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FECAL TRANSPLANTS: A Guide

Add us to the list of crohn's diagnosis after long term use of doxycycline used for acne but never worked.

Fecal transplant sounds so promising. I'm a donor-in-waiting!
 
Add us to the list of crohn's diagnosis after long term use of doxycycline used for acne but never worked.

Fecal transplant sounds so promising. I'm a donor-in-waiting!

you are correct, there is a link between doxycycline use for acne and development of crohn's. Another antibiotic that is linked is amoxicillin-clavulanic acid A.K.A. the brand name Augmentin.


American Journal of Gastroenterology August 2010.
http://www.nature.com/ajg/journal/vaop/ncurrent/abs/ajg2010303a.html
 
here it is again then.

Here is some preliminary news of results of the study for fecal transplants on crohn's patients at the Beth Israel Deaconess Medical Center in Boston, Massachusetts. the study isn't expected to be done until april 2014 though, but they say so far patients are seeing good results. more info below.


Fecal Transplant for Crohn's
Published 3:21 PM EST Nov 25, 2013




Text Size:AAA
There are lots of different types of transplants for lots of different medical conditions. One of the newest is called a fecal transplant, where the stool of a healthy individual is transferred to the intestines of a person with an intestinal disorder. This treatment has had proven success for clearing infections with Clostridium difficile, a powerful bacteria that is difficult to treat. The strategy is thought to revert the bacterial make-up of a person’s intestines to its normal state, with harmless bacteria displacing pathogenic ones.

A handful of doctors have tried the procedure in the clinic for various conditions such as Crohn’s disease and ulcerative colitis, and numerous patients have tried home remedies using samples from family members or close friends. However, fecal transplants are still considered an investigational, or research, treatment, and it is unproven in patients with Crohn’s or ulcerative colitis.

Dr. Alan Moss, an Associate Professor of Medicine at Harvard Medical School and Beth Israel Deaconess Medical Center, and his colleagues are currently conducting the first registered clinical trial that is testing the potential of fecal transplants in patients with Crohn’s disease. “Fecal transplants have certainly taken off in the last couple of years, and some doctors have anecdotally reported they’ve had success in treating Crohn’s disease this way. But we need clinical trial data to objectively test if it’s safe for these patients, and if it improves their condition,” he says. “There are a lot of unknowns in this field—whether fresh stool is better than frozen, which types of donors are associated with successful outcomes, which types of patients could respond etc.” This study is funded by a grant to the Harvard Institute of Translational Immunology from the Leona and Harry Helmsley Charitable Trust.

One of the patients in Dr. Moss’s trial, who wishes to remain anonymous, jumped at the chance to participate. “I’m against taking medicine since there can be many side effects, including unknown long term ones. I’ve been managing my disease with a very restrictive diet: unable to drink coffee or alcohol, eat salads, cheese, spicy foods, fried foods, chocolate, sugar, seeds, nuts...and these are just a few! The diet is so restrictive that it is difficult to maintain,” she says. “Once I was able to get over the gross details of the study, I became so intrigued by the process and excited about it.”

Pharmaceutical companies are also interested in fecal transplantation because if it’s successful, they might be able to isolate the active compounds in the therapy—such as important strains of bacteria or products of bacteria—that could be developed and commercialized. “Working with stool is cumbersome, to put it mildly,” says Dr. Moss. “So it might be easier to treat patients with only the key components of stool in a pre-packaged format.”

Dr. Moss notes that many people are trying fecal transplants at home with protocols they find online. “The most important thing to consider is the donor, who could carry unknown infections in their stool. A patient might feel safe with a donation from a spouse or other family member , but I really worry about people trusting strangers for untested donations outside of the clinical setting.” He even noted that some ads have been placed on Craigslist. “I certainly would discourage people from relying on home transplants using unscreened donor stool, because many viruses, bacteria, and parasites can be found in stool, ” he says. In clinical trials, donors undergo extensive health questionnaires and stool testing to reduce the risk of their stool harboring infections.

