post a "basics of juicing" section and then have a treatment option section and on top of that an even lengthier organic vs non organic section but i suppose after i read the post a few times it doesn't seem "too" overwhelming so i have edited it in at the end of the post. 

2. I don't exclusively stay away from the vegetables containing high nitrates for a couple reason. First off it is typically commercially grown produce that contains these high nitrate levels and i do only shop organic and most of the time at local farmers markets. The articfical fertilizers have been shown to double to amount of nitrates typically found in any vegetables especially those in the ground. Second and the main reason why i don't worry about it that much is because Vitamin C prevents nitrate turning into nitrate which is the dangerous stuff that starves your oxygen supply in blood. As long as you have Vitamin C and a rather good amount of it and try to shop organic nitrates really shouldn't be a problem. This is why i am such a proponent of Kale, kale has very high vitamin C levels for a leafy green and of course also contains many many many other benefits. 

3.You know I haven't read a juicing book. I figured a lot of stuff as i went along and researched online but there wasn't really one source that helped me get there. I know there are youtube videos that helped me buy a juicers and helped me get down the methods and rhymes and reasons to juicing but there really wasn't one source that helped me through it all. I would say just look up a beginning juicing book online but i really don't know if they would have the same line of thought as me. 

4. I'm glad you brought this up, you have read my mind . I am actually working on recipes for mineral and vitamin deficiencies. It is kind of a put down your supplement bottles and pick up these vegetables kind of deal so I am excited to be working on that and i will post it when im done. Many of the symptoms that come with crohn's would be healed along with crohns and seeing as crohns deal with the immune system just about any juice is going to strengthen the immune system alot. But I have thought about doing a complications of crohn's juice treatments like joint pain, eye inflammation, skin rashes, fatigue, thyroid problems, etc. As for the Methotrexate juices i never have thought about that. Very good idea. I could create a ideal juicing regiment for those who do want to maintain their treatments while adopting juicing. I will definitely look into that. Thanks

Hope that answered those questions !

Gianni





> Great post nice to see others preaching importance of juicing. Its funny people go on certain liquid_diets with ingredients full of synthetic unnatural crap in it but when you mention juicing real natural foods they usually look at you weird.


Thanks Bangarang! I know right? IT IS CRAZY how people look at me funny when i suggest vegetables and a healthy diet over pills. PILLS SHOULD BE THE THING THAT SOUNDS WEIRD. Ahh it is how everyone has been socialized... pill for every ill. I believe through the internet this idea will be broken.. all in good time  

Gianni


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## David

gtzucc said:


> Why is it that you don't think diet can cure ailments such as crohns? What about the theory seems flawed to you? Also what is your own theory on crohns, do you believe that the immune system is flawed?


To simplify, because I believe Crohn's has a genetic component.  If you have Celiac Disease and don't eat gluten, you don't cure what's wrong with you.  You might be 100% without gluten but you're not cured.  As soon as you eat gluten again, you're in trouble.  With Crohn's, I believe for some people, diet can take you to remission or at least assist getting to it.  You're not changing the underlying issue, you're bypassing it.  If you went back to your old eating habits, you'd flare right back up.  Thus you are not cured.



gtzucc said:


> 2. I don't exclusively stay away from the vegetables containing high nitrates for a couple reason. First off it is typically commercially grown produce that contains these high nitrate levels and i do only shop organic and most of the time at local farmers markets. The articfical fertilizers have been shown to double to amount of nitrates typically found in any vegetables especially those in the ground. Second and the main reason why i don't worry about it that much is because Vitamin C prevents nitrate turning into nitrate which is the dangerous stuff that starves your oxygen supply in blood. As long as you have Vitamin C and a rather good amount of it and try to shop organic nitrates really shouldn't be a problem. This is why i am such a proponent of Kale, kale has very high vitamin C levels for a leafy green and of course also contains many many many other benefits.


I assume you mean stopping nitrate turning into nitrite?  Can you link me to a reputable source that showcases that vitamin C does that please?  And I'm of the opinion that the real culprit in the reaction isn't so much nitrite, but peroxynitrite.  



gtzucc said:


> 4. I'm glad you brought this up, you have read my mind . I am actually working on recipes for mineral and vitamin deficiencies. It is kind of a put down your supplement bottles and pick up these vegetables kind of deal so I am excited to be working on that and i will post it when im done. Many of the symptoms that come with crohn's would be healed along with crohns and seeing as crohns deal with the immune system just about any juice is going to strengthen the juice alot. But I have thought about doing a complications of crohn's juice treatments like joint pain, eye inflammation, skin rashes, fatigue, thyroid problems, etc. As for the Methotrexate juices i never have thought about that. Very good idea. I could create a ideal juicing regiment for those who do want to maintain their treatments while adopting juicing. I will definitely look into that. Thanks


Very cool!  I look forward to seeing what you come up with.  Especially for the eye inflammation as I get that one


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## Gianni

> To simplify, because I believe Crohn's has a genetic component. If you have Celiac Disease and don't eat gluten, you don't cure what's wrong with you. You might be 100% without gluten but you're not cured. As soon as you eat gluten again, you're in trouble. With Crohn's, I believe for some people, diet can take you to remission or at least assist getting to it. You're not changing the underlying issue, you're bypassing it. If you went back to your old eating habits, you'd flare right back up. Thus you are not cured.


I don't see the connection here. I understand that yes if you don't eat gluten it doesn't mean you are cured. But that's like saying if you stay away from crohn's aggravating foods that doesn't mean you are cured. Of course not. I am not suggesting you take a sideline seat and play defensive im saying get on the offensive and help the immune system, be pro active and fix the underlying problems, im saying don't tread lightly around the big bully im saying gather your information, gather your knowledge and face it head on. 

It is changing the underlying issue though, what isn't changing the underlying issue is drugs. Drugs only treat symptoms. I get the feeling that you think diet also only treats symptoms, but food is amazingly powerful. 

What do you think the underlying issue is? If it is genetic why didn't our whole lineage have it, did your parents have it? mine didn't. 

In a society that keeps on popping up with all these condition we have to look at our systems of health in this country. What do we do drastically different that other countries aren't doing? Its our diet! if it looks like fire, and smells like fire it must be fire. By blaming genetics (and this is my opinion i want to stress that) you are essentially saying that if it looks like fire and smells like fire it must be a 20 ton whale. Or the smell of the fire is just being ignored. 

You have to recognize the underline problem to figure out the underline solution. Genetics are so complicated and confusing and with such a confusing disease its natural for people to blame the most complicated source because "if it was that simple my doctor would have told me". "If you want something done in this world you have to do it yourself" it is so true. 

Also if you can blame genetics it takes out the blame from you. When i was first diagnosed i said to myself "i was dealt bad hand" "there is nothing i can do about it" But that is non sense. Just how humans have created a stronger and stronger genome through evolution why can't we grow stronger.. why can't we take our own destiny in our hands just how primal humans did in the past. 

Also I know you believe that it has something to do with genetics. Do you have a theory on how the genetics have caused the crohns? For example do you think we just genetically have a broken immune system or are you unsure, you just believe that it has something to do with genetics? 

Sorry for the rant, i am fairly passionate about this stuff. 



> I assume you mean stopping nitrate turning into nitrite? Can you link me to a reputable source that showcases that vitamin C does that please? And I'm of the opinion that the real culprit in the reaction isn't so much nitrite, but peroxynitrite.


Oops yeah sorry about that i did mean nitrite. And yes of course, i have a source that actually does a study on peroxynitrite versus Vitamin C  (click that).

Hope that helped. 

Gianni


----------



## David

Fair enough.  Sorry to hijack the juicing part a little.  Let's focus on that now


----------



## Gianni

Oh no, don't apologize, i want people to bring forward their concerns.


----------



## Yannick

What kind of vegetable and fruits do you juice? In the main post you talk about brocoli but my doctor told me to stay away from brocoli and cauliflower and also bought apple juice but she said eating a apple is fine so I guess juicing a apple would be fine.

Are all juicer good ? I found this one http://www.walmart.ca/en/ip/big-bos...h=yes&fromSearchBox=true&addFacet=SRCH:juicer 

Right now I was told to stay away from pulpes since I am on a low fiber and residue diet so I guess this juicing could help me get some fruit and vegetables?


----------



## Gianni

Yannick said:


> What kind of vegetable and fruits do you juice? In the main post you talk about brocoli but my doctor told me to stay away from brocoli and cauliflower and also bought apple juice but she said eating a apple is fine so I guess juicing a apple would be fine.
> 
> Are all juicer good ? I found this one http://www.walmart.ca/en/ip/big-bos...h=yes&fromSearchBox=true&addFacet=SRCH:juicer
> 
> Right now I was told to stay away from pulpes since I am on a low fiber and residue diet so I guess this juicing could help me get some fruit and vegetables?


Hey Yannik. Click here for my 3 basic juices that I do. I will be updating that thread as time goes on with more juices but the first three are a good start. 

I am guessing that your doctor told you to stay away from broccoli and cauliflower because they are bulky vegetables and can cause a blockage if there is acute inflammation present in the gut. I was told the same thing. 

But if you juice the broccoli then the fiber is removed so there is no possible way that it can cause a blockage. Juicing apples are great, but in conjuction with other vegetables. ( you don't want to just juice apples as it is too much sugar). 

As for the different types of Juicers: http://www.fernsnutrition.com/juicer_types.htm This link will help you better understand the difference between the types. Also go on youtube and watch comparison videos between different juicers (That's what i did) 

Personally i have a super angel twin gear triturating juicer. It is expensive but i saved up because i knew i couldn't put a price on my health . 

Hope this helps

Gianni


----------



## Jennifer

David said:


> Fair enough.  Sorry to hijack the juicing part a little.  Let's focus on that now


I wouldn't mind reading a new thread made by either of you on the subject of genetics vs the American diet as possible causes. Would be entertaining and I might even weigh in.


----------



## Gianni

Crabby said:


> I wouldn't mind reading a new thread made by either of you on the subject of genetics vs the American diet as possible causes. Would be entertaining and I might even weigh in.


Noted

Gianni


----------



## Yannick

Damn I hate canada for products lol I think I will go with this one http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16896705238 
This could be a good starter I guess it has good reviews on amazon.com and I get free shipping. At 70$ I wont be too pissed if I hate juicing lol. It sucks because in the U.S its only 49$ -_-


----------



## Gianni

Sounds good Yannick Wow i didn't know amazon changed the price based on the country. 

Anyhow, let me know how you like it.

Gianni


----------



## Yannick

Nah the problem is the shipping the damn border tax is insane. I just saw I could get the better version for just 2$ more lol look more solid I will get that one ;p http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16896705313 wich is 59$ on amazon.com so I don't feel as ripped off haha.

Edit: Ahh crap just noticed it was newegg.com and not .ca  they don't have it in canada fail.... hehe


----------



## Gianni

That is a bummer, I love amazon! :Karl:. 

haha perfect good luck

Gianni

edit: Ahh oh no, lol  bummer!


----------



## Ozboz

I got the phillips quick clean juicer i love the thing it is a powerful centrifugal juicer and has a special lid on the jug that takes the foam of the juice. Im starting a juice fast tomorrow don't know how long ill last but gonna give it my all


----------



## Gianni

Great ozboz! I love Juice Fasts, I am actually considering doing a 60 day juice fast this summer anyhow, good luck!


----------



## colonless

I read your article and find it very interesting and informative, it makes a lot sense.  This could quite possibly be a viable and hopefully even probable alternative to the current medical protocol of reactive treatments currently being used and prescribed.  Perhaps the use of a proactive approach as you suggest may even work......it certainly could not hurt?
Thanks!


----------



## ThanksP

While I ABSOLUTELY believe in juicing, there are some veggies that can contradict Crohn's treatments and also other ailments (i.e diabetes, kidney issues, cancer treatments, and certain meds).  It's DEFINTELY best to research which veggies work for which ailments.  For instance, if you have history of kidney stones, spinach, swiss chard, parsley should be avoided because of their high oxalate qualities.  WIth Diabetes there are a whole host of veggies (Beets) and fruits you should avoid whether juicing or eating in its natural state.  Also, if you are on blood thinners; there are an entire other group of food and supplements you should avoid or at least take in small moderation.  As far as cancer treatments (as I learned with my 11 year old nephew, juicing many veggies can inhibit treatment).  So while I can say juicing is an INCREDIBLE way to supplement diet, it is also something you MUST discuss with your doctor.  If your doctor doesn't know about juicing and it's benefits/contradictions, then PLEASE find another PROFESSIONAL opinion.

I take Turmeric (Curcumin) as a supplement but was unhappy to find studies how it can interact with certain chemotherapy treatments.  Thankfully Infliximab (Remicade) was not included in that study, but my dear nephews drug WAS included.  And he's been taking Curcumin and battling Lymphoma for over a year now.  I am all for finding an herbal/holistic treatment but I don't want to counteract his treatments with some unregulated herbal concoction either.

Basically, just please educate yourself first and no matter what, TELL YOUR DOCTOR EVERY supplement/vitamin you are taking.  They can completely contraindicate.


----------



## Ozboz

Here is an excellent book that I found on juicing and it tells you what combinations of veg/fruit and what quantities for all types of conditions/diseases I highly recommend it.

Fresh vegetable and fruit juices   whats missing in your body by N.W. Walker D.Sc


----------



## Ozboz

ThanksP said:


> Basically, just please educate yourself first and no matter what, TELL YOUR DOCTOR EVERY supplement/vitamin you are taking.  They can completely contraindicate.


A doctor once told me that all supplements are crap and that I shouldn't take anything except for what he prescribes he said all over the counter supplements are hocus pocus all his stuff ever did was make me more sick and supplements make me feel better go figure


----------



## Gianni

ThanksP said:


> While I ABSOLUTELY believe in juicing, there are some veggies that can contradict Crohn's treatments and also other ailments (i.e diabetes, kidney issues, cancer treatments, and certain meds).  It's DEFINTELY best to research which veggies work for which ailments.  For instance, if you have history of kidney stones, spinach, swiss chard, parsley should be avoided because of their high oxalate qualities.  WIth Diabetes there are a whole host of veggies (Beets) and fruits you should avoid whether juicing or eating in its natural state.  Also, if you are on blood thinners; there are an entire other group of food and supplements you should avoid or at least take in small moderation.  As far as cancer treatments (as I learned with my 11 year old nephew, juicing many veggies can inhibit treatment).  So while I can say juicing is an INCREDIBLE way to supplement diet, it is also something you MUST discuss with your doctor.  If your doctor doesn't know about juicing and it's benefits/contradictions, then PLEASE find another PROFESSIONAL opinion.
> 
> I take Turmeric (Curcumin) as a supplement but was unhappy to find studies how it can interact with certain chemotherapy treatments.  Thankfully Infliximab (Remicade) was not included in that study, but my dear nephews drug WAS included.  And he's been taking Curcumin and battling Lymphoma for over a year now.  I am all for finding an herbal/holistic treatment but I don't want to counteract his treatments with some unregulated herbal concoction either.
> 
> Basically, just please educate yourself first and no matter what, TELL YOUR DOCTOR EVERY supplement/vitamin you are taking.  They can completely contraindicate.


Thanks for the post. 



> there are some veggies that can contradict Crohn's treatments and also other ailments (i.e diabetes, kidney issues, cancer treatments, and certain meds).


Not sure cancer treatments and "certain meds" could be considered ailments but i digress. 

yes some fruits and veggies can contradict with crohn's treatment. Actually everything about fruits and veggies contradicts many treatments seeing as the theory behind juicing is to boost immune system while many treatments want to suppress the immune system. 

As for diabetes, it is a shame that people have demonized fruits for a diabetic. So many food chemicals present in fruits tremendously help the pancreas. Many diabetics have an inflamed pancreas and fruits such as blueberries, tomatoes, pomegranates, and cherries contain extremely strong anti inflammatory antioxidants. Also natural sugars and soluble fiber found in fruits will release these sugars into the blood stream slowly as to not onset a sugar spike ( a kind of natural failsafe for the body) so the pancreas can better handle the fruits. It is a shame that diabetics don't trust fruits because they will be planning their diets and tell themselves that they can't have fruit, yet many will have "cheats" and those cheats often contain highly processed and refined sugars that don't contain the same failsafes or antioxidants. Also in my juice thread i stress the importance of not adding too much fruit in the juices as super concentrated doses can be a lot for your body to handle. So yes diabetics should be careful on such a regiment, but should they avoid? I think not. 

As for the Kidney stones part. 
Firstly i want to point out that these high oxalate levels in these vegetables are only found in commercially grown produce, not in organic or local produce. 

The way i see it is that there are MUCH bigger fish to fry in this department than certain vegetables. These bigger fish include processed sugars, carbonated beverages, animal products, soy and sodium rich foods, and calcium supplements. 

Seeing as three of those describe soda, I think its safe to say soda is public enemy #1. The extreme low ph level along with the processed sugars, phosphoric acid carbonation, and high levels of sodium all extract calcium from the bones and excretes through the urine which GREATLY increases the chance of a kidney stone. 

Animal protein contains the amino acids methionine and cysteine which are sulfur-containing amino acids. When the proteins are digested the sulfuric acid remains which is essentially battery acid. To equalize this, the body extracts calcium from the bones (calcium is a base (high ph level). This process is called metabolic acidosis. The calcium is then extracted through the urine and greatly increases the chances of developing a kidney stone. This process explains why the united states is the number one consumer of non fat dairy and has the highest level of osteoporosis and other bone degenerative diseases. By making milk non fat more animal protein is added and in turn your body extracts calcium from the bones. Not exactly what the "got milk" commercials told you huh? 

I don't think i need to explain calcium supplements here. I think it is self explanatory. If not a quick google search should yield some results. 

Just like how i mentioned before, fruits and vegetables contain failsafes or adaptive measures in which the body will utilize other elements of the fruit or vegetable in order to take care of the initial problem. For example the vegetables you stated that could cause kidney stones, also contain vitamins and minerals that will prevent kidney stones. These minerals include magnesium and potassium. Even Vitamin C (which is always trying to be linked to cause kidney stones but never has) actually helps prevent kidney stones through a couple of ways. First off Vitamin C will actually keep calcium bound to its true form instead of binding with the oxalates. Second Vitamin C is a diuretic which will keep urine flow constant which disrupts the environment for a stone to form. Further more evidence supports that kidney stones develop around a bacterial infection. Vitamin C is a strong anti bacterial 

Vitamin C, magnesium, and/or potassium are present in a qualitative quantity in most fruits and vegetables so while yes oxalates are present in these vegetables, so are these vitamins and minerals. Also seeing as food scientists estimate 10,000 food chemicals yet to be identified exist, I think it is safe to say other factors are at hand. 

The truth is many people try to point the finger at fruits or vegetables but these are exactly what has sustained our genome for millions of years. Our bodies developed benefits from these fruits and vegetables and in no way would these fruits and vegetables still be doing humans harm if we had adapted to them over millions of years. A common mis conception is that fruit and vegetables just contain these great benefits because that's how they were made. But if humans had never encountered these fruits or vegetables before in history, we would probably see huge adverse reactions from them and we wouldn't find any benefit in them. But the human genome found ways for plants to benefit us directly so no it wouldn't find benefits from fruits and vegetables but at the same time cause a problem like kidney stones... that doesn't make sense. (hopefully that paragraph made sense.. makes sense to me)


Having said that yes i do agree that people should seek professional advise on the matter of nutrition and definitely if used in conjunction with other treatments.  

I was in no way saying i was a "PROFESSIONAL" of the matter. 

I guess the way i see it is that the medical treatments are interfering with the vegetables not the other way around

Anyways, thanks for the post, you brought up many points that people should look into. I wish you and your nephew the best

Good luck

Gianni


----------



## Paulsa

Great Post
Many thanks for the massive effort.


----------



## Gianni

Ozboz said:


> Here is an excellent book that I found on juicing and it tells you what combinations of veg/fruit and what quantities for all types of conditions/diseases I highly recommend it.
> 
> Fresh vegetable and fruit juices   whats missing in your body by N.W. Walker D.Sc


Thanks ozboz, i will look into this I have actually been working on a similar system, kind of a treatment plan for many conditions. I love learning about different conditions, the organs involved, and what fruits and veggies will help that organ. So this could prove to be very helpful. 

Thanks 

Gianni


----------



## Ozboz

Gianni have a squiz at the book its grouse tells the origins of difrent disease and conditions and tells you what formulas of juice are used to treat them


----------



## Jennifer

My mom is a type 2 diabetic and fruits do make her blood sugar spike. She doesn't avoid fruit entirely but can only handle a little at a time unfortunately.


----------



## Gianni

Thanks crabby, Yes as often seen diabetics can only handle a small amount of fruit at a time but really anyone shouldn't be indulging themselves in CERTAIN fruits at any given time either. 

I wonder if she experiences less severe blood sugar spikes with fruit versus a typical sugary snack. Even though fruit might cause a slight sugar spike there is evidence supporting that the natural sugars release at a slower rate. But then again maybe fruit will provide a longer sugar spike (although i think longer is favorable over acute). Fruits have tons of other benefits though, benefits which will help the pancreas 

Anyways, thanks for the post.

All the best to your mom,

Gianni


----------



## ThanksP

Ozboz said:


> A doctor once told me that all supplements are crap and that I shouldn't take anything except for what he prescribes he said all over the counter supplements are hocus pocus all his stuff ever did was make me more sick and supplements make me feel better go figure


I hope you found another doctor ASAP.


----------



## Wooddy

Wow Gianni, 

    You put a lot of work into this.  I see the fire is burning inside you!  

I love organic foods as well.  I definitely go for organic when I have the option because pesticides are nasty!  Not only are they nasty but they are used everywhere.  It is especially important to watch out for food grown in other countries and scrutinize the origin when you're buying produce out of season.  

From time to time there may be various news stories that report the FDA stopped the importation of specific foreign crops due to toxic levels of pesticides that may not be banned in other countries.  We also don't want to forget that there are very toxic pesticides that are legal for American farmers to use.  The FDA has a hard enough time regulating food safety in our own country let alone from all the countries that we import food from.  In light of this fact, we cant really be sure that toxic pesticides (whether banned in this country or not) are not in our food supply.  If we buy food from commercial suppliers like some of the grocery stores chains do, then it stands to reason that some of the food we eat may have been cultivated or raised using toxic pesticides and/or hormones.

Some links about pesticides in our food.

http://www.who.int/bulletin/volumes/86/3/07-041814/en/

http://www.puristat.com/standardamericandiet/pesticides.aspx


One thing that I found in buying organically labeled food in the grocery store is that sometimes, foods are labeled organic that don't truly deserve the organic label.  It's hard to tell exactly how some of the produce is grown, or the conditions that the livestock were raised in unless you go to the farm yourself, but like you said, money talks.  The extra premium people pay for organic food is enough to make some farmers try and skirt the rules or walk the line that determines if an organic label is warranted.   It's in our best interest to find out more about the organic farmers that we buy from and not just trust the organic label on it's own.

