Dumb?? 'technical' question about EN equipment

Crohn's Disease Forum

Help Support Crohn's Disease Forum:

Tesscorm

Tesscorm

Moderator
Staff member
Joined
Jun 14, 2011
Messages
6,512
After all this time, I still have a question about EN equipment! :ywow:

We've always used 'bags' to hold the formula with the tube attached that runs through the pump. But, my recent supply of 'bags' are not bags; they are hard plastic bottles with openings at the top and bottom. You remove the cover at the bottom and attach the tube. So far, so good...

But, do I remove the top cover when I run the pump? With the bag, as the formula was pulled out, the bag deflated; but, with a hard plastic bottle, won't I get a flow error? At some point, the pump won't be able to pull out anymore formula as the 'inflexible' bottle won't accommodate the reduction of fluid without allowing air to go in. Am I making sense to anyone who has used these EN pumps, etc.?

Not the end of the world if we can't finish the formula tonight but... would rather not miss a night if we don't have to...

:)
 
It should run just fine. They should be vented even if you can't tell by looking.

If it doesn't work you should know pretty quickly.

Do you have any paperwork that came with the bottles? Might answer your question if you're still hesitant.

I wouldn't open the bottle. It's sterile and you want to keep it that way since the NG tube is going into his body, bypassing the usual mechanisms the body has to keep bad things like germs out.
 
Probably too late now Tess! :eek2:

How did things go?

I too would have though that being a closed system you would leave the top cover on. I have no experience with EN systems but with IV's there are two systems that operate when using glass/rigid containers to overcome the vacuum. Some have infusions sets that have a filter built into the spike and air enters that way while the others products have a filtered tube built into the rubber stopper of the container that will allow air to enter when the disc that covers the stopper is removed.

Dusty. :)
 
Thanks Patricia, Dusty :)

It did work last night... not sure how but, as you mentioned, there must be some venting system in place???

But, another silly question (these seem so inconsequential but I'm really not sure what to do :lol:)

With the bags, I would reuse the bags for approx. 3 weeks. To clean them, I would fill the bag with soapy water and then squeeze/push the soapy water through the tube, filling the chamber, etc. and then I would rinse with clean water and again push through the clean water to rinse chamber and tube.

But, now (tried this morning), I can't squeeze the bottle to push through soapy or clean water through to clean the tube/chamber. Disconnected the tube from the bottle, thought I could clean it separately, but the opening at the top of the tube is tiny (smaller than the opening of a syringe (without the needle part)), so I can't even push through water using the syringe! How am I supposed to clean it?

The formula is only supposed to be at room temperature for 8 hours, so I'm thinking that the droplets left inside the tube/chamber can't be good if they sit there and I reuse that same tube for weeks.

Am I making too big a deal about this? Are the droplets left in the tube/chamber too small to be significant?

(Unfortunately, our home nurse is away until mid-August so I've got to figure something out... :))
 
Hi Tess!

I don't have any answers to your questions but I'm curious why you switched to the bottles? Could you run it through your dishwasher?

I've gotten really spoiled as my insurance company pays for me to use a new bag and ng tube for each feed. If you ever need any, I'd be happy to send you some. I have extra since we our down to 5 feeds a week :)
 
It's been 5 years since we did EN but at that time we were told never to re-use bags due to risk of contamination and the doc ordered enough for us to have a new bag daily.

So I can't answer that. I suspect that you are not going to be able to re-use the bottles. Maybe you can call the medical supply company that provides them?
 
Hi Shelley - the bottles just came with my last shipment. I called the nurse, thinking they had shipped the wrong order but she told me 'sometimes they have bags in stock, sometimes bottles' and said that I was to use them the same way. I hadn't had the need to start using the bottles until last night...

Cleaning the bottle is easy (actually easier than the bags), it's just the tube???

I will call the company and ask... in the meantime, I do have a few on hand (but thanks for your offer Shelley!:))


Hmmm, wonder why we've been told to reuse though!! :ymad:
 
I had actually thought about that, Angie, but thought there MUST be an easier way! :) I'll be running up and down between the kitchen (soap, formula, etc.) and Stephen's bedroom (pump, stand, etc.)! And timing it so I can get it going before going out (soccer, gym, whatever) and then getting home to make formula, etc. I already feel like my life is 'scheduled and organized' to the minute!!! Obviously, I'll do it if I have to but, it's tiring me out just thinking I've got to keep 'one more little job scheduled and in my mind'. Ugghh!

But, in case I need to go this route :lol:... did you have a 'cleaning solution' that you didn't need to rinse out? I've used soap and hot water and then rinsed the soapy water. I'd have to run the pump twice???

(Honestly, on one level, this is making me laugh and feel silly... OMG, how can cleaning a tube involve such a long conversation and so many questions!?!? :rof:)
 
I also ran the cleaning solution (just soapy water) through the tube using the pump. When I was pressed for time I would just do a quick rinse with water and do the big clean later in the day. Never had a problem. Could you clean it at the bathroom sink to avoid having to lug the stand and pump around?