The patient in Dr. Moss’s trial is seeing good results so far. “I see this as a major breakthrough in medicine by treating patients naturally, and it makes perfect sense. I’ve been eating and drinking whatever I want, and the Crohn’s symptoms I typically would have at this time are either minimal or nonexistent—symptoms such as sharp pain in my colon, cramps, bleeding ulcers, lethargy, joint pain, and diarrhea.” She says she looks forward to the day when fecal transplants might be an affordable means of managing Crohn’s disease and perhaps other similar conditions.



Read more: http://www.wcvb.com/Sponsors/bethis...22711666/-/14x6d0o/-/index.html#ixzz2lm61SuX6
 
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I found another testimony on this website of how a Fecal Transplant put them into a remission that posted earlier this year.

Here is a link - http://www.crohnsforum.com/showthread.php?t=48939

and a quote from the post-

Last Fall I went to Sydney Australia on a vacation and while I was there I looked into their programs and research. I found FMT. Fecal Microbiota Transplantation. I was grossed out and said oh hell no. Still, the more I studied and read the more it seemed worth a try. So, I called my doctor here and asked if I could be in one of the clinical studies. Unfortunately there wasn't one here. Only in Portland Oregon. He happened to know the doctor running the study though and offered me another way to treat myself at home. My husbands stool was tested for HIV, Hep A B and C, C Diff, and he passed all the tests with flying colors. So, we bought a retention nozzle, enema bag, tons of Zip lock freezer bags, went through training with our nurses so he could help me complete the series of enemas and my flora was checked and measured by my doctor every other week 7 days after each treatment. I was really sore down there from all the surgeries so instead of 7 days of back to back enemas we changed it to once every other week for 2 months.
I felt it was my last hope and I wanted to try something because nothing else seemed to work and I just wanted to become a guinea pig if I could. 4 months after my (home treatment) I went in for a scope, except some scarring from the past issues I had no inflammation, no diarrhea, no pain, and had started to work out again. I have felt better this past year than I have since I was 26. I have my life back! I have not been on any meds for 6 mos and after my scope today I was told I was in complete remission. (They still don't know how long it may last or if it will.) Right now I feel normal, no pain, no D and I have energy again!
 
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I'm taking our daughter to Mayo next week. I'm hoping to get their opinion on fecal transplants and hoping that it's favorable. Our GI doctor isn't using this therapeutically, therefore, we haven't been able to talk to her much about it.
 
i added some info on how to make saline solution to perform a fecal transplant in the main post of this thread for anyone that may plan on doing a fecal transplant.

I will add more instructions as my own time permits, other wise you will still have to read though the linked documents in the main post to get more details, which do not contain any instructions on how to make saline solution.
 
Here is an amazing article about the powerful roles intestinal bacteria play in our health, and where the science is headed. This is why restoring healthy bacteria in IBD with a fecal transplant could cure the condition.

PSA is a molecule produced by the good bacteria bacteroides fragilis.

Now in his own lab at the California Institute of Technology, Mazmanian has learned that PSA induces the development of immune cells called regulatory T cells (Tregs), which tell the immune response when to turn off.3 Dysfunction in Tregs is associated with numerous inflammatory, autoimmune, and allergic disorders in humans, and Mazmanian and his colleagues have shown that feeding PSA to a mouse with inflammatory bowel disease or multiple sclerosis can treat and even cure the ailments.
http://www.the-scientist.com/?artic...81/title/Sarkis-Mazmanian--Microbe-Machinist/

here is another article about the same researcher and how autism may be caused by disruption on intestinal bacteria.
http://news.sciencemag.org/biology/2013/12/gut-microbes-linked-autismlike-symptoms-mice
 
My daughter and I are finishing her visit to Mayo tomorrow morning. Our conversation about fecal transplants with the pediatric GI didn't get very far. The doc said the problem with fecal transplants and crohn's patients is 1) getting it into the small intestine by way of anesthesia on a monthly basis and 2)defining the requirements of the donor. I shouldn't be surprised at this response.
 