One great way to ensure your produce is organic is to grow it yourself.  If you have a little bit of land it's not too hard to do.  Personally, I have been gardening since I was old enough to hold a shovel.  It's hard work sometimes, but I am rewarded with food grown the way nature intended.   This years harvest was bountiful, and of course it was completely organic.  

Some of my friends that live in apartments or those who are unable to keep their own garden joined an organic gardening commune where they all contribute a little time to grow the foods they want.  That is a great way to get involved in organic gardening and be 100% certain that your food is completely natural.

One problem I have is that I can't have livestock in my neighborhood. I would love to have a rooster in my back yard, but my neighbors would probably kill me.  When I am buying meat or produce that I don't grow myself I try to go to local farmers markets and buy from vendors that I am familiar with.  However, this is not always possible, so I make it a point to read labels carefully before I buy something, from the supermarket.  This drives my wife nuts sometimes, especially if I tell her she can't use 1/2 the coupons she cut out because the associated products are questionable.     

I try to take as many reasonable measures as I can to ensure what I grow is all natural.  For instance, I like to start from seed when possible and make my own compost to fortify the soil.  It's a lot of fun and as far as I am concerned, no tomato from the grocery store (organic or not) beats a tomato picked from the vine the my back yard.

My neighbors think I am nuts for growing so many veggies for just me and my wife.  Maybe I am a little "nuts", :ybatty: the juices and sauces I make freeze well so I am able to enjoy their nutritious benefits in the winter time while my "sane" neighbors are eating their store bought pesticide laden produce.  :rof:


----------



## David

GORGEOUS Wooddy!

And I agree, there's usually little better than growing our own


----------



## mnsun

Limited Vege to Vitamin/Mineral Cheat Sheet

Magnesium: Spinach, Swiss Chard, Lima Beans, Arugula, Peas

Folate: Spinach, Asparagus, Curly Endive, Romain Lettuce, Turnip Greens

Vitamin K: Kale, Spinach, Collard Greens, Turnip Greens, Swiss Chard

Potassium: Sweet Potato, Lima Beans, Spinach, Swiss Chard, Mushrooms

*This is a VERY limited excerpt from a rather narrow minded _Nutrition Action Health Letter_ from the Center for Science in the Public Interest--I don't endorse most/everything this random publication prints, I just so happened to be reading this when this thread caught my eye.

One can easily google "food sources for magnesium" etc... and be better informed.  Notice Spinach made every list above.  Also note it depends on the soil medium whether such minerals are still present.


----------



## bangarang

Ozboz said:


> A doctor once told me that all supplements are crap and that I shouldn't take anything except for what he prescribes he said all over the counter supplements are hocus pocus all his stuff ever did was make me more sick and supplements make me feel better go figure


Doctors like that should face a jail time. No joke.


----------



## Gianni

That's awesome Woody. 

I convinced my parents to allow a small garden at my childhood home so i could plant organic plants for them and myself Unfortunately I live in an apartment and can't really have a garden for my own. So i will make it a point to travel there every once in awhile and pick some produce But yes i agree with all the points you made

Beautiful Garden! Im jealous

Gianni


----------



## Crohnie86

I've tried Juicing as well, but didnt have a very positive result. My problem, unlike many others, isnt diarrhea, its actually constipation. I initially went on the Juicing diet in order to make an attempt to alleviate the severe constipation I've been experiencing since I was born. I used Kale, carrotts, peaches, apples, raspberries, pears, and blackberries. I used a few other veggies as well, it just escapes me which ones at the moment. My brain is a little foggy. Anyway, I did that along with one capful of Miralax, and still didnt poop. 
Well, believe it or not, ever since I started eating regular foods again (and even some fast food), my stool is loose. I'm a medical mystery at this point...


----------



## Jennifer

Gianni said:


> I wonder if she experiences less severe blood sugar spikes with fruit versus a typical sugary snack. Even though fruit might cause a slight sugar spike there is evidence supporting that the natural sugars release at a slower rate. But then again maybe fruit will provide a longer sugar spike (although i think longer is favorable over acute). Fruits have tons of other benefits though, benefits which will help the pancreas


Both go in quickly. She avoids any type of white breads and sugary snacks. She's very good about her diet. She also says that oranges go in the quickest. As far as how long the blood sugar is raised, you really don't want your blood sugar to be raised for a longer period of time because you will experience undesirable symptoms with a blood sugar spike.


----------



## Gianni

Crohnie86 said:


> I've tried Juicing as well, but didnt have a very positive result. My problem, unlike many others, isnt diarrhea, its actually constipation. I initially went on the Juicing diet in order to make an attempt to alleviate the severe constipation I've been experiencing since I was born. I used Kale, carrotts, peaches, apples, raspberries, pears, and blackberries. I used a few other veggies as well, it just escapes me which ones at the moment. My brain is a little foggy. Anyway, I did that along with one capful of Miralax, and still didnt poop.
> Well, believe it or not, ever since I started eating regular foods again (and even some fast food), my stool is loose. I'm a medical mystery at this point...



May I ask the extent you tried juicing too? How often, for how long and typically fruits or veggies? 

When first diagnosed I also actually suffered from constipation and not diarrhea. The thing about juicing is that it doesn't include fiber so if you have a problem with constipation, adding in smoothies intermittently would help with that. Try drinking a ton of water. Some people need more water than others. 

Also the process behind diarrhea is that the body is trying to get rid of the food (because it doesn't agree with it, or cannot use it at the time being) as fast as possible so it doesn't take the time to digest the water (thats what makes D watery) So the fact that fast food creates "loose stools" doesn't surprise me because your body probably isn't liking what you are giving it so it is allowing water to come out with the food. (Kind of your form of D). Its worth noting that just because stools seem normal, does not mean your body is benefitting from that food. 

With that said, I think giving nutrition another chance is worth it. Maybe try making smoothies versus juicing until you get the constipation under control. Also try including more veggies over fruits, 5 of the 7 plants you named were fruits. try to do 5 of the 7 being vegetables

Gianni


----------



## Crohnie86

Gianni said:


> May I ask the extent you tried juicing too? How often, for how long and typically fruits or veggies?
> 
> When first diagnosed I also actually suffered from constipation and not diarrhea. The thing about juicing is that it doesn't include fiber so if you have a problem with constipation, adding in smoothies intermittently would help with that. Try drinking a ton of water. Some people need more water than others.
> 
> Also the process behind diarrhea is that the body is trying to get rid of the food (because it doesn't agree with it, or cannot use it at the time being) as fast as possible so it doesn't take the time to digest the water (thats what makes D watery) So the fact that fast food creates "loose stools" doesn't surprise me because your body probably isn't liking what you are giving it so it is allowing water to come out with the food. (Kind of your form of D). Its worth noting that just because stools seem normal, does not mean your body is benefitting from that food.
> 
> With that said, I think giving nutrition another chance is worth it. Maybe try making smoothies versus juicing until you get the constipation under control. Also try including more veggies over fruits, 5 of the 7 plants you named were fruits. try to do 5 of the 7 being vegetables
> 
> Gianni


To be more specific....
We have a Vitamix Blender (yes, one of those $500 blenders. No, I dont know why he felt the need to invest that much in a blender hehehe)...
I would place all the fruits and veggies into the blender, blend for a few minutes until it turns them into a smoothie or juice, add Miralax, blend more, and drink :smile:

The Vitamix is famous for having the ability to add solid fruits and veggies without destroying the blender, including the core.

It always looked gross, but the fruit added the good flavor so I would drink right up. 

I did it for probably a week until I got so sick I just couldnt get out of bed to make anymore. Then I ended up in the ER....


----------



## Crohnie86

So it just occured to me....I guess what I did wasnt exactly juicing. It was more like "eating straight-up fruits and veggies in smoothie/liquid form". I know the blender enables me to do that, but not everyone has a Vitamix so I guess I have that benefit.


----------



## Gianni

Crohnie86 said:


> To be more specific....
> We have a Vitamix Blender (yes, one of those $500 blenders. No, I dont know why he felt the need to invest that much in a blender hehehe)...
> I would place all the fruits and veggies into the blender, blend for a few minutes until it turns them into a smoothie or juice, add Miralax, blend more, and drink :smile:
> 
> The Vitamix is famous for having the ability to add solid fruits and veggies without destroying the blender, including the core.
> 
> It always looked gross, but the fruit added the good flavor so I would drink right up.
> 
> I did it for probably a week until I got so sick I just couldnt get out of bed to make anymore. Then I ended up in the ER....


Yes, I am familiar with the Vitamix blender. I hope that your one experience hasn't turned you completely off of juicing and blending. I would hope you give it another shot as many people suffering from constipation has found relief through blending. Also try more veggies over fruit next time. I know it might not taste good but are you trying to please your taste buds or feel better?  

Also juicing is different from blending if you are not aware. doing a quick google search on the matter will help better demonstrate that. 

All the best

Gianni


----------



## Gianni

Crohnie86 said:


> So it just occured to me....I guess what I did wasnt exactly juicing. It was more like "eating straight-up fruits and veggies in smoothie/liquid form". I know the blender enables me to do that, but not everyone has a Vitamix so I guess I have that benefit.


Well with the blender the fiber is included while juicing removes fiber. Theres no better way (blending vs juicing) for a normal healthy person,  they both have their own benefits. But for sick people I believe juicing is much more useful. See my Juicing vs Blending section at the top of the first post. 

Gianni


----------



## Crohnie86

Gianni said:


> Yes, I am familiar with the Vitamix blender. I hope that your one experience hasn't turned you completely off of juicing and blending. I would hope you give it another shot as many people suffering from constipation has found relief through blending. Also try more veggies over fruit next time. I know it might not taste good but are you trying to please your taste buds or feel better?
> 
> Also juicing is different from blending if you are not aware. doing a quick google search on the matter will help better demonstrate that.
> 
> All the best
> 
> Gianni


No, it hasnt. I actually really enjoyed it. It made me feel like I was pursuing a healthier lifestyle. Honestly I just havent been doing it lately because I've been bed-ridden for the past month or so. I'm slowly becoming accustomed to being up and about again, but its taking time. Ive honestly completely lost my appetite, but I know I need the nutrients. I'm going to head back to Whole Foods some time this week and get back to it. 

I have to be careful about the fruits and veggies I add. My body doesnt take well to Vitamin C, and I seem to get a lot of ulcers from it, so I try to intake as little as possible. I know its counter-productive for other issues, but the ulcers are so painful...


----------



## Gianni

Crohnie86 said:


> No, it hasnt. I actually really enjoyed it. It made me feel like I was pursuing a healthier lifestyle. Honestly I just havent been doing it lately because I've been bed-ridden for the past month or so. I'm slowly becoming accustomed to being up and about again, but its taking time. Ive honestly completely lost my appetite, but I know I need the nutrients. I'm going to head back to Whole Foods some time this week and get back to it.
> 
> I have to be careful about the fruits and veggies I add. My body doesnt take well to Vitamin C, and I seem to get a lot of ulcers from it, so I try to intake as little as possible. I know its counter-productive for other issues, but the ulcers are so painful...


You have lost your appetite because your body is telling you, you need the save the energy that would otherwise be lost through digestion. So by juicing you are respecting your body's wishes by consuming only a liquid diet that will only require very little energy to digest while also giving your body a boost of energy to help deal with what it is dealing with. 

Sure, stay away from most fruits for the time being. My brother had the same problem but after he started juicing just veggies it went away and his mouth ulcers were no longer aggravated by acidic fruits. Most veggies are alkaline so you don't really need to worry about those. Just limit the fruits for the time being. 

Gianni


----------



## Beach bum

I usually juice mostly veg, carrot , celery , cucumber with one apple to sweeten it.

Someone gave me three cucumbers from their garden the other day, the smell as I juiced them and the intense flavour of the juice made me realise that i have never tasted a "real" cucumber before. I must make an effort to grow some veg next year - shame our weather is so unpredictable :yrolleyes:


----------



## Gianni

Beach bum said:


> I usually juice mostly veg, carrot , celery , cucumber with one apple to sweeten it.
> 
> Someone gave me three cucumbers from their garden the other day, the smell as I juiced them and the intense flavour of the juice made me realise that i have never tasted a "real" cucumber before. I must make an effort to grow some veg next year - shame our weather is so unpredictable :yrolleyes:


Yup A truly fresh (any vegetable or fruit) always tastes much better than what you remember!


----------



## KayleighMeek

I have just started lookin into juicing and have to say I am really interested and think I may give it a go. I have been having problems with arthritis which usually means a flare is on its way and want to try and keep it at bay with juicing along with my normal medications. I have found this really interesting to read and hopefully will benefit me as I want to come off methotrexte next year this gives me hope


----------



## musicislife52

Crohnie86 said:


> I've tried Juicing as well, but didnt have a very positive result. My problem, unlike many others, isnt diarrhea, its actually constipation. I initially went on the Juicing diet in order to make an attempt to alleviate the severe constipation I've been experiencing since I was born. I used Kale, carrotts, peaches, apples, raspberries, pears, and blackberries. I used a few other veggies as well, it just escapes me which ones at the moment. My brain is a little foggy. Anyway, I did that along with one capful of Miralax, and still didnt poop.
> Well, believe it or not, ever since I started eating regular foods again (and even some fast food), my stool is loose. I'm a medical mystery at this point...



I get constipated as well, and smoothies have helped keep me regular. I would like to try juicing on top of smoothies, but already spent so much on my Vitamix.. One day. 

To save time I make a whole blender-full worth of smoothies and store them in Ball jars so I can just grab them and go. 

If you aren't feeling well drinking smoothies, experiment with the types of produce you are using. Maybe one or more of them are trigger foods, or they aren't properly combined. Also, make sure to use fully ripe produce so it's easy to digest.


----------



## Gianni

Vitamix is still awesome! you will see and feel the benefit!


----------



## Gianni

Ozboz said:


> Here is an excellent book that I found on juicing and it tells you what combinations of veg/fruit and what quantities for all types of conditions/diseases I highly recommend it.
> 
> Fresh vegetable and fruit juices   whats missing in your body by N.W. Walker D.Sc


Great book, a lil outdated but nonetheless a good read Thanks ozboz

Gianni


----------



## 2thFairy

Ozboz said:


> A doctor once told me that all supplements are crap and that I shouldn't take anything except for what he prescribes he said all over the counter supplements are hocus pocus all his stuff ever did was make me more sick and supplements make me feel better go figure


I was just going to mention this as well, Ozboz.  I am a medical transcriptionis and listen to a ton of patient medication lists.  Most doctors complete dismiss supplements with the exception of folic acid, calcium, vitamin D, vitamin B12, vitamin C and fish oil.  In the US, if a patient is on any supplement  deemed "an Eastern remedy," that is the first thing doctors tell patients to discontinue.



ThanksP said:


> Basically, just please educate yourself first and no matter what, TELL YOUR DOCTOR EVERY supplement/vitamin you are taking.  They can completely contraindicate.


However, like ThanksP said, it is still soooooo important that you tell your doctor every supplement you are taking because there are some that have severe adverse effects when mixed with traditional medicine.


----------



## Ozboz

Gianni said:


> Great book, a lil outdated but nonetheless a good read Thanks ozboz
> 
> Gianni


Yeah I thought you'd like it I think it was first published in the sixties


----------



## Gianni




----------



## Thermo

Crabby said:


> I wouldn't mind reading a new thread made by either of you on the subject of genetics vs the American diet as possible causes. Would be entertaining and I might even weigh in.


This has been thoroughly researched no need to reinvent the wheel, the genetic link has been well established. But of course it is linked to diet the majority of ailments today are due in some part to what we ingest. However think of it this way, if there was no genetic cause why doesn't everyone have crohns? If only what we ate caused Crohns every single person on this planet would have it and we would all have diabetes and so on. So there is a diet connection but to shun genetics is like saying evolution doesn't exist, it's bad science and it's dangerous.


----------



## Gianni

Thermo said:


> This has been thoroughly researched no need to reinvent the wheel, the genetic link has been well established. But of course it is linked to diet the majority of ailments today are due in some part to what we ingest. However think of it this way, if there was no genetic cause why doesn't everyone have crohns? If only what we ate caused Crohns every single person on this planet would have it and we would all have diabetes and so on. So there is a diet connection but to shun genetics is like saying evolution doesn't exist, it's bad science and it's dangerous.


I'm not sure you understand diet. I think you believe on piece of food is the equivalent to the other. Diabetes is proven to be caused by diet and is proven to be prevented by diet. 

I feel like your saying because everyone on the planet eats then everyone would get crohn's if there wasn't a genetic link... ? Food is very different. The American Diet is proving to be the reason why America is so sick. America is the sickest nation in the world and many believe the diet is to blame... that is a well known concept. 

I don't understand your line of thought. please elaborate. 

Gianni


----------



## 2thFairy

Not all diabetes is caused by diet and prevented by diet.  There are different types of diabetes and there is a genetic link.


----------



## Wooddy

Gianni,

    Although you bring up some very good points, it's important to try to keep everything together in the correct context in order to get your point across.  2thFairy is 100% correct about diabetes.  Even though a terrible diet may hasten the onset of type II diabetes in some, there are people that are overweight with a terrible diet that do not have diabetes and will never get it.  Then you have those people that are athletes and eat the healthiest food on the planet but they still have type II diabetes.  How do you explain that?   The statements you made earlier make it sound like an ignorant and insensitive person.  Which I am sure that you are not.  Just be careful how you draw your conclusions.  

Keep in mind that man did not evolve with a Vitamix blender in his lap.  Although diet plays a key role in many disease processes it would be ignorant to overlook the genetic factors that you can not control with diet.

Keep up the passion and keep thinking outside the box but just make sure you stay on the right track


----------



## Gianni

My point about Diabetes was to show that not any diet would cause all diseases. Just wanted to point out that diabetes can be prevented through diet but yes not all, as with any disease there are exceptions. I should have said most cases of Diabetes. 

I am not overlooking the genetic factor I think it is absolutely part of the equation. I just believe the genetic factor is a bit different than how others view it. I will post a thread soon explaining but I would rather get back to the topic of this thread, Juicing. 


Gianni


----------



## Thermo

Gianni said:


> what isn't changing the underlying issue is drugs. Drugs only treat symptoms. I get the feeling that you think diet also only treats symptoms
> 
> What do you think the underlying issue is? If it is genetic why didn't our whole lineage have it, did your parents have it? mine didn't.
> 
> By blaming genetics (and this is my opinion i want to stress that) you are essentially saying that if it looks like fire and smells like fire it must be a 20 ton whale. Or the smell of the fire is just being ignored.
> 
> You have to recognize the underline problem to figure out the underline solution. Genetics are so complicated and confusing and with such a confusing disease its natural for people to blame the most complicated source because "if it was that simple my doctor would have told me".
> 
> Also if you can blame genetics it takes out the blame from you.


My comment was more about this post, believe me I understand what you are saying and agree that diet plays a big role but I do not believe it is 100% the underlying cause. Crohns is an extremely rare disease and to say that it is 100% due to diet just doesn't add up. If that was the case then Crohns would be more prevalent. Now if you said that you think our mutated genes (That have been proven mind you) thrive off our diet today and that's what causes it to be such a problem more so than the past, I would be right there with you nodding my head. To not recognize genetics in modern diseases is like saying that overweight people just eat too much, and doesn't explain sickle cell anemia, Alzheimer's, down syndrome, and hundreds of thousands if not every single disease on the planet. Excluding opportunist bacterial infections or viruses of course. 

The one thing that I explain to everyone when they ask me how I got Crohns is that 50 years ago I would have died when I was 12 years old due to this disease and I would not have passed on my genes to my off spring, due to modern medicines people are living fuller lives and what would kill you in the past doesn't you simply take medicine to keep you alive. Due to this fact the entire world will just continue getting sicker and sicker until we develop cures for these things, and yes diet plays a role in this but when you stop more people from dying the world becomes more populated and mutated genes spread. 

As you said on page one:



Gianni said:


> Oh no, don't apologize, i want people to bring forward their concerns.


You put yourself out there on the forums and that is very hard to do, it seems like everyone appreciates your post here about juicing and I myself will read up and try some as I am always up for juicing recommendations, don't take the feedback negatively, we are all taking time out of our life and disease to come together and grow. I look forward to hearing more posts from you in the future.


----------



## Gianni

> Crohns is an extremely rare disease and to say that it is 100% due to diet just doesn't add up. If that was the case then Crohns would be more prevalent. Now if you said that you think our mutated genes (That have been proven mind you) thrive off our diet today and that's what causes it to be such a problem more so than the past, I would be right there with you nodding my head.


I in no way think diet plays 100% role in causing this disease. But yes i do believe that diet has caused mutated genes. My thought process is more complicated than that but I do want to stick to juicing in this thread as i will make a thread explaining my theory on genetics shortly. 



> Due to this fact the entire world will just continue getting sicker and sicker until we develop cures for these things, and yes diet plays a role in this but when you stop more people from dying the world becomes more populated and mutated genes spread.


I don't believe we will ever see an allopathic cure but that's neither here or there. 

These mutated genes came from somewhere and while maybe there are more cases of Crohn's disease because of allopathic intervention, the problem still lies that people would have had short lived lives and Crohn's would still very well be a big problem. I believe that if a gene can be damaged/mutated it can be fixed. 




> You put yourself out there on the forums and that is very hard to do, it seems like everyone appreciates your post here about juicing and I myself will read up and try some as I am always up for juicing recommendations, don't take the feedback negatively, we are all taking time out of our life and disease to come together and grow. I look forward to hearing more posts from you in the future.


Thank you for the kind words. I hope it didn't come off as me attacking you earlier. I simply just didn't understand what you were saying entirely. 

Gianni


----------



## Mountaingem

Gianni I love all the info on juicing-a very interesting read. I also enjoy juicing but I do not use it as a treatment, more as a way to supplement vitamins esp when I'm flaring.

One concern I have for recommending juicing alone is that if Crohn's is not completely suppressed, the ongoing inflammation can lead to colon cancer-which happened in my case, even though I was feeling well at the time.

So I would encourage everyone to get regular colonoscopies-every two years, just to be on the safe side and catch any changes early no matter which treatment you choose. I was fortunate and caught it in Stage 1 and went through the chemo. 

Since I am going for my all clear next month I just thought I'd pass this on. Again thank you for all the information, I really appreciate the work you put in and I'm bookmarking this post for reference.


----------



## Gianni

> One concern I have for recommending juicing alone is that if Crohn's is not completely suppressed, the ongoing inflammation can lead to colon cancer-which happened in my case, even though I was feeling well at the time.