I would use the priming setting to pump the water through fast.
 
Yes... actually, I can just disconnect the pump from the stand and move it to the bathroom or kitchen, that would be easier...

Definitely need to ask if I can just be supplied with a new 'tube' for each day!!

Thanks guys!!! :D
 
I am trying really hard to envisage this Tess. :lol:

It sounds like what Angie and Twiggy have done is the best solution and as Twiggy has said put it on the prime setting.

As to the solution...if you moved away from soap and water for any reason then those used to sterilise baby bottles, teats and so on generally do not need to be rinsed before use. The one that springs to mind here is Milton, not sure if you have that in Canada though.

Dusty. xxx
 
This is getting oh, so complicated, WTH! :rof: :rof: Haven't a clue what the 'prime' setting is and am not even going to ask! :lol: I'm sure there's some button on the pump that says 'P'.

I'll check at the pharmacy for the cleaning solution... haven't been down that aisle for a while! :blush:

Feeling like I need a glass of wine after all this! :ytongue:
 
Tesscorm check the Internet. I'm sure with all the junk on here:ybiggrin: you'll find a video demonstrating how to do it all.:thumright:
 
Ironic... Checked the supplies at home, they sent me 8 bottles and 3 tubes! :facepalm:
 
I'm definitely popping the cork! :lol: Of course, formula didn't work last night! The 'venting' system that worked the night before, didn't last night. The bottle is fairly inflexible but 'gave' a bit and was 'squeezed' - only about a 1/3 of the formula was pumped. Thank God the seal where the tube and bottle connect didn't leak!!! OMG, what a sticky, stinky mess that would have been!

Just an annoyance!!! Certainly worse things can happen and this can be resolved somehow... but just an unnecessary 'thing' to resolve! :ymad:

Oh well... we've got a long weekend starting here and good weather coming! Going to focus on THAT! :D
 
Isn't there a nurse who can come out in place of your regular nurse? Most companies have enough nurses on hand to cover their patients when the other nurses go on vacation. I would definately give the nursing company a call and go over things with them. They should be able to put your mind at ease. I am not comfortable with you re-using a bag for three weeks. Seems like despite your best efforts, bacteria can still grow. I'd request more tubing whith your next batch of bags. Remember, the squeaky wheel gets the oil. So be squeaky! Get what you need to make EN feeding safe for your child.

When my son was younger, he was on J-tube feeds then G-tube feeds. We were told to use a new bag and line every 24 hours. We were provided enough bags and tubing. Is there any way to only re-use the tubing? Can you seperate the tubing from the bottle, clean it and then re-use it? We were told to run a solution of water and vinegar through the tubing to disinfect it, next, rinse it with water only then, let it dry before using.

Keep us posted as to how this situation is going.

Blessings and prayers are with you and your family, Naturelover
 
Tess, You've been on my mind. Anything happening or improving on your end? Keep in touch.

Blessings and prayers coming your way, Glo
 
Tess, One more thing. There's no such thing as a dumb question. Only a question that is not asked. So please always feel free to ask away. Everyone is glad to help where they can.

Glo
 
Thanks Naturelover, Dusty,

We were up at a cottage (we have a long weekend here:)) and, luckily, Stephen just had his two 'off' nights :) so haven't had to deal with it until tonight :thumright:. Using a new bottle and tube tonight (from what everyone's said here, I'm not going to reuse his bag or bottle/tube for as long anymore - to be honest, I always wondered about the length of 'reuse' but I have been fanatical about washing! :lol: I figured out a way to put in my own 'venting' hole in the lid and will just do that for now, and am going to call the nurse's office on Tuesday (tomorrow's a holiday) to get a supply of new bags.

(And, you're right, Naturelover, I can call the nurse's office to request assistance.)

Thanks!!! :)
 
:hang: Tuesday is just around the corner. Let us know what you find out.

Hopefully they will give you a bag or bottle and new tubing for every 24 hours. Also, get some extras for back up. You should never be without extras (three days worth) for back up in case something goes wrong with the tubing, bottle, bag or delivery. Weather can impact delivery.

I had to use the implanted port dressing change kit that was supposed to be used for this Tuesday's huber needle and dressing change because there was a glove problem with one kit and another problem. Hopefully the nurse will have an extra kit or the company will get one sent out tomorrow eve by currier.
 

Similar threads

blobbyknobby
Invisible Disabilities...
Replies
1
Views
1K
ronroush7
ronroush7
TxNewsies
My Story
Replies
5
Views
1K
TxNewsies
TxNewsies
DustyKat
Enteral Nutrition/EEN Club
Replies
13
Views
8K
Tesscorm
Tesscorm
Mario Mariani
Help: I Have Crohn's Disease
Replies
2
Views
1K
Mario Mariani
Mario Mariani
D
A Father's Light Take on a Heavy Load
Replies
0
Views
65
dave seerman
D

Latest posts

Back
Top