Here is an interveiw with Doctor David Suskind who is studying Fecal transplants in Crohn's Disease @ Seattle Childrens Hospital.

http://kuow.org/post/seattle-children-s-studies-fecal-transplants-cure-bowel-disease


below is some information on his study from my original post of this thread-
Crohn’s disease and Ulcerative colitis
Seattle Children's Hospital
Seattle, Washington, United States, 98105
ClinicalTrials.gov Identifier: NCT01757964
Estimated Primary Completion Date: December 2014
 
Ng tube looks like the way to go
considering that there was a recent report that one dose of 150 milliliters of solution through nasogastric tube was enough to put a crohn's patient in complete remission, that Highly suggests Oral route either pill or NG tube is the way to go. Doing 30-60 enemas is a serious amount of work to put yourself through to achieve remission like some of the earlier studies have showed. And it would very hard to find a donor that could fit your schedule to meet up and donate 30-60 times, with out them having to quit there job so you could do a fecal transplant.

not to toot my own horn here, but this is what i have been saying in the beginning about my prediction that the oral route would be when we saw real results in crohn's disease. This is why i made the attempt to make a fecal transplant pill which is too much of a technical task for me to achieve at this moment in time.
 
Surely there's some sort of way we can petition for more trials. I'd sign it and share it, the more trials they do the more they're going to find that it is helping with people with crohns. Whats frustrating is it's already proven to have put people in remission, even if only 5 of 10 people go into remission that 5 should give enough reason to do more research (which I know they are doing), I guess I'm just impatient! I dream of the day when all of us are cured of ibd
 
And I'm just saying that I'm a donor in waiting and happy to contribute to research!

I eat well, have no IBD or any other health conditions. I'm 47 years old. I want my daughter cured!!!
 
Here is an article about a company that may be the first to provide the medical industry with a reliable source of frozen stool(a stool Bank) to help people get treated with a Fecal transplant. For starters, to treat people with C. difficile infection and after the research is completed, Fecal Transplants for IBD.

Article is courtesy of Tracy Mac (shes awesome BTW) from The Power of Poop Website.

http://thepowerofpoop.com/openbiome-interview-first-market-fecal-microbiota/
 
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more evidence supporting the role of intestinal microbes in regulating inflammation via the substances they produce(various peptides).

http://www.plosone.org/article/info...losone/PLoSONE+(PLoS+ONE+Alerts:+New+Articles)

makes me think about SCD yogurt, not only are you getting the bacteria in large numbers, but theoretically may be getting other molecules they create which may help reduce inflammation when fermented at 24 hours rather then then 4 hours most commercial yogurt is fermented at, with some brands being exceptions to that rule.

http://www.breakingtheviciouscycle.info/p/science-behind-the-diet/
 
Today I'm going to contact our local newspapers and tv stations to ask them to put do stories on this up and coming treatment.

Any other ideas how we can create heightened awareness w/the pharmaceutical companies and GI doctors to make this happen?

Let's get together and let them hear from us how great it would be to have cures and non-threatening treatment options.
 
Thank you very much for this interesting thread!

Here is an interesting article that my dear friend just sent me (I didn't see it posted here before but maybe I'm wrong...):

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3819561/
I'm proud to say that this report is included in the original post of this thread in the first section titled: 1. HISTORY OF FECAL TRANSPLANTS- its success so far. This report was originally brought to my attention by fellow forum member sir.clausin .

there is also another report of the successful treatment of crohn's with a fecal transplant from the u.k http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24239403
Also in section 1 is a link to the first 3 crohn's patients successfully treated by doctor borody of australia which was presented at the American College of Gastroeneterology annual scientific meeting in 2011.