Well the hope with juicing is that you can strengthen your immune system so it can fight off the infection and with that your body will not need to use inflammation any longer to sanction off the infection. But yes you're right, if the inflammation is to far gone in severe cases, Juicing should not be considered as lone treatment as juicing isn't a rescue treatment. 

I'm glad you caught the cancer early, and thank you for the post 

Gianni


----------



## Mountaingem

I've read this whole thread and I just have to say I really appreciate the respectful way you treat those who disagree with you, nice job keeping everything positive!:thumright:


----------



## hugh

Personally, i don't think of juicing as a treatment for crohn's, A valuable part of a treatment regime - Definitely, but not a treatment on it's own.
I have seen evidence of various autoimmune disease remissions brought about by juicing fasts, but i believe this to be as much a result of not eating the causes (refer later on in this post).


Thermo said:


> This has been thoroughly researched no need to reinvent the wheel, the genetic link has been well established. But of course it is linked to diet the majority of ailments today are due in some part to what we ingest. However think of it this way, if there was no genetic cause why doesn't everyone have crohns? If only what we ate caused Crohns every single person on this planet would have it and we would all have diabetes and so on. So there is a diet connection but to shun genetics is like saying evolution doesn't exist, it's bad science and it's dangerous.


_
“The Genetic link has been well established”_ – Absolutely, 
Genetics will give a predisposition. In this case the potential to develop Crohn's disease.
This potential will not be fulfilled without an interaction with environmental factors, in this case diet (and stress and smoking and antibiotics etc, but particularly diet)
_
“why doesn't everyone have crohns?”_ - or cancer?, or lupus?, or acne?, or any other disease?, or all of them? - different genes AND exposure to triggers
_
“If only what we ate caused Crohns”_ - nobody is suggesting this

_“So there is a diet connection but to shun genetics is like saying evolution doesn't exist, it's bad science and it's dangerous”_- no one is shunning genetics. You can't change your genes, but you can change the way they interact with the environment. 
Nothing dangerous or 'bad sciencey' about that

 Think of it like this . If you have blue paint (genes that predispose you to crohn's) and you mix it with yellow paint (environmental factors, in this case diet) then you end up with green paint (crohn's disease).
It doesn't matter how much blue paint you have to start with, You cannot get green paint without adding the yellow.
Other might be starting with red paint, mixing with yellow, and ending up with orange (Lupus, MS, diabetes),
Others might start with blue but are mixing it with red and getting purple.(?parkinsons, cancer,?)

Much recent research has also shown another factor, this is intestinal permeability, -think of it as the jar that you mix the paint in. If you have blue paint in one jar (genes in your body) and yellow paint out of the jar (trigger food in your intestines), you still won't get green paint until you mix them (intestinal permeability).

_“*Wheat and Crohn’s Disease,*
Dr. Fasano and colleagues suspected that the bacterial protein’s action must mimic some natural human protein which controls intestinal permeability. In 2000, they discovered this human protein and named it “zonulin.”
They subsequently showed that gliadin stimulates zonulin release. Gliadin binds to a receptor called CXCR3, and activation of this receptor triggers zonulin release and *increased intestinal permeability.*
*Interestingly, zonulin release was much higher and longer-lasting in Crohn’s disease patients than in healthy patients.* Restriction of gluten restores intestinal integrity in Crohn’s disease patients.
So Crohn’s disease patients should absolutely not eat wheat!”_
http://perfecthealthdiet.com/2010/10/wheat-is-a-cause-of-many-diseases-i-leaky-gut/

Which is good news for us , to quote from:
*Tight Junctions, Intestinal Permeability, and Autoimmunity Celiac
Disease and Type 1 Diabetes Paradigms*
_“This new theory implies that once the
 autoimmune process is activated, it is not auto-perpetuating, but rather can be modulated *or even reversed by preventing the continuous interplay between genes and environment*.”_ -
 ie healing the gut, and reversing intestinal permiability, but you can wait for the drug or stop eating the cause of leaky gut – mainly gluten grains but others causes are listed here.....
http://crohnsdad.com/2012/06/05/framework-matters-study-links-for-safe-effective-crohns-strategies/

Love a good debate, but it's all just talk unless you follow it up with action


----------



## Thermo

I feel like you skimmed past the majority of this thread especially the first page, Gianni has since clarified his stance and everyone is in agreement...


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## 2thFairy

Everyone is in agreement???


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## hugh

Thermo said:


> I feel like you skimmed past the majority of this thread especially the first page, Gianni has since clarified his stance and everyone is in agreement...


I have followed it from the beginning and have found it interesting, i just felt the need to add my two cents worth on the interaction between genetics and environment. 
Diet has a profound effect on gene expression, on so many levels, trying to ignore the connection would be dangerous and 'bad sciency'

If I was feeling really picky I would also take issue with Gianni's comment about meat and metabolic acidosis, but only as so much that a diet balanced in meat and vegetables is unlikely to cause a problem, whereas a diet rich in grains and sugars will have a much more acidifying effect.
Theoretically an 'ultra-low' carb or zero carb diet may lead to metabolic acidosis but this hasn't been proven and is way beyond a normal paleo/SCD diet.
_“These bigger fish include processed sugars, carbonated beverages, animal products, soy and sodium rich foods, and calcium supplements. “_
So i'd say meat may be a small fish that usually gets lumped with the big fish without good cause, but once again , it's not a big issue to me, i'm happy if people do or don't eat meat. I'd put grains, vegetable (omega-6) oils, and antibiotics in the big fish list.

On diabetes.......
type II diabetes (where not enough insulin is produced) is more common than type I (where the pancreas does not produce insulin) and can in most cases be managed by a healthy diet (if your idea of healthy avoids grains and sugars) . Low carb diets have been demonstrated to improve blood glucose levels and improve insulin sensitivity. Whether they work because they are low carb or because they avoid certain carbs (grain and sugar) is not proven yet.

A low-carbohydrate, ketogenic diet to treat type 2 diabetes  (one of dozens of similar studies)
"_The LCKD improved glycemic control in patients with type 2 diabetes such that diabetes medications were discontinued or reduced in most participants._"
http://www.nutritionandmetabolism.com/content/2/1/34

_“Now if you said that you think our mutated genes (That have been proven mind you) thrive off our diet today and that's what causes it to be such a problem more so than the past, I would be right there with you nodding my head.”_
I think that while there are genetic mutations they are a completely different type and category of diseases.
The amazing rise in the incidence of auto-immune and immune- deficient diseases far outstrips genetic changes, and is far more likely related to environmental (dietary and other) factors caused by a huge rise in intestinal permeability and toxic food than any change in genes! and that's not just my opinion.

_“This mismatch between our ancient physiology and the western diet and lifestyle underlies many so-called diseases of civilization, including coronary heart disease, obesity, hypertension, type 2 diabetes, epithelial cell cancers, autoimmune disease, and osteoporosis, which are rare or virtually absent in hunter–gatherers and other non-westernized populations.”_ Cordain et al.

_"Anthropological and epidemiological studies and studies at the molecular level indicate that human beings evolved on a diet with a ratio of omega-6 to omega-3 essential fatty acids (EFA) of ~1 whereas in Western diets the ratio is 15/1 to 16.7/1. A high omega-6/omega-3 ratio, as is found in today’s Western diets, promotes the pathogenesis of many diseases, including cardiovascular disease, cancer, osteoporosis, and inflammatory and autoimmune diseases, whereas increased levels of omega-3 polyunsaturated fatty acids (PUFA) (a lower omega-6/omega-3 ratio), exert suppressive effects._ A.P. Simopoulos


----------



## Gianni

> If I was feeling really picky I would also take issue with Gianni's comment about meat and metabolic acidosis, but only as so much that a diet balanced in meat and vegetables is unlikely to cause a problem,


Well there lies the problem. Most people don't have a balanced diet in meat and vegetables. People will allude that we are omnivores and we need meat, they are right but today people have a skewed look at the term omnivore. A plate of 70% meat 20% white potato and starches and 5-10% vegetables isn't exactly a balanced diet.  Also i was more talking about all animals products including dairy. With such high volume of dairy I think it is a big fish to fry, but yes I agree that grains and sugars are too also big fish.


----------



## hugh

Gianni said:


> People will allude that we are omnivores and we need meat, they are right but today people have a skewed look at the term omnivore. A plate of 70% meat 20% white potato and starches and 5-10% vegetables isn't exactly a balanced diet.


I'd still disagree, but you might have worked out that i like disagreeing,
I think the statistics for the SAD (standard american diet) are more like 70% starch, 20% meat and trace elements of vegetable, so from my perspective 70% meat would be a huge improvement.

Having said that if someone is eating CAFO then the meat has a higher omega-6 ratio, and is loaded with antibiotics so less is probably better.

Having said that replacing the meat with any pulses and grains will increase your pesticide intake (did you know that they spray those crops to death just before harvesting to get a more uniform product - it's called desiccation) and also increase intestinal permeability.

I think we agree on the (other) big issues, but we could both argue all day about whether meat is a big issue or not


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## Gianni

yes we could


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## Gianni

Sign up for a community juice fast here


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## Sandy A

Gianni, you ever seen the video "Fat, sick and nearly dead"?  A juice fast video, quite good.  The book "Crazy Sexy Diet"  is pretty good too, discussing nutrition, juicing for health.  Whenever I start to feel rundown, the first thing I do is try to drink fresh vegetable juice, get a wheat grass shot or two, and make sure I'm diligent with my vitamins. You have a lot of good points in your discussion....I need to be more diligent with my juicing.  Its always better to drink it fresh rather than keep it for a bit, but thats better than not at all.  Our juicer is one of those Norwalk juicers and its a lot of work!  I also have been eating more healthy, mostly vegetarian for the last yr and a half, I know that crohns does not have a cure, but I think whatever we can do to enrich the environment in there can't hurt!


----------



## Gianni

> The book "Crazy Sexy Diet" is pretty good too, discussing nutrition, juicing for health.


I have seen the documentary Fat sick and nearly dead, it's really good I haven't read the book, but I will look into it. Thanks. 



> Our juicer is one of those Norwalk juicers


!!!! Very nice! I would kill for that juicer I think it is the best one out there in quality of juice Take advantage of it! 



> I know that crohns does not have a cure


I guess we will have to disagree on this 

Thanks for the post,

Gianni.


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## Kip1

Yes juicing is good and may help keep you in remission but it will not CURE crohns.

Please stop saying this as it may give people who have just learned they have this disease the wrong idea completly.


----------



## Gianni

I am saying that I BELIEVE nutrition can cure Crohn's. I am stating my opinions and beliefs and I am entitled to those just as you are to yours. I am not stating it as a fact. 

Thank you for the post. 

Gianni


----------



## Moe.

I'm with Gainna.
If you can eat organic like we should be, not with all these chemical compounds then yeah of course it's a cure.
You are the one poisoning yourself by eating junk, if crohn don't get you something else will.


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## Kip1

It can help if the fruits/veggies you use do not Irritate but currently there is no CURE only possible long term remission. Whether you believe you are cured or not the medical fact is as yet there is no cure only treatment whatever that may be. 
You can have the diseased area removed & live Crohns free but it could creep back at any time. I hate saying this because of course we all wish we could get rid of it for good.
I know I had a very healthy diet from a very young age. 
My Mum had crohns from being a teenager & had 2 resections. She was so ill at one time she nearly died. So although there was limited information out there many years ago about Crohns she made sure she had the best of what she could tolerate food wise at that time but she really made sure myself & brother had a good diet just in case of a genetic link (there are other relatives on mums side with other IBD).
Maybe that's why my Crohns wasn't found until I was in my late 30's.


----------



## Gianni

> It can help if the fruits/veggies you use do not Irritate but currently there is no CURE only possible long term remission. Whether you believe you are cured or not the medical fact is as yet there is no cure only treatment whatever that may be.


The key here is "medical" fact. I do not represent anything medical and I don't trust the medical community as much as the average person. Of course juicing isn't "medical" so yes the "medical" fact is that this disease is incurable. But that doesn't mean everything non medical is automatically discredited. The medical community knows about medicine, that's it. 

So when you say the the disease is incurable are you speaking for the medical community or your personal opinion on the nutrition?

I understand your concern about me "claiming" the disease is curable, but I'm not really even claiming it, I am claiming that I believe it is curable. I think this forum needs more progressive thinking and more alternative threads so by trying to have me suppress my opinions the forum becomes more one dimensional. 

You may think that I am doing more harm than good as "it may give people who have just learned they have this disease the wrong idea completely." But I believe it gives people the right idea. Is your opinion any greater than mine? People have the power to make their own decisions and by including alternative treatments and out of the box ideas I think it gives people more options and many people are interested in alternative treatments. 

I appreciate your desire to impart your knowledge on what you believe is right, but trying to discredit an alternative method by saying the "medical fact is the disease cannot be cured" is quite honestly a paradox. The whole reason why a treatment is alternative is because it doesn't fall in line with the medical community. 



> I know I had a very healthy diet from a very young age.


 You had? Do you still have? What was the extent of your diet? Did you abandon a healthy diet as you grew up (went to college, lived on your own etc etc)?

Gianni


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## Kip1

Gianni there is currently no cure for Crohns disease or is my GI & surgeon wrong & all the Crohns & Colitis organisations wrong too. 
You can be in to long term remission & maybe depending on the severity of the disease be able to live quite well without any drugs etc but sadly for everyone that's not always the case.

I still have a healthy diet. We as a family try to eat as healthy as we can but we do have the odd treat like everyone & apart from going out for drink with my friends between 18 & 19 years old (pregnant at 19 so rarely got to go out after that, sad I know lol) I never did anything that could damage my health eg smoking/drugs. 

I could do with more exercise than I currently get but then so could a lot of us when real life takes over.

As far as I am concerned there was nothing at all in my diet that would cause any sort of ill health. I still do try to eat healthily now but since I had my resection I do have to limit fruit & vegetables in any form. I have found like Crabby said some salad Items going straight through.

Maybe Its different for people who have not had surgery. I had part of my ileum & caecum removed. 

I am very disappointed that I could have developed duodenal Crohns too. I have been told to hold the juice/smoothies due to also having severe gastritis. Maybe after that has settled I can go back to the good stuff.

I have come to the conclusion now that its about making the right choices for yourself by how your body is behaving at the time. 

I think my body is really misbehaving at the moment but I am hoping it wont be long before I am back on track again. I hate the low residue diet I have been placed on though & I cant wait till I can change it.

I am really pleased that you & some others on here are having such good results with juicing.

If it can keep some people in remission long term then I am all for it.


----------



## Gianni

> Gianni there is currently no cure for Crohns disease or is my GI & surgeon wrong & all the Crohns & Colitis organisations wrong too.
> You can be in to long term remission & maybe depending on the severity of the disease be able to live quite well without any drugs etc but sadly for everyone that's not always the case.


All I'm saying is the medical community knows about medicine, so for me I'm not going to ask my medical doctor about nutrition. I will ask a nutritionist when I want to know about nutrition. Medical doctors learn about medicine in med school and learn very little on nutrition. 



> http://www.nytimes.com/2010/09/16/he...chen.html?_r=0
> 
> http://www.naturalnews.com/036702_do...atalities.html
> 
> Last year, a bill was introduced in California to mandate that physicians get continuing medical education in nutrition (see Nutrition Education Mandate Introduced for Doctors). Unbelievably, physician trade groups such as the California Medical Association came out in opposition to the bill, which would only require doctors to get a measly 7 hours of nutrition training anytime before 2017 (see Medical Associations Oppose Bill to Mandate Nutrition Training). Read more: http://www.care2.com/greenliving/how...#ixzz28sHp37yh
> 
> 
> http://ajcn.nutrition.org/content/83/4/941S.full
> 
> There are plenty of other sources. It's a pretty well known fact amongst the medical community and it's critics. Truth is, in undergrad they learn about the body, medical school they learn about medicine. Medicine, medicine and more medicine.
> 
> Gianni


The G.I. surgeon is right in his own regard. He is a surgeon, so naturally he learned about surgery. 

All I'm suggesting is boosting health, it's really the only thing that hasn't been tried yet. Other people may be happy with the way this disease is being treated within the medical community, but I am not, in fact I am disturbed by it. 

Obviously we can go back and forth all day, so I think we should just agree to disagree on this one. 

Gianni


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## Sandy A

Gianni, I understand what you are saying....better nutrition made a huge difference for me, I just need to get more serious (drinking a juice from my norwalk as I type...carrots, beet, celery, kale, cucumber and lemon juice)...


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## Sandy A

Gianni, what is a typical day like for you...breakfast, lunch, dinner, juicing, protein? vitamins?  Forgive me if you have already posted this somewhere.


----------



## Gianni

Sandy A said:


> Gianni, what is a typical day like for you...breakfast, lunch, dinner, juicing, protein? vitamins?  Forgive me if you have already posted this somewhere.


Breakfast is typically a fresh juice, or If I don't have time, a piece of fruit like a kiwi, pear, or apple. The juice will be have more fruit in it than I would typically do because I feel like fruit in the morning can you get energized for the rest of the day. Maybe a carrot, sweet potato, orange, apple juice. 

Lunch is typically a large salad that will almost always include an avocado and balsamic vinegar and olive oil. 

Dinner is either another salad, or I will make a soup or I will experiment with a new recipe like a collard greens wrap, or spinach tortilla wrap. If I'm feeling real rewarding, I will have some vegan thai food. 

You can look at my Juicing Recipes thread for more on what I juice. 

I rarely take protein powder, although I do when I exercise a lot in a week. When I do it is hemp protein powder. Hemp is a complete protein and isn't dairy based like many of the protein out there. I believe if you are eating enough, you are getting enough protein, much like if you are breathing you are getting enough oxygen. I think society has become quite obsessed with protein.

The only vitamin I supplement is b-12 sublingual liquid vitamin. All the other vitamins I get from my food/juices. 

I do take cold pressed flax seed oil supplement capsules as well to get my omega oils. 

Gianni


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## Mark in Seattle

I have a KitchenAid juicer that is dual function - juice extractor & citrus press.  I'm not sure what all it can do.  Might have to try it out.

Couple questions.  Mainly to do with fruit skins.  I've often read that many of the health benefits are derived from the skins of fruits.  But in juicing, wouldn't the skins be eliminated by the juicer machine as discarded fiber?  I'm trying to understand whether juicing results in the elimination of the benefits from the skins or not.

Next, what benefits does one get from juicing a raw potato?

Shouldn't some veggies be cooked at least a little before putting in the juicer, like broccoli for example?  Or is everything supposed to be put in raw, no matter what?


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## Gianni

Mark in Seattle said:


> I have a KitchenAid juicer that is dual function - juice extractor & citrus press.  I'm not sure what all it can do.  Might have to try it out.
> 
> Couple questions.  Mainly to do with fruit skins.  I've often read that many of the health benefits are derived from the skins of fruits.  But in juicing, wouldn't the skins be eliminated by the juicer machine as discarded fiber?  I'm trying to understand whether juicing results in the elimination of the benefits from the skins or not.
> 
> Next, what benefits does one get from juicing a raw potato?
> 
> Shouldn't some veggies be cooked at least a little before putting in the juicer, like broccoli for example?  Or is everything supposed to be put in raw, no matter what?


Much of the skin would be discarded as fiber but there still is moisture in the skins and the juicer will squeeze that out. So you won't be getting all the benefits from the skin but you will be getting a fair amount. When juicing lemons, oranges and limes, most people will remove the peels. Some juicers can't even handle the peels and may break (like my first one) Also the skins taste very bitter for me, but some people do enjoy the taste. 


Well you are getting all of the enzymes that are included in the potato. When contacted with heat, all the enzymes will die and it will ask on your pancreas to over work to create the enzymes that were lost. Also all vitamin C is destroyed by heat and seeing as many food nutrients haven't been discovered, many more nutrients may be destroyed. 

Also by cooking the vegetables, many of the nutrients will actually leach into the water that they are being boiled or cooked in. And I'm not quite sure if a mushy vegetable will actually produce any juice. 

You should definitely keep the fruits and vegetables in their raw state, always. 

Gianni


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## Sandy A

Gianni, thanks for feedback on your diet, sounds similar to what I do, the fruit bothers me sometimes though, and I also love vegan thai food. I use the Warrior food protein powder, hemp/brown rice mixture,  don't use it real often either...I eat millet bread and toast it with  earth balance butter on it, almond butter sometimes...I like Barleans total omega swirl for omega 3, has flax oil and borage oil and it tastes like an orange cream smoothie.  I also do the balsamic and olive oil and I press garlic in mine.  I also make a shake in my vitamix with almond milk, cocoa powder, frozen bananas and almond or peanut butter (not suppose to do peanut butter, but I like it!) I use the unsweetened almond milk and use medjool dates to sweeten.  I've been trying to add nuts, but I think they are bothering me, my health coach said to soak them first, always forget to do that! Glad to see someone who is eating similar with success!! I am on remicade and would love to someday not be on anything, lot of joint pains going on...dr agreed to cut back dose and extend time to see if I'm still good, thanks for your reply.


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## Mark in Seattle

Gianni, I presume you don't bother peeling any of the veggies, like the potato, right? 

So here's another question.  Regarding the salads.  It was mentioned that nitrogen fertilizers raise the nitrates, and particularly for lettuce.  So, do you assume that if the lettuce is advertised as organic, that it was not grown with nitrogen fertilizer, or does this question of fertilizer concern you?  I know that every time I eat salad I flare, and I've been assuming that Adherent Invasive E. Coli have been to blame, but perhaps not; maybe the nitrates are to blame.  Anyhow, that's my question, thanks.


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## Gianni

Yes I do assume that organic lettuce would not be grown with artificial fertilizers because the lettuce would not be there if it didn't have pesticides and had artificial fertilizer. the bugs would easily get to the lettuce without the organic fertilizer because the plants's defenses would be weakened. So if it is grown organically (with minimal chemicals) and the lettuce appears green and healthy then I have to assume it had healthy soil to stay alive. 

Gianni


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## MooCat

Thank you so much for this incredibly informative post. I purchased both a juicer and a dehydrator about one month ago and am trying to adapt to a raw food diet to help my Crohn's disease. I will definitely try the juicing recipes you provided here. Do you have any posts similar to this one about dehydrating foods and the possible benefits associated with that practice as well?


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## Gianni

> Do you have any posts similar to this one about dehydrating foods and the possible benefits associated with that practice as well?


Unfortunately I do not. I really want to get a dehydrator but they are rather expensive. I would love to get one soon and then write about those benefits as well, so maybe in the future sometime. I know there are a few people on this forum who use dehydrators so you might want to reach out to them. Using the search engine by typing in dehydrator should yield some results. Sorry I couldn't be of more help as I'm not entirely comfortable claiming health benefits from dehydrators yet. 

I'm glad you enjoyed the post. 

Gianni


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## Wooddy

Gianni said:


> Unfortunately I do not. I really want to get a dehydrator but they are rather expensive. I would love to get one soon and then write about those benefits as well, so maybe in the future sometime. I know there are a few people on this forum who use dehydrators so you might want to reach out to them. Using the search engine by typing in dehydrator should yield some results. Sorry I couldn't be of more help as I'm not entirely comfortable claiming health benefits from dehydrators yet.
> 
> I'm glad you enjoyed the post.
> 
> Gianni


Gianni,

An inexpensive but effective method I use when I dehydrate food is to sandwich the food between two cellulose air filters (made for my house furnace) and bungie them to a box fan.  I put the entire contraption it out of the sun in a dry spot and let it run for a day or two.  When using this method to preserve the fresh herbs that I have grown in my garden, I also get the added bonus of the pleasant savory aroma filling my house.  If you want to try this with fruit, cut up your fruit and let the pieces soak in lemon juice (dilute it with water if you like) for a minute, to prevent browning.  You don't want to water log the fruit so don't let the peices sit in the lemon juice too long.  After about a minute, drain the fruit well in a colander and then dehydrate.


Use filters that contain a natural media or unbleached cellulose (I assume that you would already be using something similar if you have a forced air system in your house) and avoid fiberglass.   You can even make your own washable/reusable filter just make sure you use an eco-friendly, dioxin free, substrate.

If you try it let me know how it works out for you.  The weather and the type of food being dried has a lot to do with how long this process takes so you will have gauge that on your own.  I like this method, it is inexpensive and works well enough to suit my needs.


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## Gianni

Interesting and creative stuff Woody, Thanks!! 

I'll have to try it. 

Gianni


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## cleuger

Can you Juice with a Stricture? I'm on a low residual diet (which I hate) I love vegetables. I miss broccoli. Would this cause me potential problems. I mean I don't see how since its liquid but I want to give this a try as I totally hate the diet I'm on its makes me feel like crap and gaining weight in all the wrong places.


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## Beach bum

I would say yes, as long as you juice you are taking out the fibre (as opposed to smoothies which just liquefy everything).
I try to stay low residue and juice every morning - getting in my 5 a day early so I can eat donuts all day hehe.
I definitely feel healthier for it.


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## Beach bum

Actually just looked at low residue list on wiki and it says "Pulp free, strained, or clear juices" are ok. 
So yes go for it.


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## Gianni

I'd have to agree with Beach bum. It is in liquid form so it will not cause problems.


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## Gianni

Community Juice fast starts this saturday the 10th, you can still sign up!  http://www.crohnsforum.com/showthread.php?t=42397


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## mink

Hi Gianni, I appreciate your hard work and research and generously sharing it with us to read and benefit from.  I am undiagnosed but pretty sure it Crohn's after research and its knocked me quite a bit.  I have had M E since August 2001 and housebound so I got low in Vit D and took 1000 iu every day but because of symptoms got confused and stopped the  Vit D.  The  Crohn's (i think) symptoms got worse. My diet is pretty good as i have candida and endometriosis and need to avoid dairy and sugar I no longer have sugar cravings.  I am loathe to go to docs for diagnosis as dont want to be filled up with all the drugs, esp. if they only suppress the symptoms for them to flare up. Thanks for explaining that.  The juicing is something i would like to try.  Please do you mind sharing how you organise your juicing and meals to give me some idea of a routine?   What routine do you follow on your fasts and for how long?  After you fast what meals do you have do you still juice on non fast days ? How do you organize those days also how much liquid do you consider to constitute a meal?  I am very weepy panicky and upset at symptoms.  i am terrified of the complications and the fear paralyses me.  I know i should try to take one day at at time.  I love the bible and study it (as i find the prophecies fascinatingly accurate) and my faith helps me to do that.  but in my weaker moments i feel i am not coping at all and I feel ashamed about that. Your attitude is so life enhancing and refreshing, the way you have taken a pro-active research and doing stance, I so respect that, but this has knocked me (I was just about coping with the rest).  Please also could you tell me what juicer to use, your recommended omega 8006 juicer has great reviews, and I was very tempted but the video confused me as the demonstrator said that if you want to do a lot of carrots (which i like) it was not recommended but it has a 15 year warranty so must be sturdy enough to do them, what do you think? having M E I would like one that does as much as possible i have saved quite a bit. I would like to ask the one that you use but perhaps the company you bought from may not ship to London, UK where I live? Also what were your symptoms and how long was it after starting your juicing that you felt symptom free? Sorry for all the questions but i would deeply appreciate your kind advice. It was an absolute breath of fresh air reading all your posts.


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## Gianni

> Please do you mind sharing how you organise your juicing and meals to give me some idea of a routine?


It really depends on the day I have ahead of me. If I have a laid back day, I can organize however which way I want to. For a busy day or even a busy week I will plan ahead and juice for the entire week and put the juice into glass mason jars, and then just grab one each day as I'm going out the door. Meals are typically simple for me, for breakfast it is usually simply just a piece of fruit or a juice if I have time. Lunch, I will eat at a local healthy restaurant (I live in Los angeles and there are many healthy options out there for me) or I will pack a salad and have a cooler with me. For dinner I will try to make a recipe, or have a salad or juice if I have time. I will sometimes reward myself with thai food as well here. 



> What routine do you follow on your fasts and for how long?


 I juice the night before often or the morning of If I get up early. I juice once for the whole day and will put the juice in glass mason jars and into the refrigerator. It is much more time consuming to re-juice every time you make a juice as you have to clean the juicer each time and prep yourself. I typically do around 7 day juice fasts, I have gone to 14 and as little as 3. For a beginner I would recommend 3-5 day juice fast then working your way up. 



> After you fast what meals do you have do you still juice on non fast days


It's important to retain nutrient dense foods after your juice fast. You don't want to start giving your body the right idea about all these nutrients and then eat junk processed foods. Anywhere from 20-32 oz of juice constitutes as a meal, for me, during a juice fast. I do juice on non fast days, I actually nearly juice everyday whether it is me making it or buying a juice at a local organic juice bar down the street. 



> Please also could you tell me what juicer to use, your recommended omega 8006 juicer has great reviews, and I was very tempted but the video confused me as the demonstrator said that if you want to do a lot of carrots (which i like) it was not recommended but it has a 15 year warranty so must be sturdy enough to do them, what do you think?


You know I have heard similar opinions about the 8006. I've seen the 8006 in action and it does take care of carrots a little funny but I see no reason why it would break on you. It does have a 15 year warranty and from what I've read their customer service is great and they are more than willing to replace broken parts/juicers. 

Personally I use a Super Angel 5500 juicer. This juicer is very expensive (around $900) but it is amazing It juices the hard stuff like carrots and sweet potatoes with ease but the great thing about this juicer is that it is exceptional in retaining the beneficial chemicals within leafy greens. Many juicers will damage delicate greens while this juicer is on slow RPm's and is very delicate. This juicer also has a patented Biomagnetic technology in which it retrieves more nutrients and enzymes from the pulp than other juicers. 

If you want the best of the best and money isn't an option then the Norwalk Juicer might be for you. (around $2400). This juicer is a two step juicer in which you grind the pulp and then press the juice out of the pulp. This juicer is much more time consuming but consistently wins the battle of most minerals and enzymes retained in the juice. This is the juicer used with the Gerson Therapy. 

I do believe that the 8006 or any other omega masticating juicer is a good middle ground for efficiency and affordability. Some other juicers worth looking into are the Green Star Elite (better than 8006 but more expensive), and champion juicers. 

I am not a fan of the breville family. I had a Breville and it did break on me. Overall I'm not a big fan of an centrifugal juicers as they have been known to damage a fair amount of enzymes and delicate greens. 




> Also what were your symptoms and how long was it after starting your juicing that you felt symptom free?


Constant Diarrhea and constipation, they went back and forth. I had horrible pain about constant 6 and peaks at 9 on a 1-10 scale (I was constantly on norco pain killers). I had bladder pain every time I went to the bathroom, to the point I would have to kneel down for a good 5-10 mins before I could get up and walk out of the bathroom (I had a developing fistula). I have intermittent fevers as well as nausea. 

I started juicing while I was on Humira still but remicade did not work for me. It seemed like Humira did take the edge off but I didn't feel like my symptom pain was getting any better (bladder pain). I started feeling better quite honestly only a week into me juicing. I had more energy, I didn't feel nauseas and my bowels weren't as inconsistant (they weren't nearly perfect yet). That was when I realized there was something to this so I went on a juice fast and thats when things started calming down. My bladder pain wasn't getting worse for the first time in a long time (it seemed before that everyday the pain would get more extreme). I had an appetite and my intermittent fevers no longer existed. About 3 months into my new regiment is when I started to feel completely normal again although I still did have some bladder pain (I still even today have some bladder pain although not even 1/100 as bad as it was but I attribute it to scar tissue).

8 months after my whole new change I got a colonoscopy and there showed no visual signs of the disease (they did not take a biopsy though). 





> I am very weepy panicky and upset at symptoms. i am terrified of the complications and the fear paralyses me.


It is a very scary disease and know you are not alone in that sentiment. Often when you research online and find blogs and forums, the people posting and active on those forums are mostly people that are very scared, sick and confused. The healthy crohnies are off living their lives, not investing their time into a forum or blog. So you must realized you are getting a skewed view when you start reading the stories on forums. The forum stories are some of the scariest and make other scary ideas seem silly. One of my goals, in being on this forum, is to break that sentiment... to give others a different point of view of someone living health, someone in remission who has good news rather than grim news. 

There is a success story subforum here (click that) it can be a very useful tool for you to gather some hope and realize that this disease doesn't have to control you, that you can be perfectly happy with it. 




> My diet is pretty good as i have candida and endometriosis and need to avoid dairy and sugar I no longer have sugar cravings.


May I ask the extent of your diet? What is the average day like? 

Do you still have Candida? I think Candida is absolutely detrimental to overall health but especially detrimental to the health of our intestines and our immune system. Seeing as crohn's deals with both the immune system and intestines I think getting rid of your candida should be priority #1. It is a good sign, though, that you no longer have sugar cravings. 

This quote is from a different thread: 



> My Candida diet: You can look up various Candida cure diets online but this is what i did... I avoided all processed and refine sugars and when i say avoided i mean looked at the back of every label of every parcel of food i ate and if it said sugar i didn't dare eat it. I also stayed away from yeast in breads and the like, and seeing as many many breads contain yeast I nearly avoided breads all together. I incorporated a HEAVY dose of vegetables into my diet because vegetables create an alkaline state in your body and help change the environment that the Candida got used to and replaces it with an environment gut flora will thrive in. To get the optimal amount of vegetables into my diet, i didn't only eat a raw vegan diet but i also juiced a substantial amount. If you aren't familiar with juicing i highly suggest you look it up, I will be making a juicing thread soon. By juicing you can throw in so many vegetables into the juicers and it liquifies it and it super concentrates the amount of vegetables you can consume in a day.
> 
> I regulated the amount of fruits i ate as they do contain sugars. They are natural sugars but its really important to not indulge in fruits because too much of any kind of sugar is not ideal for our guts.
> 
> Also i would suggest never taking antibiotics. Of course I am not a doctor but what i've researched about antibiotics is just frightening. If you do take antibiotics think of it as a reset button because as soon as you take them all the progress you've made in trying to eliminate the Candida is wasted and you are back to square 1. Of course for life threatening situations antibiotics should be used like an abscess bursting or something along the lines of that. But in most cases your body doesn't need antibiotics to fight off an infection... if you give your body something to work with like healthy nutrition in the form of vitamins, fiber, minerals then your body can fight for itself without medical intervention.


A good way to test your Candida levels everyday is: Right when you wake up BEFORE you drink or eat anything, grab a glass of water and collect saliva in your mouth. Spit the saliva into the top of the glass and watch the saliva for a few minutes. Watch as ,most likely, the saliva sinks to the bottom of the glass. The more of the saliva that sinks, the more Candida you have. During your mission to rid the candida, regularly test your levels and eventually if you do things right one morning your saliva will float at the top and stay afloat which shows minimal yeast/candida ! This(click that) thread will help explain the test more thoroughly.


Now I have a few questions for you. 

Have you had your Vitamin Levels Tested Recently? Liver functions test?

Are you currently on any medication at all, were you on any in the past?

Are you taking any supplements? 

When you say "avoid dairy" is that eliminate, pro actively avoid, or just try to avoid? 

Have you had a doctor check you out at all, use diagnostic procedures? 

All the best
Gianni


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## Miss Spencer

David said:


> Not all fruit and veggies are a like.  I just wonder if juicing can be taken to a whole new level.  Can we make the approach much more scientific.  For example, if someone has a deficiency in magnesium and calcium, is there a recipe for them.  If someone has Small Intestine Bacterial Overgrowth, are there recipes for them.  If someone is constipated, is there a recipe for them.  If someone is on Prednisone, is there a recipe for them.  If someone is on Methotrexate which interferes with folate, is there a recipe for them.  And on and on.  Thoughts on that?


The answer to your fourth question is YES!

A few years ago I read in a health book by Leslie and Susannah Kenton that freshly prepared carrot juice was excellent for settling down upset stomach aches, pain or diarrhea. At that time I was having trouble leaving the house on time to get to work because I was experiencing uncontrollable bowel movements every single morning between 3.00am and 9.00am. Not only was this exhausting on top of my already bad exhaustion due to the UC, I was also in strife with my boss for being continually late for work. After reading about the carrots I started to juice around 4 to 6 organic carrots every morning for breakfast. I didn’t really like carrots but I was pretty desperate at that stage so was prepared to try it regardless. I also added a knob of ginger root to help disguise/soften the carrot taste. Ginger root is well-known to help assist with upset tummies, so I thought it a good overall combination. Anyway that was years ago and I have never looked back. The carrot juice started working almost from day dot. Well I think it took a few weeks for my body to get use to the change but it did start working very quickly. 

I was still having numerous bowel movements every morning up until I drank my glass of carrot juice at 6.00am and after that there were no more movements until I next ate something fibrous around 9.00am. This meant I could leave the house on time, comfortably travel on public transport without the fear of a sudden bowel movement and arrive at work on time and keep my job. The juice also helped me to revive my sagging energy levels because juicing helped me to absorb much needed nutrients that I was otherwise lacking. 

Over the years I have acquired a taste for the carrots, so it has become a pleasure morning ritual rather than an endured one.  I normally use organic carrots due to two reasons: firstly the health benefits of organic and secondly the sweeter taste. I only use conventional carrots in an emergency if the shop has sold out of organic ones. I am going to try and grow my own too. I have come to rely on this method so much that I get panicky if we are low on carrots the night before. I pay $3.98 for a one kilo bag of organic carrots. Conventional carrots are $1.00 cheaper but I often find them tasteless or bitter, so I am prepared to pay a bit extra to get the best. 

Also being low on magnesium due to diarrhea from UC, I was able to replenish my magnesium levels by drinking green vegetables such as organic spinach. Carrot and spinach juice is a nice mix. The Dr Norman W Walker juicing book mentioned previously on one of these threads will give you the best combinations for various ailments and deficiencies. I believe that juicing and a gluten-free plant based diet has helped me achieve remission long term.

_Although I am flaring at the moment as three weeks ago I ate some chicken, wheat and ice-cream, all of which I KNOW will upset me but I did it anyway. I am now paying the price for my stupidity. _


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## Mark in Seattle

I tried the juicing and it was very painful on my gut.  

I tried it with fruit one day and that wasn't too bad, but the next day when I added in veggies (celery, cucumber, kale, and carrots), I got problems.  It was strained really well too.  I think in my case I really do need a super-low or no-residue diet, which may preclude any real juicing attempts.  I'm really bummed, I was so hoping this might be a good option for me.  I had a fair amount of acid reflux too from what I perceived as the  celery juice.  

Maybe I need to experiment with one kind of juice at a time rather than a mixture of juices.


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## Gianni

Mark in Seattle said:


> I tried the juicing and it was very painful on my gut.
> 
> I tried it with fruit one day and that wasn't too bad, but the next day when I added in veggies (celery, cucumber, kale, and carrots), I got problems.  It was strained really well too.  I think in my case I really do need a super-low or no-residue diet, which may preclude any real juicing attempts.  I'm really bummed, I was so hoping this might be a good option for me.  I had a fair amount of acid reflux too from what I perceived as the  celery juice.
> 
> Maybe I need to experiment with one kind of juice at a time rather than a mixture of juices.


May I ask if you juiced organic? 

Juicing is a liquid so I think it should fall under super-low residue. The only thing I can think of is the cucumber. Cucumber juice can cause gas in individuals, I don't have this problem, but my mother does. 

Gianni


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## Mark in Seattle

Gianni, 

Yes, absolutely everything was 100% organic.  I really tend to avoid anything not organic, wild, free-range, antibiotic/growth-hormone-free, etc.


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## David

Mark, what fruit did you utilize?


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## bunnyceleste

so glad to know Im not alone! when  I mention natural therapies like this to dr.s the just roll their eyes and try to push more drugs on me. no thanks. I was just in the hospital for a week after admitting through ER due to stricturing and in addition to high dose of IV steroids I was either no intake or clear fluids only.... so 3 times a day they would bring me a tray of jello, coffee and microwaved bouillion cube. such inflammatory damaging chemical laced foods! I stupidly tried the jello and immidielty needed morphine. I wasnt able to ararnge to have juice brought to me in the hospital, best I could get was real homeamde broth and coconut water adn herbal teas which were all helpful. post hospital I am back on my juice routine and thriving. imagine a world where you go to the hospital with a digestive disease and they bring you healing fresh veggie juices as your medicine. someday. now Im excited for the morning to make my breakfast juice!


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## Mark in Seattle

I used apple, banana,pear, & papaya.  Maybe a little plum.


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## Gianni

Try juicing just vegetables (low sugar) next time ( only juice a small glass to test it out). Some Crohnies cannot digest the sugars in the fruit all too well which will cause some diarrhea especially if you have Crohn's in the latter half of the small intestines. 

Try it, see if that helps.  

Gianni


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## David

Mark, you basically gave yourself a huge dose of high FODMAP foods.  If they led to an increase in symptoms, you may want to explore trying the low FODMAP diet.  Our wiki entry gives a decent overview, but here's a great paper.


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## mink

Hi Gianni,  i didnt intend to leave it so long before replying.  In between i have been re- reading your answer and researching. Thanks for encouraging us to do that.  thank you so much for your thorough caring detailed reply even in respect of my emotional state. Thanks for being so positive especially after everything you have been suffering, its really strengthened me. I agree the Candida should be treated first. Thank you for the juicing information recipes, and information on juicing and Candida.  I looked up the other positive threads too. What comes through is everyone's tenacity. I have a lot to learn.

Regarding medicines,  I had taken a homeopathic remedy silica as i thought when the pains first started that i had too much calcium in the blood. I have stopped it  after tests showed everything ok. Now I take Vit D drops in olive oil and Coconut oil capsules. I am on no other meds. 

I cook basic meals from scratch except for bread and some sauces. Wholemeal bread/cereal for breakfast, salad for lunch, evening meal can be stew, spag bol, indian/thai curry, pasta with salmon, salmon roasted with veg, steak and 2 veg. I positively eliminate dairy and sweet things. 

 I was found to be low on vit D + folate (folic acid) and am now awaiting results after supplementing.  On two occasions when the pains got so severe I  went to A&E both times they found nothing wrong with blood tests, x-ray, internal examination back passage.  They said it was stress.

Perhaps the homeopathic remedy precipitated  a breakdown as I had to come and stay with mum as i lost ability to think straight and take care of myself. (normally i live alone but thats no problem usually).  When i told my GP (and because I had been to A+E and they couldnt find anything wrong) she referred me to a psychiatrist and said she was unwilling to take any more investigative steps unless i complete sessions with the psychiatrist but I missed the appointment as I am at mums and just sent a letter apologizing and explaining.

 I was taking herbal meds from a masters degree qualified guy he suggested lack of sleep causes gastro intestinal pain but no longer believes candida is a problem and if i have symptoms is should be happy.  He was adamant on that so it was useless to contradict  though I privately disagree.

I am trying to improve my sleep pattern although with M.E. which knocks out your body clocks (sleep, appetitive, hormones) when you go over your strength limit the body pumps out more adrenaline and produces insomnia but have learned some rest positions to counteract but it takes time.  

It is probably just stress due to misuse of homeopathy (i was not under a homeopath I researched and obviously came up with wrong conclusion) and I am so ashamed  i panicked and bothered you on this forum.  you wasted your kind concern on me. However your kindness has really strengthened me and I am not sorry I learned about your refreshing attitude  it has really strengthened me. Also thank you for the juicing information, recipes and tips especially the greens will help with the Candida.

Mink


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## Gianni

> I cook basic meals from scratch except for bread and some sauces. Wholemeal bread/cereal for breakfast,


I'm glad you are making your meals from scratch, that will go a long way. I would like you to try and cut out grains, especially wheat and see if your symptoms subside. The more and more I read about grains, the more I dislike them and think they may be well more related to Crohn's Disease than we think. 

Have you heard of the Paleo Diet? Click on that link for our wiki entry. Many members here like hugh and others are pro active paleolithic dieters who preach the importance of removing grains from the diet. I'm sure he can elaborate more if he cares to contribute to the conversation. 



> They said it was stress.


I believe stress is a MAJOR factor here. I think it is an important to learn how to better handle stress within your body. Those who have a chronic condition, are constantly in the fight response of the fight or flight mechanism of the endocrine system. I still have a major problem with stress but it is something I am trying to conquer, but it is a constant battle. I believe that meditation and yoga are great stress suppressors. I am guessing you are too stressed to sleep and that can cause a myriad of ailments so it is important to be calm before you go to sleep. Try breathing exercises and go to bed in complete darkness as light will tell your body that it is still daylight which will disrupt your circadian rhythm and will keep you awake. 



> I was taking herbal meds from a masters degree qualified guy he suggested lack of sleep causes gastro intestinal pain


I would agree to an extent, I don't believe all pain is due to lack of sleep though. 



> but no longer believes candida is a problem and if i have symptoms is should be happy. He was adamant on that so it was useless to contradict though I privately disagree.


I wouldn't bet against candida's persistant nature. I am not even convinced I have candida completely under control. I do believe I have it pretty much under control but there is a very fine line between having candida under control and having it completely out of control. A candida curing diet really can be a permanent diet for those who want to take candida completely serious, I am one of those.




> I am so ashamed i panicked and bothered you on this forum. you wasted your kind concern on me.


Nonsense! I am on this forum for a reason, to help people and to learn myself. I am happy to help as much as I can. 