What is amazing is that the complete remissions induced By Fecal transplants can be maintained without any drugs, and strongly suggests these patients may be cured, in a similar fashion to the way Fecal transplants seemed to have cured Ulcerative colitis patients which was reported by borody in 2003.
 
Here is an introduction to Denis Burkitt's research around 1960. He proposed the idea that stool quality due to fiber in the diet may explain the dramatic differences in diseases between industrialized and non industrialized societies.

since we now know fiber feeds all the good bacteria in the intestines, and that stool is a result of bacterial fermentation, this supports the new research that restoring a damaged microbiome with a fecal transplant could make sense for treating many of these diseases of industrialzed society, low fiber puts us at risk for damage to the microbiome.

Professor borody has also observed a patient recover from multple sclerosis from a fecal transplant to treat his constipation symptoms, and fecal transplant are in clinical trials right now to treat a form of diabetes, with many other hopeful appications for the restoration of damaged intestinal flora.

http://nutritionfacts.org/video/dr-...dium=rss&utm_campaign=dr-burkitts-f-word-diet
 
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NEWS:

Policy: How to regulate faecal transplants.
From the journal, nature February 19 2014.

http://www.nature.com/news/policy-how-to-regulate-faecal-transplants-1.14720

The current situation is one of both under- and over-regulation. FMT for recurrent C. difficile infections can be performed without any mandatory screening, whereas FMT for other indications cannot be performed without an IND, a hurdle that will dissuade some physician–investigators.
My Thoughts:
Despite 10 studies for fecal transplant in IBD this year, it still may be some time before we can have it through gi, stay tuned to find out how this all pans out.
 
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Could baby poo in sausages be good for our health?
@6:50 "we're doing a large trial with UC, which is now reversible with transplants"
http://blogs.abc.net.au/victoria/20...l?site=melbourne&program=melbourne_afternoons
Professor Thomas Borody and Richard Stubbs pick up where they left off.
http://blogs.abc.net.au/victoria/20...l?site=melbourne&program=melbourne_afternoons
thanks hugh. yea its always great to hear or read borody say it aloud: ulcerative colitis has been cured with a fecal transplant. he has stated this a few times already. It may be the same for crohn's. from what i read and experianced, i believe it will cure crohns too.
 
Hi All, I'm a grad student in science journalism, writing an article about fecal transplants and Crohn's. If anyone is interested in talking about their experiences with the treatment please shoot me an email (wheeling.ca@gmail.com) thanks!
 
NEWS:

Here is a new testimony of a women with crohn's who achieved a complete remission with a single Fecal Transplant done with a Nasogastric tube through Doctor Borodys clinic in Australia. She believes she is cured and she very well could be. This is the second report of an astounding success with a single dose of FMT in Crohn's Disease, although not an official report, it definitely counts. Borody may also eventually speak directly about these experiences in the coming months.

http://www.farmingahead.com.au/News...plants-curing-incurable-diseases-like-crohn-s
 
This link is a story from the Australian ABC website- fecal transplant trials now available in Australia for colitis.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-03-18/sydney-doctor-claims-poo-transplants-curing-diseases/5329836
wait a sec.... she did this fecal transplant 12 years ago!!! and is still in "remission", i suppose that's why Borody suggests that it is a cure for crohn's.

also, this seems to be the same article although the links are different, either way, this may be the original source link of the article, so that's a great find.
 
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Experts on the Microbiome come together to speak about the newly emerging science of beneficial and pathogenic bacteria in health and disease in Miami Florida March 8-9th 2014. follow link to watch video. Use the menu below the video to skip to different parts.

For instance the most relevant part is the Role of Intestinal Microbiota in IBD, where they talk about specific bacteria responsible for regulating inflammatory response.

http://www.gutmicrobiotaforhealth.com/gmfh2014-webcast-5829
 
a laid back podcast from Chris Kresser, but lots of good info...
Delete if it's a repeat:)

All About Fecal Microbiota Transplants
"In this show we have Glenn Taylor of the Taymount Clinic[1], one of the few places doing fecal microbiota transplants, otherwise known as FMTs."
http://chriskresser.com/all-about-fecal-microbiota-transplants

and this.....