I think it is EXTREMELY important to be under the supervision of a G.I. while you figure out what exactly is wrong with you. Supplementing and self medicating blindly based on what you think you may have is dangerous and you may learn to regret that decision. The doctor might push drugs on you but you are in control and you can reject any medication he/she recommends if you feel strongly about that. The doctors are great tools to use for diagnostic procedures. They are educated to identify symptoms and can tell you how mild or severe your ailment may be. You may not even have a chronic condition but a simple gastro problem that needs a quick fix. You will be glad to know what you are dealing with rather than stressing about the myriad of possibilities on the table. When you learn about the condition you actually do have, you are able to attack it with the best weapons available instead of guessing a few treatments that may even worsen what you do actually have. 

Although I do not trust or appreciate modern allopathic drugs, I do appreciate a doctor's opinion, education, and networking. I think you will find that doctors aren't as scary when you go into the appointment realizing you are the boss, not him/her. 

Have you tried juicing? 
Are you trying to eat organic vegetables?
Do G.I. problems run in the family?

Gianni


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## bunnyceleste

awesome juice combo of the day- gold beet, carrot, celery, apple, lemon ginger zingy golden yum! as far as my experience with a gnarly stricture juicing is pure medicine.


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## Beach bum

That sounds fab, will definitely be trying it.


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## mink

Hi Gianni, 

i appreciate your good advice.  G.i. problems dont run in the family as far as I am aware, my parents nor their siblings nor my grandparents had any g. i. problems. 


 I completely agree with your view on Doctors, their education, networking and the valuable role they play.  I did ask my Doctor to investigate the pains for me but she refused to take any investigative steps and instead referred me to a psychiatrist on the basis that when I went to A&E they couldnt find anything wrong.  She said she would not give me any diagnostic tests until I had finished a course of psychiatric sessions and had the results. 

I agree with your views on sleep.  I have noticed a significant improvement in pain (disappearing) due to efforts to regulate my sleep pattern which is difficult with M.E.  (which I have been diagnosed with by a specialist) if i overdo things (go past my strength limit) instead of feeling sleepy adrenaline gets released and i get insomnia, mental fatigue (lack of focus, easily distracted, inability to make decisions,  slow thinking and response). So it is a long term ongoing battle for me. I am trying to get up at the same time and earlier everyday even though i only get a few hours sleep. I think because i have had chronic insomnia over a period of 11 years  due to M.E. the pain is more of a problem with me if i dont get sleep now, although before this latest digestive pain was never a symptom with me of insomnia, because i think the stress situation undermined my health on a deeper level than before its the only reason i can think of. 

  I| use a lumie sunray 100 lamp with simulates sunset and dawn (it alters the sleep/awake chemicals to induce sleep/wake) its brilliant at both much nicer than an alarm |(there is an alarm if you are worried you wont wake up but i dont need it)  when i am in M.E. adrenaline mode then i have to do the sunset a few times and i also feel more dead than alive on waking.  But otherwise if i am in control of my sleep pattern i wake up happy because of the sunrise effect.    |You are right about breathing exercise.I do this also before I go to sleep thanks for the great advice.

I notice an increase in symptoms due to stress triggers. It is not in my control to remove all the triggers but acting on bible principles helps me to have more control over how i react. i find i need to pray for wisdom and "power beyond what is normal" to do this, especially due to my own imperfection. I do this every day as stress can come unexpectedly. Proverbs and Ecclesiastes are fascinating bible books as is the book of James.  The bible is a wonderful revealer of human nature - which hasnt changed - and it gives insight into common pitfalls of humankind and how to avoid them.  Its helped me understand that my own imperfection can at times cause/add to problems but also what I need to do about it.  I find it fascinating.  Also prayer brings "the peace of God that excels all thought"  (philippians 4:6,7) which i find amazing.  Its not about miracles. its about working in conjunction with my prayer, praying sincerely and gaining accurate knowledge of the God who made the heavens and earth engenders a close relationship, improves the quality of pray and develops deeper faith and trust. I find reading and studying the bible calms me. I am also thinking of getting a deep tissue massage (i think its called a Swiss holistic massage).  I note you find yoga helps but lying down and letting someone do the work appeals to me, due to the M.E.  As for the stress triggers I feel I can remove, i am being pro-active towards that end thought it will take time.

I was very impressed with the Angel juicer. While I was figuring out which one to buy,   i discovered that phytoestrogens are causing flare ups of my endometriosis symptoms (the symptoms and pains are different to the g.i. pains).  I normally just drink water at home but since staying at mum's i had been drinking a lot of peppermint and using a peppermint cleanser (peppermint is high in phytoestrogens) I have never been so sensitive before perhaps the stress has weakened me overall. When i stopped drinking the herbal teas its better, but i am still sensitive to foods high in p.e's which i had never been sensitive to before.  So I didnt buy the juicer, as i am concerned that this would only concentrate the phyto estrogens i would be ingesting but partly also because i had seen some improvement in the g.i. pains from improving my sleep.  I am hoping this phytoestrogen thing is just temporary. 

 instead I am eating kale every day, and I am sure it is acting on the candida (eating foods with biotin helps fight candida) it flared up at first but now i am seeing an improvement. I am going to stick with it.  I got the idea of Kale from your receipe and I researched and saw it is high in biotin. So Thank you hugely for that Gianni. You are right about it being a life long diet, people have got candida back again after relaxing their diet once their symptoms left them.  

I dont seem to have a problem with grains.  I have been tested for celiac disease in the course of being diagnosed for M.E and this was negative.  Also I feel I simply could not give them up.  Of course if i did start to feel they were affecting me I would probably have no choice not to give them up.

I had a chat with the Psychiatrist and we agreed it is probably best for me to wait until I go home before I start sessions but i have the option of starting sessions in my mum's area if necessary.  I dont feel that its necessary at the moment.

Thanks Gianni for your encouragement about Doctors and  invaluable insight into stress, sleep and your determination to fight your candida, you've strengthened me again.

I really hope you receive back the good vibes and care and attention that you give to me and others
My very best wishes for you and take care Gianni. 
Mink.


----------



## mink

HI Gianni,

I hope you are still winning on the health front, you so deserve to as it seems to me you have made great sacrifices in your life to win the your health fight, financially (juicer  but well worth it ) and food wise, being vegan and avoiding grains and other foods affecting Candida.  That is a very tough lifestyle to follow 24/365.  Yet you just do it.  Through your posts I am convinced juicing is the best option for Crohn's and the difficult changes you have made in your diet are vital to sustaining the relief you have gained. Thank you for making me understand this. The phyto estrogen effect was temporary when I got my diet more balanced (not eating kale every day).  

As my symptoms have subsided, out of respect for you Gianni, and all the other users of this site, especially considering the sensitive and emotive function of this site, i do not deserve freedom of speech in this forum unless and until I am diagnosed with Crohn's.  

Gianni, I deeply appreciate your uplifting and attentive posts sharing your insights and wisdom which you have gained in the hardest possible way, and sharing it with me and others to comfort us and revealing your amazing stance that needs to be adopted to get through the reality of each day in the face of Crohn's.

Gianni I will never forget you and will continue to acknowledge you and others in my prayers, thanking God for the upbuilding support i received from your posts and from reading other's experiences. 

I hope you dont mind Gianni, only the following spring to my mind concerning you :

Proverbs 17:17  "A true companion is loving all the time, and is a brother that is born for when there is distress".  

Provberbs: 19:17 "He that is showing favor to the lowly one is lending to Jehovah, and his treatment He  will repay to him".

Psalm 41: 1 and 3  "Happy is anyone acting with consideration toward the lowly one; in the day of calamity Jehovah will provide escape for him. Jehovah himself will sustain him upon a divan of illness; all his bed you will certainly change during his sickness"  (refreshing one by various means just as you have done for me and others).

Also i love this, as it shows God hears our prayers:
Psalm 145:16 "The desire of those fearing him he will perform, And their cry for help he will hear, and he will save them".

Thank you. Mink


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## crohnsmother

Just read your post. Do you eat between juicing, or is that your main diet? My daughter, 13 yrs has cd so it is not all optional but I encourage her to drink smoothies. After your article, thinking  to get a juicer. Doc said today since she has a stricture, her growth is being stunted so may need surgery. Do you have a suggestion for a juice that also helps weight gain?
Thanks for your post! Will I be alerted of your answer-not yet familiar with this system


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## Gianni

Hi Crohnsmother, 

I do eat between juicing. I am vegan and eat solid foods but just will include juicing into my daily regimen. I do sometimes do juice fasts where I will only drink juice and water for an allotted time... a couple days, 1 week, 2 weeks etc etc. 

No juices are really going to directly help your daughter gain weight although I believe that including nutrient dense juices may help allow your daughter to be more receptive to holding onto the good proteins, fats etc. I believe restructuring her diet would be the first move to do here. 

You can make a new thread in the Your Story (click that link) forum and post your daughters story so other members can better help you and your daughter. 

Also if you wouldn't mind I would love to hear the specifics of your daughter's current diet. You can post it in the Diet Fitness and Supplements Forum and I will give it a look 

Yes you will be notified when anyone replies on a thread that you yourself have replied to. It will show up in your "My Forum" section on the front page. 

Hope this helped

Gianni


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## canuckscouter

Gianni, thank you so much for this. This is exactly what I have been looking for. Off to find a juicer......


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## Ya noy

Gianni said:


> Unfortunately I do not. I really want to get a dehydrator but they are rather expensive. I would love to get one soon and then write about those benefits as well, so maybe in the future sometime. I know there are a few people on this forum who use dehydrators so you might want to reach out to them. Using the search engine by typing in dehydrator should yield some results. Sorry I couldn't be of more help as I'm not entirely comfortable claiming health benefits from dehydrators yet.
> 
> I'm glad you enjoyed the post.
> 
> Gianni


I paid all of $1.50 for mine.  Rummage sales.  You live in L.A.?  Shouldn't be difficult.  Just get up at 6am on any Saturday morning and go for a bike ride.  It's how I got my bike too, and it's an extremely high-end titanium road bike that normally would run around $6K new.  (I'm not paranoid either, everyone really does want to steal my bike!)   Craigslist is good too.

Also how I got all my canning jars and equipment, fermenting crock pots, and oh, just about any and everything imaginable.


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## Jennifer

Hey Gianni I've got a quick question about juicing. Probably a stupid and easily answered one but I have to ask.

Why do people have to juice like 10 or so carrots when normally they'd probably only eat one for a snack or a couple in a meal? *Where's the science behind X juiced carrots = 1 carrot? Is there science behind it or is more added just to reduce hunger?* 

Why can't we juice what we would normally eat? Sure it'd be like a shot glass of juice but it would contain the nutrition we're looking for rather than possible overkill which may cause diarrhea and chew up all your cash. 

Let's say I juice my veggies that I'd normally eat for one meal and have my protein or whatever else I eat on the side since I wont be juicing that and just do it that way. Will I not be getting enough nutrients? I'm aware that some nutrients are left in the pulp that was removed from the juicer and even the best juicers out there don't remove all the nutrients or moisture so one may need to add an extra carrot or two but why 5,000? I would never eat that much of one thing in one sitting unless I wanted diarrhea, which I don't. 

I think juicing would have more of a chance with me anyway if I didn't have to buy as many veggies (would be more cost effective, all you really need to do is buy the juicer and just juice what you would have ate + maybe _a little_ extra) and would reduce the possibility of diarrhea since you wouldn't take anymore in than you'd normally consume. 

Guess this was more than one question but in the bold is the most important part and that question doesn't apply to just carrots but for all things juiced. There has to be some science behind it somewhere. 

People don't normally consume so many different veggies at one time. They eat what's available around them even if we go way back to hunter gatherers. In stores we have access to foods which would never normally grow around us so I don't see the need for juicing everything in the store into one glass unless you're doing something specific for a vitamin deficiency. Feel free to school me in this department.

David if you know the answer then feel free to jump in. I know you blend rather than juice. Do you add extra food than you'd normally consume or do you just blend up what you would have had with your meal?

Keep in mind I'm looking at juicing as a way to consume vegetables without having to deal with the fiber they come with rather than having to cook them down to make them easier to digest. I would continue to consume other things I can tolerate such as meats and some grain products. Edit: And would also continue with 3 meals a day along with possible snacks.


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## Gianni

> Why do people have to juice like 10 or so carrots when normally they'd probably only eat one for a snack or a couple in a meal? Where's the science behind X juiced carrots = 1 carrot? Is there science behind it or is more added just to reduce hunger?


Well the reason why I personally like including or suggesting a bunch of vegetables into the recipes is because I don't believe "normally" is enough vegetables. I believe most people today aren't eating nearly enough vegetables as we should be consuming. I don't really ever juice just one vegetable like 10 carrots. Rather I incorporate a wide variety of different vegetables. It is an amount that we wouldn't even think about having on our dinner plates but it is something you can almost bet that we had in our more primal times. We didn't have grains, packaged foods, always readily available meats, to keep us full and at the same time our ancestors expended energy much more rapidly than we do on a daily basis. A staple of the our primal ways was foraging. Anthropologists believe the women foraged while the men hunted. While not all environments yielded the best results for foraging, most did and I'm sure we capitalized on that. Also I realize that they probably didn't have access to winter kale and ginger, and garlic etc etc. But what they did have access to was more raw plants that really aren't grown commercially any longer. And that is the beauty of so many of the vegetables and fruits. Although many look, taste, and appear different they all contain many of the same baseline vitamins, minerals, and enzymes. Take carrots for example. According to researchers they weren't cultivated as food until 5,000 or so years ago yet we find such great benefits in them. They aren't just made to give us great benefits, rather the human genome will evolve to create these benefits. So a likely explanation is that our human ancestry had been in contact with high levels of the same antioxidants, vitamins, and minerals that are within a carrot. 

Think of it this way. I could have made this post about the importance of eating A whopping salad for lunch everyday. And then between dinner and lunch 2 carrots and then dinner include many many more vegetables but that isn't realistic and I'm not sure many people would be comfortable making 70% of their diet vegetables. 

I don't believe an all vegetarian diet is a smart decision in the longrun but I do believe that vegetables are the medicine of nature and hold great healing properties and that is why I went vegan for a year... not because I believe it is the best diet for humans, but because I believe it is the best diet for a sick body. So by just including what you normally would eat and just juicing it is basically just juicing to avoid the fiber which is something I wouldn't suggest. You would actually be cutting down on your vitamin intake and you would be spending $100 on a juicer that wouldn't be utilized properly. 

From another angle: 

I believe that most diseases today are caused by the weakening of the immune system whether it be through environmental toxins, or diet. Many people in this world are sick so I would assume they aren't really getting adequate nutrition ( just showing you my thought process)

So by just juicing what one sick person "normally" eats, I don't think will benefit that person much if at all. 

From another angle: 

Looking at just raw vitamin and mineral levels found in today's average celery they are vastly different than a truly organic celery. So our ancestors are eating truly organic celery grown from nutrient dense and rich soil thus they are getting more vitamins and minerals therefore today we need to supplement even more to reach those levels. 



> Why can't we juice what we would normally eat? Sure it'd be like a shot glass of juice but it would contain the nutrition we're looking for rather than possible overkill which may cause diarrhea and chew up all your cash.


I simply believe people need to eat more vegetables than they normally eat. Have you tried juicing? Did it cause you diarrhea? Usually we can figure out why the juice is causing those issues. 



I don't really want people to look at juicing as just a way to remove fiber. While I do juice because I believe that we need to include more vegetables and juicing does that, I do believe fiber is extremely important for digestive health. I like the gut rest Idea for juice fasts and for severe cases but after I juice I often have a big salad with lots of fiber 

Juicing with other meals and snacks and what not is perfectly fine but again I think it's a way for people to include more vegetables to the levels I truly think we do need. 

Anyways I hope that answers your question... it may not have. 



Gianni


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## Jennifer

Gianni said:


> I simply believe people need to eat more vegetables than they normally eat.


That's your answer. I was hoping for numbers but I added some towards the end of this post. 



Gianni said:


> Think of it this way. I could have made this post about the importance of eating A whopping salad for lunch everyday. And then between dinner and lunch 2 carrots and then dinner include many many more vegetables but that isn't realistic and I'm not sure many people would be comfortable making 70% of their diet vegetables.


I don't see what's wrong with that. In the long run it sounds cheaper then juicing and not just because you don't have to buy a juicer. Sadly that's a diet many of us on here can't follow unfortunately. I'd be comfortable making 70% of my diet in the form of fruits and vegetables. 



Gianni said:


> I don't believe an all vegetarian diet is a smart decision in the longrun


Why not? Studies have been done on vegetarians and how they live longer. Here's just a quick link:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/kathy-freston/plant-based-diet_b_1981838.html That one even mentions them being healthier. 



Gianni said:


> So by just including what you normally would eat and just juicing it is basically just juicing to avoid the fiber which is something I wouldn't suggest. You would actually be cutting down on your vitamin intake and you would be spending $100 on a juicer that wouldn't be utilized properly.


There's a lot I don't understand here. Let's say more vegetables are included and are enough to make you full for a meal. Is that still cutting down on your vitamin intake? How much? What does it matter how someone uses their juicer? That's irrelevant. Why is juicing to avoid fiber a bad thing? Lots of people can't handle a high fiber diet, including myself. If I were to eat a lot of raw vegetables, organic or not, I'd get diarrhea from it. If I were to juice them instead to avoid the fiber and didn't get diarrhea, wouldn't that be a good thing? You're not absorbing much of anything with diarrhea. 



Gianni said:


> toxins


I don't understand this word. It could mean a lot of things. I know you put environmental in front of it but that still doesn't explain what it means. Reminds me of the phrase, "remove toxins from the body." I don't understand what any of these "toxins" are. 



Gianni said:


> Have you tried juicing? Did it cause you diarrhea?


Not yet but we've talked about how I haven't and why already therefore I've never gotten diarrhea from it. I'm not against trying it and never have been. Any raw fruits or vegetables give me diarrhea if that matters. 



Gianni said:


> Usually we can figure out why the juice is causing those issues.


How? Besides eliminating through trial and error. 



Gianni said:


> I don't really want people to look at juicing as just a way to remove fiber. While I do juice because I believe that we need to include more vegetables and juicing does that, I do believe fiber is extremely important for digestive health. I like the gut rest Idea for juice fasts and for severe cases but after I juice I often have a big salad with lots of fiber


So we just add a little fiber to our diets every now and then when needed. 



Gianni said:


> I think it's a way for people to include more vegetables to the levels I truly think we do need.


What levels are those? At some point people will need numbers and scientific backing. So I grabbed some real quick.

This is for "mental well-being" so says the study. "Seven 80-gram servings of fruits and vegetables every day." http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/...tables-wellbeing-produce-happy_n_1952516.html I'm sure we could find one for what we need physically as well (I'm getting internet overload right now so maybe someone else would like to chime in for that portion). 

So how much is 80 grams then? Depends on the fruit or vegetable. You could weigh them if you want or there are some guides online which will tell you how much is in an 80 gram serving for X fruit/vegetable. Here's one: http://www.best-salads.com/p/vegetables-how-much-is-one-portion-80.html

I'm no scientist but the serving sizes I'm seeing don't match the juicing recipes at all. A lot more is included in the juicing recipes. Was just trying to figure out why its necessary but apparently it isn't.


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## hugh

_"I'm no scientist but the serving sizes I'm seeing don't match the juicing recipes at all. A lot more is included in the juicing recipes. Was just trying to figure out why its necessary but apparently it isn't. "_

If you are interested in serving sizes then maybe Terry Whals can help
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KLjgBLwH3Wc

It's worth watching the whole thing but at 8:50 she starts on serving sizes  Her interest is Multiple Sclerosis but portion sizes would be the same. (although you might need to adjust quantities for vegetarianism). 

Everybody is different and some get alot out of their food, some less so there is no set 'serving size'.
Juicing is a way of taking large quantities of nutrients, way more than the 'required amount'

_"Studies have been done on vegetarians and how they live longer."_
I'm always sceptical, firstly, almost any diet is better than the SAD 





secondly, these studies are almost always bogus.
the china study is bullshit :ysmile:


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## Jennifer

hugh said:


> Juicing is a way of taking large quantities of nutrients, way more than the 'required amount'


There's a lot to be concerned about if you're taking in too many nutrients so serving sizes are very important.

"...too much vitamin C or zinc could cause nausea, diarrhea, and stomach cramps. Too much selenium could lead to problems including hair loss, gastrointestinal upset, fatigue, and mild nerve damage."

"When it comes to vitamins and minerals, more is not necessarily better."
http://www.webmd.com/food-recipes/features/effects-of-taking-too-many-vitamins


----------



## Gianni

> I don't see what's wrong with that. In the long run it sounds cheaper then juicing and not just because you don't have to buy a juicer. Sadly that's a diet many of us on here can't follow unfortunately. I'd be comfortable making 70% of my diet in the form of fruits and vegetables.


Oh nothing is wrong with that, not at all. If you can do a real 70% fruit and vegetable diet then all the power to you but that is a difficult task. If you think about the grains, oils, starches, meats that are in your average day, it becomes a daunting task. It certainly is easier for people to rather just supplement juices. 



> Why not? Studies have been done on vegetarians and how they live longer. Here's just a quick link:
> http://www.huffingtonpost.com/kathy-...b_1981838.html That one even mentions them being healthier.


Yes, I read all these studies too but you must realize that vegetarian and vegans are generally more health conscious in every aspect of life. Typically it is these vegans that are juicing and that are doing yoga and that are eating organic and that are growing their own food. There is no doubt to me that a vegan and vegetarian diet can be extremely beneficial when it comes to health but I for one also believe it can be dangerous in the LONG term. When you become vegetarian you are disregarding a huge portion of our evolutionary diet. While you may be able to supplement many of the meat nutrients, it is hard to say if you are truly getting them all. Food science is very juvenile right now. There is simply not much out there. Researchers estimate there are as many as 10,000 food chemicals not yet discovered... that being Vitamin A is a food chemical, Vitamin C is a food chemical, so on and so on. By ignoring the big elephant in the room you may be doing your body harm. Ignorance is bliss but not when it comes to your diet and your health. 

And yes these vegans are living longer... but longer than the average.. the average being what hugh just covered: The SAD diet. 



> There's a lot I don't understand here. Let's say more vegetables are included and are enough to make you full for a meal. Is that still cutting down on your vitamin intake? How much?


Well you would be including more vitamins then because you would be consuming more than you would normally eat. You asked if you just juiced what you normally ate. If you juiced just one carrot (what you normally ate) instead of eating it then yes, presumably you could be losing vitamins because the pulp undoubtedly contains nutrition. This is where vitamin absorption comes in and its hard to tell for the individual but some people might not assimilate all the nutrients if the carrot is raw, while they would absorb more in liquid form although for the most part they tend to stay the same. (from what I know). 



> What does it matter how someone uses their juicer? That's irrelevant.


I don't think that's irrelevant. There will be differences between someone who juices only what they normally consume versus an influx of fruits and vegetables. And a difference between those who juice mostly fruits versus mostly vegetables etc etc. 



> Why is juicing to avoid fiber a bad thing? Lots of people can't handle a high fiber diet, including myself. If I were to eat a lot of raw vegetables, organic or not, I'd get diarrhea from it. If I were to juice them instead to avoid the fiber and didn't get diarrhea, wouldn't that be a good thing? You're not absorbing much of anything with diarrhea.


It isn't a bad thing. I just think that juicing has much more use than simply removing fiber is all. And no doubt that if that were the case then juicing will benefit you and get those vitamin levels up. I would just caution that it is important to retain fiber within the diet. While some people can't handle alot of fiber I think it is important to slowly incorporate fiber into your diet to kind of build back digestive health. 

My brother couldn't handle fiber at all so I told him to get a juicer and he did. He juiced for about 6 months quite regularly. While he never did abandon fiber completely he did avoid. After about 6 months of juicing he noticed that fiber didn't bother him anymore and he was able to have salads on the regular. You see juicing can be a gateway into including fiber and it definitely can be utilized for that but I guess I simply think juicing should be viewed as so much more than just a way to avoid fiber. 





> I don't understand this word. It could mean a lot of things. I know you put environmental in front of it but that still doesn't explain what it means. Reminds me of the phrase, "remove toxins from the body." I don't understand what any of these "toxins" are.


Just how we don't fully understand everything that aids that human body, we don't understand everything that hurts it. But the known ones include heavy metals such as mercury, arsenic, aluminum, Lead etc. Sugar substitutes like aspartame and acesulfame K. Detergent cleaners- Benzene, Benzoic. Plastic chemicals such as BHA, BHT. Formaldehyde, Nitrites, Pesticides, Pharmaceuticals... The list goes on and on and on http://www.purezing.com/living/toxins/living_toxins_dangerousingredients.html


Muppet had a similar question in my other thread so I'll quote my response: 


> Great question, When I first started juicing I wondered the same thing.
> 
> Well first off juicing in general is an amazing "detox" because the vitamins, minerals, phytonutrients, etc are all beneficial to the major detox organs like the liver, kidneys, skin, and lungs.
> 
> The liver has the function of filtering the blood coming from the digestive tract. So we eat toxic foods then the toxins are in our blood stream momentarily but the liver will hold on to these toxins and will turn the fat soluble toxins into water soluble ones through enzymes. Fat soluble toxins pose more of a threat because well they will stay in your body for a long period of time while water soluble toxins will be filtered by the kidneys and ultimately excreted as urine. The other more concrete toxins that could not be made into water soluble are excreted through bile produced by the liver.
> 
> The liver however is very sensitive especially in the modern world today with the influx of environmental toxins. Liver's will get sluggish fast and start accumulating a surplus of toxins. So in a way you can imagine the liver as a sponge which is constantly being squeezed and pulsed, but then it gets sluggish... so the dirt water starts to build up a little more at a time (toxins) which slows down the liver even more and more and it turns into a snowball effect. Then the sponge becomes placid and it is full of dirty water. So by giving the liver an inpouring of vitamins minerals and enzymes, it will start to soak in these nutrients and get healthier and pulse a little bit and a little bit more until all the dirty water (toxins) is out and start to work normal again.
> 
> The liver when diseased, inflamed, fatty, sluggish will start to release toxins irresponsibly and the toxins will instead be stored in our fat cells which can cause longterm health complications.
> 
> Here is a more raw way to look at it:
> 
> Quote:
> The liver plays several roles in detoxification: it filters the blood to remove large toxins, synthesizes and
> gets rid of bile full of cholesterol and other fat-soluble toxins, and the live enzymatically eliminates unwanted
> chemicals. The enzymatic process to dispose of toxins occurs in two phases: phase 1 (Oxidations) and phase 2 (Conjugation). Phase 1 neutralizes the toxin or changes the toxic chemical to form activated intermediates which
> will then be neutralized by phase 2 of the enzyme system. This pathway converts a toxic chemical into a less
> harmful chemical and is achieved by oxidation, reduction and hydrolysis reactions. During this process, free
> radicals are produced and if there are too many it can damage the liver cells. With the help of antioxidant, it reduces
> the damage caused by free radicals. One important antioxidant for neutralizing the free radicals produced in phase 1
> is glutathione (GHS) is oxidized to glutathione disulfide (GSSG). This antioxidant is required for one of the key
> phase 2 processes. When so many free radicals are produced from phase 1, the glutathione stops producing
> oxidative stress or liver damage. The toxins are then transformed into activated intermediates; therefore the rate at
> which phase 1 produces activated intermediates must be balanced by the rate at which phase 2 finishes their
> processing. Phase 2 is called the conjugation pathway because the liver cells add another substance such as
> cysteine, glycine, or a sulphur molecule to a toxic chemical to make it less harmful. As a result it makes the toxin
> water-soluble so that it may then be excreted from the body via watery fluids such as bile or urine. There are six
> phase 2 detoxification pathways:
> 1.Glutathione conjugation
> 2. Amino acid conjugation
> 3. Sulfation
> 4. Acetylation
> 5. Glucuronidation
> These conjugation molecules join with specific enzymes to catalyze the reaction process. The liver is then able to
> turn drugs, hormones, and other various toxins into substances that are secreted from the body. Read more: http://people.cornellcollege.edu/bno...liverDetox.pdf
> 
> 
> As far as specific juices go: There are two types of Detox juices. What I mean by this is there are juices that will target the vitamins and minerals the liver in particular will need and then there are those that will try to achieve a high alkalinity and sulfur level.
> 
> Juices that target the liver will pertain to the above process I talked about
> 
> 
> The alkalinity theory is a bit more complicated. Basically in a nut shell the theory is that these toxins hold a acidic ph level and your body will create fat to house these toxins.
> (this goes along with the theory that it isn't fattening foods that is causing obesity issues but rather the influx of toxins). So the liver is sick, and the toxins are released into the bloodstream so your body holds on to more fat so that it can house the harmful toxins because it wants the toxins out of the bloodstream as soon as possible.
> 
> Now these acidic toxins are stored in fat cells so by giving your body Alkaline foods like vegetables, the acids will be neutralized and released and with them the fat cells will be too. So with that the liver becomes less fatty and healthier and the Ph level in your body will go down and neutralize many of the toxins.
> 
> The Alkaline theory is a bit more subjective and exactly that, a theory but it does make a bit more sense to me at least the fat part. Many people try to lose weight through exercise but It rarely works, in part because I think the body wants to hold on to the fat to protect you from the toxins it has encapsulated.
> 
> The sulphur aspect is more concrete and I'll let you read about it here :http://www.livestrong.com/article/317807-sulphur-detox/
> 
> Typically Juice Detox recipes will include a high alkaline through leafy greens while incorporating high sulfur produce like Onions and Garlic. Of course the leafy greens also play a double role by including very helpful vitamins to keep the detox organs healthy and happy.





> How? Besides eliminating through trial and error.


Trial and error is one useful way. Eliminating fruits is a common resolution to this problem especially amongst crohnies as much of the sugars are digested in the lower small intestines ( often where people are diseased). People also don't always do well with sulphur containing vegetables. Some people also don't do well with acidic produce.



> What levels are those? At some point people will need numbers and scientific backing. So I grabbed some real quick.
> 
> This is for "mental well-being" so says the study. "Seven 80-gram servings of fruits and vegetables every day." http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/1...n_1952516.html I'm sure we could find one for what we need physically as well (I'm getting internet overload right now so maybe someone else would like to chime in for that portion).
> 
> So how much is 80 grams then? Depends on the fruit or vegetable. You could weigh them if you want or there are some guides online which will tell you how much is in an 80 gram serving for X fruit/vegetable. Here's one: http://www.best-salads.com/p/vegetab...ortion-80.html
> 
> I'm no scientist but the serving sizes I'm seeing don't match the juicing recipes at all. A lot more is included in the juicing recipes. Was just trying to figure out why its necessary but apparently it isn't.


I weighed an apple in my refrigerator then converted it to grams. 142 grams for an average sized apple. I simply don't believe 4 apples a day worth of fruits and vegetables is enough. Sure that is an upgrade from the USDA's recommended daily allowances ( which I think is completely off base) but It isn't much of an upgrade. 

While I realize science is what people need and the science just isn't there behind juicing. I have an excel sheet where I have labeled all the fruits and vegetables and their vitamin contents but its another thing to try and pick how much a body needs. I do try... I try and see what makes most sense but really I think it is mostly about listening to your body and not not indulge hunger on processed foods but to eat a strong vegetable diet that includes that meat and legumes and so on and so forth. I for one have noticed and now believe that that hunger feeling you get isn't because your body wants substance, it is because your body needs nutrition. People will have a huge horribly deficient meal but then be hungry a few hours later. Well if they ate a nutrient dense diet, that wouldn't have happened. I believe listening to your body is very underrated today. 

Science backing juicing would be great but theres not much, if any research being done for it. But I don't think because there is a lack there of funding for research towards juicing that people should steer away. Science hasn't uncovered much to be honest so I'd hate for people to hold their breath waiting for the ok to start eating the correct amount of fruits and vegetables. 

Gianni


----------



## Jennifer

Gianni said:


> If you think about the grains, oils, starches, meats that are in your average day, it becomes a daunting task. It certainly is easier for people to rather just supplement juices.


I don't think so. If you go by what you purchase from the store, be it organic or not or if you go by what you grow in your own backyard, you know what you're eating and where it came from. If you make your own food, just like you have to make your own juices then it shouldn't be anymore difficult than juicing. This is off topic though and I'm not trying to derail here so we can simply agree to disagree here. 



Gianni said:


> While you may be able to supplement many of the meat nutrients, it is hard to say if you are truly getting them all.


Blood work would tell if you were or not.



Gianni said:


> Researchers estimate there are as many as 10,000 food chemicals not yet discovered


Now I need sources.



Gianni said:


> And yes these vegans are living longer... but longer than the average.. the average being what hugh just covered: The SAD diet.


That's a good thing though. Average is average, proving that people can be healthier through different food choices is important to getting rid of the so called "SAD" diet (I never heard it called that before so I don't know what it stands for, but I get the idea of it well enough). So I wouldn't dismiss the studies just because you don't care for the current average. Its one of the few ways to get rid of that type of food or at least help to limit it. 



Gianni said:


> While I realize science is what people need and the science just isn't there behind juicing.


That's unfortunate. 



Gianni said:


> I for one have noticed and now believe that that hunger feeling you get isn't because your body wants substance, it is because your body needs nutrition. People will have a huge horribly deficient meal but then be hungry a few hours later.


People will crave specific things due to being low in them no doubt such as salt for one.

"One of salt’s main benefits is to promote fluid retention in our bodies. For this reason, dehydration from sweating, diarrhea, or vomiting may increase our taste for salt." http://answers.webmd.com/answers/1198196/why-am-i-craving-salt

People sometimes also feel they are still hungry when its very likely they may be thirsty.

"The hypothalamus controls both hunger and thirst, so it sends the same signal whether you are hungry or thirsty... "It might be that empty feeling in your stomach only needs some water for satiety." http://www.livestrong.com/article/441564-difference-between-being-hungry-and-thirsty/ I don't like using that link but the only one I found from Web MD was meant for children and didn't explain it well enough. 



Gianni said:


> Well if they ate a nutrient dense diet, that wouldn't have happened.


Any source for that?



Gianni said:


> But I don't think because there is a lack there of funding for research towards juicing that people should steer away. Science hasn't uncovered much to be honest so I'd hate for people to hold their breath waiting for the ok to start eating the correct amount of fruits and vegetables.


I don't believe anyone is arguing against juicing at all. I'm just curious and love learning so I tend to ask a lot of questions especially if I haven't done it. These questions aren't for my own benefit though but also for everyone who's been reading.


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## Budgie Pal

To me it speaks volumes that industrialized nations have higher rates of inflammatory diseases than do nations where people eat more agrarian back-to-the-land diets. Doctors can minimize diet with Crohn's til the cow comes home, but some things come down to "the obvious." Gianni's first post on this thread holds insight. 

I'll share my opinions with the caveat that they are only opinions. The pharmaceutical industry, while wonderful in many instances, is big business. Any time medicine is deemed the only therapy to treat a disease with little mention of how personal responsibility plays a role, then a huge financial benefit goes to the "purveyors of pills." Personally, I feel that many Western medicine doctors are guilty of breach of duty when they fail to even mention diet as a contributing factor in disease. Thankfully, more and more are doing the right thing. That said, I'm a believer in individuals taking personal responsibility for their health and with the Internet at our disposal and bookstores galore, there is much we can do for ourselves. I say utilize conventional Western medicine where necessary, but put 100% effort into "healing thyself" through stress reduction, exercise, sunlight, spiritual nourishment from God, and unadulterated whole foods grown in the earth. 

Juicing allows the digestive system to rest while allowing boatloads of good nutrients to bless the body. Gianni's juicing approach makes good sense and I am so glad this topic is being discussed on this thread.


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## Beach bum

Reading another thread on here made me wonder  - "what do our nearest relatives the chimps eat?"

This site tells me they eat nearly 60% friuit and they _juice_ !

"They chew some fruits to form little fruit-balls, called 'wadges', and then dip them in water before sucking out the juice."



http://www.wildchimps.org/wcf/english/files/chimp4.htm


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## jlm

Crabby said:


> I wouldn't mind reading a new thread made by either of you on the subject of genetics vs the American diet as possible causes. Would be entertaining and I might even weigh in.


I agree with this... Crohn's disease is found on both sides of my family. Genetics can't be fully discounted.


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## KWalker

This is my take on it. While we can't ruin our genetics from a potential cause for crohns, it would then be possible that the first people who developed crohns did so because of their eating habits, and then once they have children it gets passed on, etc.  It's the same as diabetes. I know there will be many people who disagree with me, but diabetes can very well be contributed to diet, just as much as it can be genetics. Think about it, (for example) your parents eat like complete shit. If you're growing up around people that eat like that, 10 chances to one you're going to eat like that as well. Boom, diabetes.  Sure your genetics may make you more susceptible to diabetes, but it is because of the food that goes into your mouth, even before you're old enough to feed yourself.  It is very well a lifestyle problem. 

I think diet is HUGE with crohns, and I only need a few reasons to believe so. Crohn's diagnosis are on the rise, and what a coincidence so are the amount of fast food chains we see, the increasing number of additives companies are filling their products with to reduce cost and increase profit. This stuff isn't real food.  I don't know when the first case of crohns was found, but I would put money on it not being anywhere near the caveman times. Why? Because they ate natural, properly grown/killed foods.  This is why many diets are based off foods cavemen ate, because they didn't have crohns. 

I am experiencing it myself currently after starting the SCD diet. I'm not preaching the diet by any means, but I considered myself symptom free before starting the diet. Hell was I wrong! I've felt better in the 26 days I've been on it than any medicine has ever made me feel, and I can now say I am symptom free. Look at the crap in the medicine many people take, there's so many fillers and preservatives. It's all chemicals that is not natural by any means for the body. We'll use thimerasol for example. 

I once talked to an African American doctor that was working in a hospital while I was there. We got talking about crohns and he told me before he came to Canada, he had no idea what crohns was. Weird, they don't eat the crap we do, and they don't have nearly as many cases of crohns in Africa. Hmm?

Also, let's look at the number of people over 65 on the forum. I don't even think I could count 5. However, let's look at the number of young kids, or parents of young kids joining the forum. Why? because it's much faster and cheaper to eat like crap than it is to healthy. 

Lastly, I'm sure I'm not the only person noticing the over representation of members from Western European countries on here. Again, weird. We have high numbers of crohns, we're also developed countries where our food companies focus on low production costs for high profits.


----------



## Ya noy

KWalker said:


> This is my take on it. While we can't ruin our genetics from a potential cause for crohns, it would then be possible that the first people who developed crohns did so because of their eating habits, and then once they have children it gets passed on, etc.  It's the same as diabetes. I know there will be many people who disagree with me, but diabetes can very well be contributed to diet, just as much as it can be genetics. Think about it, (for example) your parents eat like complete shit. If you're growing up around people that eat like that, 10 chances to one you're going to eat like that as well. Boom, diabetes.  Sure your genetics may make you more susceptible to diabetes, but it is because of the food that goes into your mouth, even before you're old enough to feed yourself.  It is very well a lifestyle problem.
> 
> I think diet is HUGE with crohns, and I only need a few reasons to believe so. Crohn's diagnosis are on the rise, and what a coincidence so are the amount of fast food chains we see, the increasing number of additives companies are filling their products with to reduce cost and increase profit. This stuff isn't real food.



There's actually 2 different types of diabetes.  Diabetes type 1 is genetic, while diabetes type 2 is often the result of poor diet, obesity and/or lack of sufficient physical activity, but not always.  

Fast food doesn't fit my definition of real food either, but neither does most pre-processed foods as well.  

All you really have to do is start reading the labels to see all the preservatives, sodium, sugar, chemical additives and high fructose corn syrup, along with the overall low vitamin content.  Most of them contain very little in the way of anything remotely resembling significant nutrition value.


----------



## KWalker

Yeah I'm aware of the two types of diabetes but diet definitely plays a role in type 2.  I didn't mean just say just fast food either, because a lot of the food you see on the shelf isn't much better.


----------



## Ya noy

KWalker said:


> Yeah I'm aware of the two types of diabetes but diet definitely plays a role in type 2.  I didn't mean just say just fast food either, because a lot of the food you see on the shelf isn't much better.


Just clarifying for anyone else reading this thread who might not realize the difference between the 2.  Diabetes type 1 runs in my family, but fortunately, neither I or any of my siblings seem to have gotten the gene.   Couple others in my family though actually have devices that feed insulin directly into their bodies intravenously on a continuous basis.  

I totally agree that Crohn's and many other disorders are very likely caused by all the food additives and chemicals.  Once you really start looking into it, it's pretty scary.


----------



## Stagepunk5

Just wanted to thank everyone involved in this post. I was diagnosed back in September and was put on a low res diet. I have not eaten any fresh fruit or veggies in months and it started taking a toll on me. I never would have thought I would ever crave veggies. But last week, I just couldn't take it anymore. I am sick of being tired, having absolutely no energy, not being able to focus, etc. I knew this was because of my crap diet. I discovered juicing through a documentary... Started doing some research and it landed me on this forum. I invested in a juicer and today, I packed my shopping cart full of organic veggies. It's going to be quite a ride (I'm also fructose intolerant) but I'm just so happy I have a way to get some veggies in my diet. Celebrated tonight with a recipe called "better than a salad" (dr told me i couldnt eat salads because of strictures) and it was delicious. Can't wait till I start feeling the effects from these wonderful plants. Thank you all for the info!


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## canuckscouter

WOW! I started juicing just over a week ago and I feel so much better. I have way more energy than a few weeks ago. I feel that I am sharper mentally (except first thing in the morning lol). My memory is definitely better, two weeks ago I had to write everything down or I would forget. Today, I am much better.

Before I started I thought maybe after a few months I might notice something different but I never expected such a dramatic difference. This week has been crazy busy both at work and in the evening but I still feel like I have energy at the end of the day. Two weeks ago I was bagged by the time I got home from work and I wasn't nearly as busy.

Thanks you for this post!


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## canuckscouter

I do feel a lot better and have way more energy. Additionally I just got my blood work done and my liver enzymes, which have been mildly elevated for a long time, are now well in the normal range. Interesting. I don't have anything to back it up but I have been told that beets and carrots might be helping.

I am concerned about getting too much though so now I guess I have to figure out how much is just right.


----------



## Manzyb

Gianni said:


> Time is a big issue for many. And it was a issue for me for a long time as-well. For when i know I am going to have a busy week what i do is on Sundays I will juice for the whole week and store the juice in jars and in the fridge. The nutrient loss will be minimal in air tight glass jars. So each day just open the fridge and grab a juice.
> 
> 
> 
> Gianni


So, say I would get glass mason canning Jars, and juiced everything and put them in there and sealed them up pretty good, the juice would still have plenty of nutrients throughout the week?  I'm just trying to get a good understanding! I'm a stay at home mom, so I do have time to make sure I do my juicing, but sometimes we are much busier than others.


----------



## Manzyb

By the way, this is all incredible information.  I've been really getting into the importance of plant based diets and I'm radically changing my families eating habits to a much cleaner diet.  I'm hoping this helps me, I'm feeling a bit hopeless.

I've been juicing for a couple of weeks now, and so far I love it!  I'm trying different things out and through trial and error have made some great juices   And most of them my 2 year old loves!


----------



## Gianni

> So, say I would get glass mason canning Jars, and juiced everything and put them in there and sealed them up pretty good, the juice would still have plenty of nutrients throughout the week? I'm just trying to get a good understanding! I'm a stay at home mom, so I do have time to make sure I do my juicing, but sometimes we are much busier than others.


That's correct. Some nutrients will be lost, but apparently it is supposed to me minimal and I still do feel amazing off juices that have been sitting a few days in the fridge. Just make sure the lid is on tight


----------



## Manzyb

Thanks!  Will do.  I made a juice today that was awesome.  Swiss chard, spinach, strawberry and blood orange


----------



## UnXmas

I know this thread is a bit old, but I've been reading to catch up while recovering from surgery earlier this week, and have a couple of questions for you, Gianni.



> Breakfast is typically a fresh juice, or If I don't have time, a piece of fruit like a kiwi, pear, or apple. The juice will be have more fruit in it than I would typically do because I feel like fruit in the morning can you get energized for the rest of the day. Maybe a carrot, sweet potato, orange, apple juice.
> 
> Lunch is typically a large salad that will almost always include an avocado and balsamic vinegar and olive oil.
> 
> Dinner is either another salad, or I will make a soup or I will experiment with a new recipe like a collard greens wrap, or spinach tortilla wrap. If I'm feeling real rewarding, I will have some vegan thai food.
> 
> You can look at my Juicing Recipes thread for more on what I juice.
> 
> I rarely take protein powder, although I do when I exercise a lot in a week. When I do it is hemp protein powder. Hemp is a complete protein and isn't dairy based like many of the protein out there. I believe if you are eating enough, you are getting enough protein, much like if you are breathing you are getting enough oxygen. I think society has become quite obsessed with protein.
> 
> The only vitamin I supplement is b-12 sublingual liquid vitamin. All the other vitamins I get from my food/juices.
> 
> I do take cold pressed flax seed oil supplement capsules as well to get my omega oils.


This question isn't really about juicing, but nutrition in general. I often have this problem when people give examples of their diet - I don't understand how you can survive on such low calorie food! Unless you are using huge amounts of olive oil, I don't see how it would be possible to gain enough calories. How much salad, soup and juice do you have to consume to maintain a healthy weight? 

I am extremely underweight and every meal leaves me feeling incredibly full, and that's even with eating a lot of high calorie food in order to get as much energy as possible without having to eat large volumes of food. My stomach doesn't empty properly, so I know I feel full much easier than other people, but I still seem to need so many more calories than you could be getting from this diet in order to keep my weight up.

Along similar lines:



> just like your housedog our body needs to use a large portion of our energy to fight off our disease and give it the best fighting shot. So by excluding the fiber from the vegetables and just drinking the juice you are essentially fasting but at the same time replenishing your body with an extreme concentrated dose of energy so that it can go into superman mode and take care of your body. This is precisely why I am a proponent of 10+day juice fasts.


There's not much energy in fruit, and even less in vegetables, so how is juice a concentrated dose of energy? Or are you referring to nutrients rather than energy?

I'm always looking for ways to get my weight up, so I'd be interested to know how you think juicing would fit into a weight-gaining diet. I do have smoothies sometimes as a way to get fruit which goes down easier than chewing through whole pieces of fruit. 

Also, I just wanted to comment on KWalkers post:



> Also, let's look at the number of people over 65 on the forum. I don't even think I could count 5. However, let's look at the number of young kids, or parents of young kids joining the forum. Why? because it's much faster and cheaper to eat like crap than it is to healthy.
> 
> Lastly, I'm sure I'm not the only person noticing the over representation of members from Western European countries on here. Again, weird. We have high numbers of crohns, we're also developed countries where our food companies focus on low production costs for high profits.


I think the population of this forum is probably determined as much by demographics of Internet users more generally than by the demographics of people with Crohn's. People over 65 are less likely to be posting online than young people, so if people over 65 did have Crohn's, they'd be less likely to be here than teenagers and young adults.

And since the forum is in English, it's going to primarily be people from countries where English is the first language who you'll find here. Someone from another country who doesn't speak English isn't going to post here even if they do have Crohn's, and nor is someone from places without much Internet access.

A lot of people on this forum do seem to be very interested in diet and try to eat healthily, so I'm not sure looking at the members of this forum suggests a link between poor diet and Crohn's.


----------



## monirob

I'm currently doing SCD and new to this juicing forum. SCD is working perfectly for me but after reading the beginning post and the science behind juicing I've been considering giving juicing a try. I don't know much about juicing though....except how to make it. My biggest question (and I know this might have already been covered but it's a lot to read lol) is how long would I have to juice to achieve results/cure? Also, do I juice for every meal or just some meals? Thanks for any help and advice anyone can give.


----------



## canuckscouter

Personally I juice once a day (most days), mostly the red head recipe, and felt far more energetic within a week.

Good luck and I hope you experience similar results.


----------



## Beach bum

Hello.
Talking about results - personally, I felt better as soon as I began juicing. By juicing every morning I had the energy to get through the day and I am sure it helped me cope with being anaemic.Since then I really miss it if I have a juice free day, it has become part of my life.

But to talk about cure is a bit different and I am sure Gianni would be the best to answer that.

As for how often you juice, I would think you will see the best/quickest results the more you do it. But try for at least once a day, I always have it for breakfast. 

When I do a juice only diet I find it is best to have four juices a day and three days is enough to see an improvement in my digestive health.

Good luck and happy juicing.


----------



## monirob

I think I will try juicing along with SCD. I'll take all the help I can get towards a normal life. I'll start off with just one glass in the mornings. Any ideas for a cheap but good juicer?


----------



## Gianni

> This question isn't really about juicing, but nutrition in general. I often have this problem when people give examples of their diet - I don't understand how you can survive on such low calorie food! Unless you are using huge amounts of olive oil, I don't see how it would be possible to gain enough calories. How much salad, soup and juice do you have to consume to maintain a healthy weight?


Well I am no longer vegan and do include fish and eggs in my diet now. While I was vegan, however getting enough calories was quite a task at the beginning but I simply defeated that by eating a lot. When I didn't have a meal I was almost always snacking on something like fruit, nuts, raisins, avocados etc. It actually still resonates with me today, now that i did that for so long I tend to always need to keep my hand and mouth busy, so I always make sure I have plenty of avocados lying around . 

All of my salads included one whole avocado and many of them also included nuts, whether they be almonds, walnuts, cashews etc etc. Avocados can hold up to 330 calories while nuts hold a healthy punch of calories as well. I was underweight in the beginning and it took me awhile before I started to gain some weight. I believe that if you give your body enough fat, calories, nutrition and you aren't gaining weight then your body has more important things on its mind at the moment and doesn't want to hold on to the extra calories and fat. As soon as i started feeling better gut wise, I started to gain weight even though my diet had stayed consistently the same. 

Also including foods like squash, bananas and carrots will give you some full healthy calories. 



> There's not much energy in fruit, and even less in vegetables, so how is juice a concentrated dose of energy? Or are you referring to nutrients rather than energy?
> 
> I'm always looking for ways to get my weight up, so I'd be interested to know how you think juicing would fit into a weight-gaining diet. I do have smoothies sometimes as a way to get fruit which goes down easier than chewing through whole pieces of fruit.


In the case of complex carbs you would be correct. But again these juices aren't just single or double doses of fruits or veggies. These are often 7+ doses of fruits and vegetables concentrated into a small amount. So you aren't eating just an apple or just a head of broccoli but rather a massive dose of many fruits and veggies. 

And yes I was using energy there as a reference to what a tired body would need and that would be essential nutrients for your immune system. 

But the greatest thing here is the lack of digestion required to assimilate these nutrients that are already in liquid form. While a full solid food meal might hold more complex carbs, energy is wasted digesting the food to get the complex carbs and nutrients. So if you instead give the body liquid nutrients and liquid carbs you are gaining more of a net profit of energy as the body does not have to break down the food much as the juicer has already done that for you. 

I'm sure you have experienced a food coma after eating a large meal. Well you don't get tired just because, you get tired because the body is sending blood to your digestive organs and expending energy to digest the food which means less energy going towards other systems of the body like maybe the immune system and the many functions of it. Instead drink a juice and your body continues the immune functions, has a huge dose of nutrients and energy that will all be absorbed at minimal loss and you are not groggy or tired  a win win. 

Gianni


----------



## Gianni

> I think I will try juicing along with SCD. I'll take all the help I can get towards a normal life. I'll start off with just one glass in the mornings. Any ideas for a cheap but good juicer?


the omega juice brand is a favorite of mine. It has a lot of different price ranges and people seem to be really happy with their purchases.


----------



## Gianni

> My biggest question (and I know this might have already been covered but it's a lot to read lol) is how long would I have to juice to achieve results/cure? Also, do I juice for every meal or just some meals? Thanks for any help and advice anyone can give.


Beach Bum answered this well. Only thing I will add is my personal experience with it. I think its safe to say you should be juicing for well over a year if you want to give it an honest shot. I will personally be juicing for the rest of my life but I don't imagine myself juicing every day 5 years from now, I just think its a healthy habit that I should never break. You should feel higher energy levels within the first week and then you might feel better after a few months of juicing, results vary so its hard to tell. 

All the best


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## acc929

I'm on a full-liquid (and *some* purées) diet until my surgery and got my juicer in the mail today. This is so great! I really don't miss food that much at this point (haven't *eaten* in weeks - weird how abstract a concept food can become!) but I was really missing that fresh feeling you get after a good, light salad. I'm really into eating well and fibre was never reaaally a problem, and the amount of milk and sugar I've been consuming to put weight on/not chew the past couple weeks had left me feeling like I needed something cleansing and fresh! Fruit juice was falling short. My TI is looking totally blocked on CT (my dad/md said he was surprised I could drink OJ) and so my parents were a bit *concerned* about my consuming anything having to do with leafy greens, but I insisted that this would just be the juice. Didn't bother my stomach one bit, virtually no cramps! Juiced a ton of spinach, blueberries, strawberries, ginger, and a pear as soon as I opened the thing and it felt SO good and clean . I am a convert and totally never would have thought to even order the juicer if I hadn't seen this forum a couple weeks ago. Juicing is the best!


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## xX_LittleMissValentine_Xx

Hi, I have some questions! (I'm sure they have already been answered before - sorry!)
So I'm starting to think about juicing. Mainly because I just want to be doing all I can to stay as healthy as possible. I really like the idea of all the goodness of fruits and veg without the fibre. 
I have been making smoothies recently which I enjoy (I know its not the same thing) so I guess thats why I have been thinking about stepping it up.
Here are my questions/reservations.

How expensive are juicers and how big are they?
The reason I ask is because I live with my parents atm, we have a small kitchen, not really any spare cupboard or surface space (I have already had to put my coffee machine in the office). I'm not sure if we physically have enough space for another cooking utensil! I'm not going to be able to move out for a couple of years though... don't want to have to wait.

Are they easy to clean? 
I'll be honest I'm messy and lazy! Atm I put the blender in soak and leave it for my mum to clean up and I don't really want to be doing that!

Are they quick? Would you be able to do it before work, or do they store? Could you do it the night before and take it to work with you?

How much of an ingredient makes how much juice? Is it financially viable or do you need like 30 carrots for one glass?  

lol at all my very practical questions! Thanks


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## scottsma

I bought mine at Argos,it was about £100 BUT you can get them a LOT cheaper at Argos and also on line.Have a google.Mine comes into 5 parts.As soon as I have juiced and BEFORE I drink up,I scrape all the fibre left in the machine,into a carrier bag,rinse the parts under the tap and leave them to drain.Next day they get a hot soapy wash.You soon get used to the faff and it is worth it.Today,I had 4 carrots,2 celery sticks,1 sweet pot.,1 apple and 1 pear and got 2 good glasses full of juice.I don't get as much juice from greens but there's loads of nutrition.I usually drink mine immediately,as it's full of goodness when first juiced.Not sure how much the ingrediants cost as it goes in with the weekly shop,but I would average about £10 depending on what I fancy.Have a look on Ebay or Gumtree for a used juicer.There'll be hundreds lying around that have only been used once or twice.Hope I've helped.Please give it a go,you won't regret it.

  PS. It takes about 10 mins all together,so you could get up a bit earlier or do it in the evening.


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## scottsma

I have only been juicing for about 10 mnths and am not very good at the scientific aspects of it,I only know that it's exceptionally good for me and it tastes good.Gianni is our juice Guru and he is a wealth of information an support,so look for him on the members list or look at the other juicing threads on the forum.Best Wishes and I hope your son enjoys your efforts.


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## Jazmom

sorry, i must have posted incorrectly


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## Jazmom

Hi,

So glad i found this posting!
I have a 13 year old son who recently was diagnosed with crohns.  He was put on Iron supplements as he was anemic.  after 6 weeks, there has been no improvement in his anemia.  I was told during clinicals that his diet did not need to change, that he could eat whatever he wanted.  My son was, of course, thrilled with that statement.  I had to pick my jaw up off the ground before i could respond. When I questioned the dietician  about absorption issues, she responded that that was only a concern if there were absorption issues....duh...I was under the impression that crohns, particuarily in a beginning flare were rife with absorption issues. So, now, after weekly blood tests we are seeing that his body is not taking in the needed nutrients or maybe there needs to be another/also way of introduction for needed nutrient.  My son is taking his medication and supplements.  He has been less thrilled with the new restrictions I have implemented.  NO soda, NO fast food.  We were never big consumers of this fare, but i recognize the need for foods that will not add to his inflammation.   We have a Breville juicer. My husband and i enjoy
juicing fasts every so often, and the kids have been given juice to try, they have not however been inclined to do more than the occasional glass. When i asked about enteral nutrition therapy the dietician stated that it was difficult for kids long term, and suggested i use protein shakes or Boost or Ensure for added calories.  Do you have any suggestions for maybe a morning juice.  I tend to agree with your idea about the immune system needing help, rather than being squashed. 

Thanks


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## UnXmas

Gianni said:


> Well I am no longer vegan and do include fish and eggs in my diet now. While I was vegan, however getting enough calories was quite a task at the beginning but I simply defeated that by eating a lot. When I didn't have a meal I was almost always snacking on something like fruit, nuts, raisins, avocados etc. It actually still resonates with me today, now that i did that for so long I tend to always need to keep my hand and mouth busy, so I always make sure I have plenty of avocados lying around .
> 
> All of my salads included one whole avocado and many of them also included nuts, whether they be almonds, walnuts, cashews etc etc. Avocados can hold up to 330 calories while nuts hold a healthy punch of calories as well. I was underweight in the beginning and it took me awhile before I started to gain some weight. I believe that if you give your body enough fat, calories, nutrition and you aren't gaining weight then your body has more important things on its mind at the moment and doesn't want to hold on to the extra calories and fat. As soon as i started feeling better gut wise, I started to gain weight even though my diet had stayed consistently the same.
> 
> Also including foods like squash, bananas and carrots will give you some full healthy calories.


Thanks for the reply. Maintaining your healthy weight on your diet seems much more feasible now I know you include nuts. I can't digest nuts very well, but do use peanut butter for its high calorie content (and because it tastes great too  ). Avocados are something I eat regularly also. I didn't think carrots would give you many calories though?

I'm not sure that my body isn't holding onto the calories in the way that you describe happened for yourself - my Crohn's is quite mild. I think it's just that I'm not eating enough. I have motility problems (gastroparesis), which isn't really something I can heal. Because I eat little and often it feels like I'm eating all the time, and because I feel so full it's hard for me to believe I'm not eating enough. But when I actually tried recording what I ate and calculated an approximate calorie intake for a few days, I was only getting around 1500 a day.


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## acc929

Hey UnXmas. That's too bad about the gastroparesis  I don't think I have it *legit* but the feeling of food not moving through very quickly and feeling a bit backed up is definitely something I get. It feels awful! What might help - I don't know if you're already doing this - is adding oil to anything you can add extra oil too (like not just for cooking things). Just one tablespoon of Extra-virgin Olive Oil has 120 calories, same goes for coconut oil and flaxseed oil, and both are beneficial to overall health and also supposed to be good for the digestive tract . The latter two are mild enough to add to a juice, for example, and olive oil is a good addition to soups/rice dishes/etc. Since I'm on liquids I find it's a really easy way to bump my calorie intake and manage to get over 2000/daily. Drinking your calories is bad for those who want to lose weight but key for those of us with digestive problems. I found when I was allowed low-res that eating solids actually *decreased* my calorie intake per day because I felt fuller. Maybe that will help a bit? High-cal fluids and oils!


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## bunnyceleste

Ill just add my two cents to that to say that hemp oil is fantastic in fresh juices! and very good for you too!


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## Luckystar715

Gianni said:


> I don't see the connection here. I understand that yes if you don't eat gluten it doesn't mean you are cured. But that's like saying if you stay away from crohn's aggravating foods that doesn't mean you are cured. Of course not. I am not suggesting you take a sideline seat and play defensive im saying get on the offensive and help the immune system, be pro active and fix the underlying problems, im saying don't tread lightly around the big bully im saying gather your information, gather your knowledge and face it head on.
> 
> It is changing the underlying issue though, what isn't changing the underlying issue is drugs. Drugs only treat symptoms. I get the feeling that you think diet also only treats symptoms, but food is amazingly powerful.
> 
> What do you think the underlying issue is? If it is genetic why didn't our whole lineage have it, did your parents have it? mine didn't.
> 
> In a society that keeps on popping up with all these condition we have to look at our systems of health in this country. What do we do drastically different that other countries aren't doing? Its our diet! if it looks like fire, and smells like fire it must be fire. By blaming genetics (and this is my opinion i want to stress that) you are essentially saying that if it looks like fire and smells like fire it must be a 20 ton whale. Or the smell of the fire is just being ignored.
> 
> You have to recognize the underline problem to figure out the underline solution. Genetics are so complicated and confusing and with such a confusing disease its natural for people to blame the most complicated source because "if it was that simple my doctor would have told me". "If you want something done in this world you have to do it yourself" it is so true.
> 
> Also if you can blame genetics it takes out the blame from you. When i was first diagnosed i said to myself "i was dealt bad hand" "there is nothing i can do about it" But that is non sense. Just how humans have created a stronger and stronger genome through evolution why can't we grow stronger.. why can't we take our own destiny in our hands just how primal humans did in the past.
> 
> Also I know you believe that it has something to do with genetics. Do you have a theory on how the genetics have caused the crohns? For example do you think we just genetically have a broken immune system or are you unsure, you just believe that it has something to do with genetics?
> 
> Sorry for the rant, i am fairly passionate about this stuff.
> 
> 
> 
> Oops yeah sorry about that i did mean nitrite. And yes of course, i have a source that actually does a study on peroxynitrite versus Vitamin C  (click that).
> 
> Hope that helped.
> 
> Gianni


I also dont want to take away from the juicing part of this post, but I feel the need to share information here as well. 

First, I agree that we all need to be proactive in changing our diet to help address our disease. I believe that diet is a contributing factor to either increasing inflammation in the GI tract or making it better. So I agree with you in that food and diet is a powerful treatment. However, I dont believe its a cure. I do believe there is a genetic component to this disease. And i want to share why I think this and you may just think I am a unique instance and thats fine. 

Like you, neither of my parents have Crohn's disease. BUT my fathers side of the family does have it. My Grandma's sister had Crohn's disease. And my dad's cousin (daughter of a different sister of grandma) also has Crohn's disease. And so do I. With that said, it would lead me to believe that Crohn's disease would be a recessive gene. This is also not to say that other members of my family dont have it, it may just not be diagnosed at this time. No one in my family spoke of Crohn's disease until I was really sick and the doctor asked which of my parents side of the family had it. For a long time, noone spoke up because I think they felt "responsible" for passing it on I guess and its not something that the symptoms people find to dicsuss at the dinner table. The doctor also said tha psoraisis was also related to crohns- i understand how autoimmune disease connect to each other- but my dad has psoraisis alone without any other autoimmune diseases at this time. So its food for thought. 

The other reason i disagree with saying juicing is a cure is because food isnt the only trigger to crohns, at least not for me. If i am understanding your thought process, and I very well could be misunderstanding, you are saying that food and juicing can be used to restore the immune system. I feel like if there are many triggers to crohns besides just food and diet that trigger the immune system to attack the digestive tract. In saying that, the way I interrupt that then would be that if I did juicing alone or changing my diet alone, I would be have a strong immune system and it wouldn't respond to any of my triggers and example being stress. I think my immune system may be stronger, but my immune system is still going to respond in a certain fashion because of the presence of triggers. That's where i believe the genetic component comes into play again. I hope this makes sense. Again, this is just my thoughts.  

I am curious if stress is a trigger for you? and if so, if juicing does in fact decrease your immune system from "getting mad" during times of stress? Or in other words, do you experience less symptoms while juicing in stressful situations? 

With all that said, I am intrigued by the juicing and will explore this in my diet. I am going to continue to do my research in this area and try some of your reipes. I also look forward to what you have to share in the future in regards to vitamin and mineral deficiencies.  

Thanks for sharing your knowledge thus far!


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## UnXmas

I think there are problems with saying food addresses the underlying cause better than medications. Some Crohn's meds, if I understand correctly, tackle the inflamation by affecting the immune system. They don't address a genetic cause, or any other cause), but I don't see how food would do that either.

Also,



> What do you think the underlying issue is? If it is genetic why didn't our whole lineage have it, did your parents have it? mine didn't.


This is incorrect - an illness does not have to affect every person you're related to in order to be genetic.

This concerns me too:



> Also if you can blame genetics it takes out the blame from you. When i was first diagnosed i said to myself "i was dealt bad hand" "there is nothing i can do about it" But that is non sense. Just how humans have created a stronger and stronger genome through evolution why can't we grow stronger.. why can't we take our own destiny in our hands just how primal humans did in the past.


Blaming people for a disease that is in no way their fault is an unfair way of thinking. A lot of people experiment with diet with no success. It doesn't mean they're unwilling to try to fight their disease, it means they are unable to. Even if people do not try to use diet to fight their disease, this is understandable too, as there is no accepted evidence that Crohn's can be improved with diet.

Crohn's is not a result of anything any of us knowingly did to ourselves, and there is no cure. A lot of people can improve their symptoms with meds, diets, and other lifestyle changes, etc. However, if someone doesn't want to try to find effective treatments for themselves, I don't think this should reflect negatively on them.

With so many things being claimed as beneficial to Crohn's, it could very easily become too confusing for someone to have to work out what to experiment with in order to feel better, especially if they've already tried some things already and been disappointed. Some may not be able to afford various treatments - whether mainstream, alternative or dietary. Some may have so many other demands on their time or energy that they can't devote much to researching treatments for themselves. This is why it's perfectly natural for many to largely rely on what their doctors tell them. 

At least mainstream doctors can give you an idea of how likely it is that a particular med will work and what the side effects may be, based on trials and research. With diet and other alternative treatments, there's often not much more than anecdotal evidence and hypothetical theories to go on. If a person enjoys researching diet and has good results, then it's absolutely worthwhile to use diet to their advantage. But those who don't try shouldn't be blamed for their level of health.


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## glory_h

I love this thread! Thank you Gianni for starting it and also the thread with recipes. I do have a question for you. 



> Firstly i want to point out that these high oxalate levels in these vegetables are only found in commercially grown produce, not in organic or local produce.


I had a kidney stone about two years ago and since then have been careful to avoid leafy greens. Recently I've started juicing more and really want to incorporate more greens. I do usually use a bit of organic spinach or kale, and chase it with a whole lot of water to help flush the oxalates. So far I haven't had any problems with stones, and I'm wondering if it might have to do with the fact that I juice organic. 

Do you have any link to support the statement above? I'd love to have some kind of reassurance that I can safely introduce more dark leafy greens, as they are excellent for my energy. 

Thanks in advance!


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## VintageCore

Questions:

1.  What is your opinion on juicing organic fruits and vegetables versus non organic?
2.  Do you try to stay away from vegetables potentially high in nitrates?
3.  Are there any books you recommend for someone just starting out?  A step by step for people who want to get started would be invaluable.  I think there is a lot of interest but many are overwhelmed as to where to start.
4.  Not all Crohnies are alike.  Not all fruit and veggies are a like.  I just wonder if juicing can be taken to a whole new level.  Can we make the approach much more scientific.  For example, if someone has a deficiency in magnesium and calcium, is there a recipe for them.  If someone has Small Intestine Bacterial Overgrowth, are there recipes for them.  If someone is constipated, is there a recipe for them.  If someone is on Prednisone, is there a recipe for them.  If someone is on Methotrexate which interferes with folate, is there a recipe for them.  And on and on.  Thoughts on that?


It is pretty obvious you did not read it all. Your first question really gave that away and confirmed you just want to debate and be a skeptic.  It is just advice for those who feel they are worth taking a shot at drinking pure vegetable juice - pure real food. 

Everything in moderation is a dangerous saying thrown around often. No, we should all be taking extreme measures and putting extreme measures to be the best creatures we can be. We have become a society who views health and vegetables as something in moderation because they take time, and do not give us that immediate high we get from fats and sugars. THIS WHOLE MINDSET NEEDS TO CHANGE.  


I also want to point out that this post started out by stating that this is just his personal belief gained on his own experience. I do not have Crohn's But my husband of 10 years does. When I met him, he was a mess &  on steroids. We were not even juicing in the beginning. When I met him I slowly got him to eat what I was eating an he saw that he was starting to feel better. It was tricky, We were just eating a partial vegan diet. Whole foods. He was SO brainwashed by the doctors that he had to eat Meat, Potatoes, Over cooked vegetables, carbs, roots, and COULD NOT HAVE NUTS OR SEEDS.


It took a long time to convince and educate him. 

To me, this dietary advice just sounded like an unnatural fabricated USDA diet designed for masses of consumers, overcooked soft broccoli, soft cooked carrots??

 I believe it is just easier for doctors to just to point out a few key points and put you on medicine. Most doctors do not have the time and energy to sit down and take a full inventory of what we consume, and I am sure they just assume that most sick people are set in their ways and routinely eating a poor typical American diet. I mean really, How is a doctor or even a dietician going to truly enforce a diet or even begin to explain about pesticides, processed foods, corn syrup, gluten, corn fillers, meat fillers, the atrocities of industrialized farming, the dangers of all of these ingredients we cannot even pronounce, food absent of nutrition,  etc etc.. 

But, when was the last time you heard a doctor tell a person to stop eating vegetables and fruit and just eat all processed foods and meats? 



  So when they give people advice like, " do not eat any vegetables stay away from fiber... take this pill" It is a nice way of saying, " There is no way I am going to get the Average American to accept that they should be eating 80 percent vegetables in their diet to get the optimal performance from their amazing bodies. 

Through the years, my husband who is now 50 has NOT been on steroids, and spent most of the last 10 years since we got married in remission. We had ONE VERY SCARY bout 4 years ago. IT WAS SO OBVIOUS TO ME WHAT WAS MAKING THIS MAN SICK, as I am the one cooking and he is the one making these crazy demands. He insisted for a long time that MEN NEED MEAT. He was eating chicken, fish, and animal products often, cheating and eating processed food. When he is not eating a real food diet, and cheating his body lets him know. He has also recently suffered from a fissure. This is when I really started to enforce his diet faithfully. Not letting him leave without a healthy lunch, so he is not forced to make unhealthy choices when he is out on the road working. I juice for him every day, and pack a healthy lunch. NO MEAT PRODUCTS! Good wholesome whole foods. At 50, he is starting look better than ever. 

I think a lot of the foods the last few generations have been eating as a result of the industrial revolution, mass production and advertisement. We are being influenced to think that there is absolutely nothing wrong to eat what everyone else is eating. In America, we are descendants of people who came from all sorts of regions. I have my own theory that my husbands ancestors from Italy would have eaten quite differently than his mother cooked and the diet he picked up on his own as an adult. I would imagine they would have eaten a diet that resembled a cornucopia of garden favorites. Colorful and rich in nutrients. 

I forgot to mention I read this book years ago, Dr. Heal thyself. The man who wrote this book has a very similar story with Crohn's. Despite the amazing story and before and after photos. My husband has been a very hard sell. He spent 9 years prior to meeting me being conditioned to believe he was sick with this terminal disease, and the end result was a colostomy bag. 

We are living in times when the pharmaceutical companies have a greater vision, it is called a bottom line. Anyone who has ever worked in a hospital or drs office knows how much they invest in their sales reps. If their focus was to make the world a better place, and get everyone on the path to optimal health... Well there would not be such a high price tag on these medicines. There would be more emphasis on our diets. More regulations on the food industry. BETTER LABELS. Etc. 

Juicing is something I wish I would have done MUCH SOONER. For BOTH OF US. I look and feel a million times better, it has only enhanced my vegan lifestyle. It also ensures I am getting the nutrients I need. My husband is glowing, mentally he struggles. He is 50 and he has been generally conditioned his whole life to trust the "smart" educated doctors. 

More and more people are juicing. More and more people are beating this unnatural phenomenon we call the American Health Crisis. Through technology and education people are becoming more enlightened and educated. 

I just find it mind boggling that people would even become skeptical when it comes to something as valuable as juicing. However, these are the same people feel that handing a CHILD a colorful box with the word JUICE on is equal to a serving of actual real fruit. We have been duped into this whole sick belief system built by consumerism. therefore, I believe that Crohn's and the many other autoimmune diseases are just a manifestation of misinformation of the masses. 

Just look at what the USDA has concocted as the "recommended" diet. The data proves that the vitamins, minerals, phytonutrients, antioxidants, etc.. are the key to fighting and preventing diseases. Yet we still allow the greedy money hungry corporations dominate the misinformation. (just google the meat industry's fight against lowering the recommended serving of meat just to protect their greedy industry and mass slaughtering and torture of animals)

What does one who is already sick and suffering have to lose by trying an alternative treatment?? If it does not pan out..  The doctors will always be there if you want to go back on meds. This is veggies and fruit people, the basic stuff nature put here for us... THIS IS NOTHING TO BE A SKEPTIC ABOUT! THIS IS A NO BRAINER, anyone healthy or sick should be simplifying 
and going back to the basics. Veering from this is what got us here in the first place.  I say try it. I have seen nothing but good results in my husband.


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## ccec213

Hi friends,
I'm a longtime Crohn's sufferer and Crohnsforum lurker--decided to throw in my own two-bit theory.

I'm in a very similar boat to UnXMas--scarily thin, but not absorbing much of anything. I'd been trying a Paleo-style/SCD-style diet for awhile, but kept crashing and burning with "cheats." But I digress.

For a sort of gut rest/rebuilding, even for the rickety among us, what about something like this? I'm trying to think "gut rest" without adding to the starvation.

Several juices + bone broths only
several juices + bone broths + pemmican (a mixture of grassfed beef tallow and grassfed beef meat--look it up! US Wellness has a good kind you can buy)
Several day juice fast only, then baby-step in well cooked meats?

I believe protein is important to a healing body, so I want to make sure I'm getting it.

Then again...if I'm eating constantly but absorbing basically 0, maybe being on a very-low-calorie diet _that is easily assimilated_ would be an improvement.

Helped? Or did I muddy the issue?

Thanks for this wonderful resource, everyone!
Caitlin


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## UnXmas

> What does one who is already sick and suffering have to lose by trying an alternative treatment?? If it does not pan out.. The doctors will always be there if you want to go back on meds. This is veggies and fruit people, the basic stuff nature put here for us... THIS IS NOTHING TO BE A SKEPTIC ABOUT! THIS IS A NO BRAINER, anyone healthy or sick should be simplifying
> and going back to the basics. Veering from this is what got us here in the first place. I say try it. I have seen nothing but good results in my husband.


Actually, I lost a lot by trying alternative treatments, and not just money. As a teenager, I found it extremely confusing when I was trying alternative treatments and adjusting my diet, as all these alternative practitioners were telling me they would make me feel better, but I didn't get better. I got worse. I got terrified of eating anything, because everything I'd read, every practitioner I saw, told me of more and more foods that were bad, that I had to give up.

My health only got worse, and I felt like a failure. The copious literature I read told me I could take control of my health and beat my illness. But I couldn't.

It upset my family and friends - I couldn't join in social meals anymore. I had to read the ingredients on everything I ate, buy separate food from everyone else, be neurotic about what I could and couldn't have. I couldn't be spontaneous any more, I couldn't relax and have fun, because I had to plan everything round shopping and meals. And I couldn't relax just a bit and find a happy medium, because everything I read said I had to follow their various instructions precisely or it wouldn't work.

 There are so many conflicting views on how to beat disease and achieve health within alternative medicine. Why pick one way over another? I had enough of trying things that were suggested by alternative practitioners, I realised that anything based on anecdotal evidence and unfounded theories stood little chance of working. 

Conventional medications have done me so much good - they've done things that no healthy eating plan could ever achieve.

I'm not advocating giving up all fruit and veg and stuffing yourself with nothing but sugar and fat, I'm not advocating conventional medication as always being the answer to everything, but I do think the most effective approach to diet is everything in moderation. Treating an illness and managing to live as well as possible with a chronic disease can not be achieved if you think of your state of health as entirely within your control, as you will end up blaming yourself when things get bad. Focusing on diet and healthy living so much that it is prioritised above other really important things in life should only be done if it is certain to work - which in the case of diet and Crohn's, it isn't.

Perhaps some people manage their symptoms through alternative diets and treatments without it encroaching on their life too much, but I found it dominating my thoughts and time, and I think much of the alternative diets can encourage people to adopt quite extreme measures, so those of us inclined to be obsessive like me run into problems. 

I'm not sceptical for any other reason than the fact that I extensively tried this approach to medication and diet, and all it did was make me sicker.

Edit: Sorry for taking this thread off topic. I do think juicing is a healthy thing to do, but I also think it's not going to improve everyone's Crohn's symptoms, and people shouldn't be made to think that they're neglecting an opportunity to heal themselves if they're not treating their illness by following a particular diet or other alternative therapy, or are not juicing.


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## Akki16

Gianni said:


> Well I am no longer vegan and do include fish and eggs in my diet now. While I was vegan, however getting enough calories was quite a task at the beginning but I simply defeated that by eating a lot. When I didn't have a meal I was almost always snacking on something like fruit, nuts, raisins, avocados etc. It actually still resonates with me today, now that i did that for so long I tend to always need to keep my hand and mouth busy, so I always make sure I have plenty of avocados lying around .
> 
> All of my salads included one whole avocado and many of them also included nuts, whether they be almonds, walnuts, cashews etc etc. Avocados can hold up to 330 calories while nuts hold a healthy punch of calories as well. I was underweight in the beginning and it took me awhile before I started to gain some weight. I believe that if you give your body enough fat, calories, nutrition and you aren't gaining weight then your body has more important things on its mind at the moment and doesn't want to hold on to the extra calories and fat. As soon as i started feeling better gut wise, I started to gain weight even though my diet had stayed consistently the same.
> 
> Also including foods like squash, bananas and carrots will give you some full healthy calories.
> 
> 
> 
> In the case of complex carbs you would be correct. But again these juices aren't just single or double doses of fruits or veggies. These are often 7+ doses of fruits and vegetables concentrated into a small amount. So you aren't eating just an apple or just a head of broccoli but rather a massive dose of many fruits and veggies.
> 
> And yes I was using energy there as a reference to what a tired body would need and that would be essential nutrients for your immune system.
> 
> But the greatest thing here is the lack of digestion required to assimilate these nutrients that are already in liquid form. While a full solid food meal might hold more complex carbs, energy is wasted digesting the food to get the complex carbs and nutrients. So if you instead give the body liquid nutrients and liquid carbs you are gaining more of a net profit of energy as the body does not have to break down the food much as the juicer has already done that for you.
> 
> I'm sure you have experienced a food coma after eating a large meal. Well you don't get tired just because, you get tired because the body is sending blood to your digestive organs and expending energy to digest the food which means less energy going towards other systems of the body like maybe the immune system and the many functions of it. Instead drink a juice and your body continues the immune functions, has a huge dose of nutrients and energy that will all be absorbed at minimal loss and you are not groggy or tired  a win win.
> 
> Gianni


Gianni, I was hoping to get some clarity on how you began your diet initially? I've started juicing a little, and am trying to do a little soup, but it's not going to well. I'm pretty sure it's the boost plus though, with all the sugar that causes my issues. S I am going to take that out.

I'm having great difficulty with fruit. Any fruit, especially lemon. It's especially bad when I do drink the boost. I'm wondering did you start juicing with fruits and veggies right off the bat? And how we're your other meals composed? Did you start with only juices and then add in other foods?

Anyone else please feel free to chime in.


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## canuckscouter

Lemons, oranges and strawberries all still cause me problems and I'm doing freely well these days. I juice apples and pears with my veggies and that seems to be ok.

I also read somewhere that citrus fruits, oranges in particular, are a common cause of problems for people with BID. 

I never did do a full elimination diet but I did simplify my diet a lot. Through this I have found some pretty reasonable stability. Turns out milk was my biggest killer.


Sent from my Android


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## cleuger

Is anyone familiar with The Bella 1000 watt juicer? I'm looking at a new one on Ebay. Anyone have this model? if so is it a good juicer?



TIA


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## Victoria816

Great post. Thank you for sharing!


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## raj

Just a quick tip for people thinking of juicing. A good juicer costs a fair bit of money. I bought a relatively cheap one first to make sure I would use it and to see if I liked it first before investing in a better one. I use an omega vrt350hd and it's fantastic but it did cost a fair bit. If you don't like the juicing it would be a shame to waste the money. Try it first. Use mine every day. Couldn't get by without it now. Good luck


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## canuckscouter

I also used a cheep one at first but then I bought an omega 8006 which I like very much.


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## raj

Glad to hear it. My sister uses that one I think. She loves it.


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## Victoria816

I bought the Breyville Ikon. Seem to work great, but I need some recipes. Note to self... Don't try and do to much healthy greens at once. Bluck!


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## raj

Yeah. Too much greens at once can be hard to handle. Try and keep the juice simple is my advice. Four or less ingredients seems to work for me. I use a lot of carrots, kale, broccoli, apples and pears to sweeten and beets as well. Just experiment and see what you like.


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## maria

Okay so 7 yrs ago I sound just like you... I never had any bowel issues and my diet sucke before that then about a yr later after faithfully juicing during this time I lost energy,started bleeding on a daily baisis,pain was horrible. Then diagnosed with colitis. I was shocked! So I still felt passionate about juicing so I read that whatever you put on your skin absorbes a lot faster though your blood stream then if you were to digest it. So I juiced carrot,onion,melon,swiss,spinich,sometimes beet(cuz it stained my tub) ,cucumber, then I would lay in the bath and rub it all over me and let it sit within ten minutes I felt myself sweating and I felt this natural euphoric feeling. I loved it!then I woulrd fill the tub with hot water to let it really sink in and got better effects then after I would sweat out all the toxins and alway evey time id this I know the next day I would feel amazing so that's how I got my nutrients from juicing. I always felt better up until I got pregnant and got way to lazy and weak to do the juicing and my colitis would just go crazy. Also my goal was to reverse the aging process like the apple turrns brown that same thing that turns it brown is what kills the aging process I forgot the name but my goal was to look ten yrs younger at the age of forty and I m 32 and I can say well by what people tell me constantly I look ten yrs younger I they are shocked I have 4 kids.  What's helped me was that juicing, cellfood, manuka honey. I'm sorry if my words don't come out right my cell won't let me look at what I'm typing so I'm just going along and hoping for the best                   I always wondered why my body reacts horribly when I eat or dring any sort of veggie or any healthy food but feel fine when I eat horrible foods but feeding the juice through my skin makes me feel like a million bucks?????     craa


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## maria

cleuger said:


> Is anyone familiar with The Bella 1000 watt juicer? I'm looking at a new one on Ebay. Anyone have this model? if so is it a good juicer?
> 
> 
> 
> TIA


Currently I have this one. I like it a lot so far. The one I had before this was a jack lalane juicer and before that was a really cheap one I don't know the brand I forgot I bought twice cuz it broke within a few months and can say I'm liking this bella so much more than any other juicer I've had. I do want to point out the jack lalane lasted me a long time.


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## canders33

Thanks for that Gianni, very helpful. Also, I've gotta say my diagnosis experience went about the exact same as yours did. Anyways I just had a quick question for you. Actually two of them. First, were you or are you a cigarette smoker? And when your doctor asked you about Humira did you go on it or deny it? Look forward to reading a reply from you. Thanks again!


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## Gianni

hey Canders, Sorry for the delayed response. I am nor have I ever been a cigarette smoker, never really interested me in the past and for obvious reasons I stay clear from it now. I was originally recommended Remicade and I did accept that treatment although, it became clear after a few months that it was not working at all. Humira on the other hand did work very well for me after my doctor recommended it but I had some pretty awful side effects after just a year on it. I had pneumonia 3 times! While it made my gut feel better, it made the rest of me feel awful so that is why i delved into nutrition at which point i abandoned the humira and focused on food. 

Gianni


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## TwinkleToes

Hey Gianni - 

I just started juicing after I read this: http://www.mercurynews.com/healthy-...ioch-woman-crohns-disease-eats-her-way-health

I have been lucky to not have any resections or major surgeries regarding my Crohn's.  However, after a weekend in the hospital a week ago - I realized I need to take charge of my life.  I have to be realistic in that I know I can't juice all day every day, but i'm drinking Evolution Fresh juices as they are the same thing.  I'm currently on Pentasa, Humira, Prednisone, and a handful of other meds.  I also take vitamins and probiotics.  I have a scope in April and I want to bad to get off these stupid medications.  

Thanks for giving me some hope


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## Cinzia

I have diverticulitis, and have had two serious flare ups, each one being admitted to  hospital.  I have had abscesses, micro perforations with unresponsive bacteria, spilled into my gut.  Can juicing be helpful to me?  My Dr wants to schedule a colon resection in a few weeks, and remove about 12 inches.  I am so worried about this.  I had no previous problems until a year ago, when it all started.  I have lost a lot of weight since then, and can only eat certain foods to avoid a flare up. 
I have never smoked or drank alcohol.  I eat healthy, and have always avoided junk food. I am also very active, so this is a mystery, why this happened to me.
I would like to explore the idea that juicing can help or even cure these pockets, lining my colon, but I am fearful it will set off another attack. Once it starts, it takes a while to get it calmed down, and like you said, the meds are becoming less and less effective.


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## Coach Mulan

Hi Cinzia,
Hope you will get better! Nutrition is a key I. Getting better. A green juice in the morning can change your day! Adding turmeric for a cooked white rice can also help (it helped me) ginger in your tea (but not too much), cutting sugar and gluten can keep you in remission. I have to say I have been on Humira for a few weeks and before that just dieting like I mentioned and I feel very good. I get some headaches and dizziness but most of the time I'm doing great. When you flare it's no fun but remember its not forever... The sun will shine! Soon! Wishing you all lots of good health and hope you can find the gift in it....


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## Cinzia

Hi Coach Mulan

Thanks for the advice.  I never had a gluten problem before, but since my first flare up, I stopped all gluten, because I noticed it seemed to trigger it.  I also had to give up coffee, sugar, and dairy among other foods.  Those foods never bothered me in the past, but seem to be a problem now.  I know Diverticulitis is different from Crohn's, but they do have some similarities.  My surgeon told me there is a piece of large intestine that is hard, and not working, and has to be removed.  It could as little as 3 inches, or as much as 12. If juicing could help me not have surgery, that would be great.  I have tried many remedies but nothing seems to stop the flare ups from coming.  I'm not on any meds on a continuous  basis, but I do take Flagyl, once the pain starts.  Side effects are horrible. 
Happy to hear you are feeling better, and the meds are working.


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## Coach Mulan

Hi  just came across this and thought why not share this?

Seems like this woman knows what she's doing.... 

Feel well!!!!! 
Mulan


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## farrelljessica

Thank you for posting this! Very informational and something I would like to consider pursuing.


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## Dragonfly72

I just got a juicer for Christmas, is there a juice I can make for constipation?   

Thank you,

michele


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## MaryEllen

I do have a quick question regarding juicing.  I bought a juicer in the past but found it caused a huge mess and seemed too much of a hassle.  So I returned it and started using my silver bullet which is so much easier, smaller and less of a mess.  I was told however, I would not get the same benefits using the silver bullet.  Curious of your thoughts? Thank you!


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## Beach bum

Hello Dragonfly , welcome to the juicing club 
I have always found a juice with beetroot in to have a loosening effect on my tummy (sometimes desirably sometimes not) This could just be personal to me but it cant hurt you to try it.

Recipes and some of the things they help with can be found here.

http://www.crohnsforum.com/showthread.php?t=41839


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## LN3

i was diagnosed with crohn's disease oh.... 1988 when i was 10. after many years of hospitalizations and multiple medications i altogether stopped seeing my gi dr and have been controlling my illness for the last 15 years with my diet. whether it was laziness or jaded neglect, i've really eaten poorly in the last few years and have lost control of my remission. this week i decided to begin a juice fast. it was the best thing i could possibly do for myself right now, i needed the break from eating but not wanting to go on chemically nutritionally balanced formula like i have done in the past as treatment. in general, i would attribute my long period of good health to diet and excersise. i'm not sure if this juice fast will heal me in the long run but my method with flare ups has been to wait it out. any recommendations on good juicing books? i'm taking this recent flare up as a serious warning and getting back control of my health. incidentally, my two younger sisters both suffer from crohns. one is vegan mainly and juices, does not smoke and generally avoids alcohol. she has been healthy. the other- was treated mainly with painkillers that mask her disease, she smokes heavily and drinks, eats junk food and energy drinks. i've believed this to be a disease very managable through diet and lifestyle choices since i was just a kid. good luck all of you and good health in the new year, i'm glad i found this forum for support.


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## drewpalermo

If and when I do get a juicer (hopefully an Omega), I'll primarilly be juicing carrots with it.  I love the taste of carrot juice and would try to drink 10-12oz/ day.  Apparently carrots have one of the most bioavailable forms of calcium (most dairy today is pasteurized so a lot of the calcium isn't readily available), and it's a great detox for the liver.  Dr L Wilson turned me onto it- drlwilson.com/Articles/CARROT%20JUICE.HTM


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## SmellyMelly

Gianni said:


> You know I haven't read a juicing book. I figured a lot of stuff as i went along and researched online but there wasn't really one source that helped me get there.


I didn't really use a book either. But found these websites to be great:

http://www.juicemaster.com/recipes/

https://juicerecipes.com/health/

However most of it was through trial and error. Worst mistake I ever made (when I had flu) was juicing spring onions. Yuck.


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## SmellyMelly

More specifically:

https://juicerecipes.com/health/conditions/juicing-for-ulcerative-colitis/

I find carrot juice and kale juice work amazingly for IBD. Wheatgrass is pretty good too but not nearly as flavoursome :lol2:


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## Rrahman

Hi Gianni,
I'm new on the crohn's forum. I joined because I need support taking care of my daughter (diagnosed with Croh's on Dec. 2013), not knowing whether I am doing the right thing or not.  
My husband and I believe in the power of food:dance:.  We kept our daughter on SCD (following the diet closely from Nov. 2015) and I have been juicing (fruits and veggies) for her well over a year now. The only med she takes is Flagyl when she is having a flare.  Her GI wanted to put her on med right after her diagnosis but we managed to hold it off so far. We believe putting her on the right diet will heal her with time. I was reading the side effects of Remicade today and it scared me to death!  
Your post is really encouraging. Could you tell me which fruit/veggie is rich in magnesium?  
Thanks so much for sharing your views


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## DocK

Hi Gianni

This is a great post. I am interested in the use of garlic for its anti-inflammatory properties in IBD. I know you use ginger, what is your experience with garlic?


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## westernbuddy

Hard to know without seeing it in real life.

But maybe ethanol or ipa

It's basically pure alcohol and very common to use it for cleaning.

After all its the main ingredient in products such as hand gel and surface cleaners.


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