Study Shows That The Bacteria That Ulcerative Colitis & Crohn’s Disease Patients Lack Can Be Found In FMT
http://taymount.com/blog/study-ulcerative-colitis-crohns-fmt/

[1] http://taymount.com/
 
more studys planned for Fecal transplants in IBD, that will now total 14 studies. I think 2 were completed so far.


Crohn's Disease
Gastroenterology department, Saint Antoine Hospital
Paris, France, 75571
ClinicalTrials.gov Identifier: NCT02097797
Estimated Enrollment: 18
Study Start Date: March 2014
Estimated Study Completion Date: February 2016
http://www.clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT02097797?term=fecal+transplant&rank=10


IBD both forms
Department of General Surgery, Jinling hosptal,Medical School of Nanjing University Nanjing, Jiangsu, China, 210002
ClinicalTrials.gov Identifier: NCT02016469
Estimated Enrollment: 30
Study Start Date: December 2013
Estimated Study Completion Date: February 2016
http://www.clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT02016469?term=fecal+transplant&rank=17


Ulcerative Colitis
University of Chicago Medicine Recruiting
Chicago, Illinois, United States, 60637
ClinicalTrials.gov Identifier: NCT02058524
Estimated Enrollment: 20
Study Start Date: June 2013
Estimated Primary Completion Date: June 2015
http://www.clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT02058524?term=fecal+transplant&rank=19


IBD both forms
Wolfson Medical Center, Holon, Israel.
ClinicalTrials.gov Identifier: NCT02033408
Estimated Enrollment: 20
Study Start Date: January 2014
Estimated Study Completion Date: January 2016
http://www.clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT02033408?term=fecal+transplant&rank=30
 
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Searchingforhealth: You should join the FYI FMT on Facebook. PM if you want in.

These studies makes me glad, but after meeting with Professor John Hermon-Taylor and all the talk about MAP, I do Believe that FMT won´t be a solution for Crohns due to the infection. It might keep it at bay for a while but not fix the problem that the immunesystem can´t detect the evil bug.
 
Fmt has already cured people with both forms of ibd, even if it's an infection, the infection is by a bacteria, you gotta realise that fmt is like putting many different "biotics" straight into the gut, it's very much an individual thing, with various causes contributing to inflamation, to give you a better understanding, when they take a biopsy and it reveals microscopic inflamation it's usually an infiltration of inflamatory cells, which can be there for various reasons, map yes, disbiosis yes, my point is there's no reason ppl shouldn't try fmt it's generally harmless if you have a properly screened donor and it does offer a potential cure. Though there may be less success stories than that of UC, it only has to work for 1 person w CD to show that it can work- which it has.
 
As I understand it there are two main pitfalls with DIY.
1/ Screening is fairly important. The donor may have parasites or bacteria that are kept in balance/under control by their immune system/biota but that may run amuck in a sub-optimal digestive system.
I don't know how often this happens.
2/ Most of the bacteria (90%?) is anaerobic and dies when blended up in a frothy smoothie in your average blender
 
As I understand it there are two main pitfalls with DIY.
1/ Screening is fairly important. The donor may have parasites or bacteria that are kept in balance/under control by their immune system/biota but that may run amuck in a sub-optimal digestive system.
I don't know how often this happens.
2/ Most of the bacteria (90%?) is anaerobic and dies when blended up in a frothy smoothie in your average blender


I wish i had some references for this but from what I've read about 50% of the bacteria will die in the first 10 minutes after exposure to oxygen. After 20 minutes you may hardly have any left alive. Making the thickest solution possible of saline to stool ratio is one way to achieve a higher concentration of bacteria and ensure you have something after blending. Thicker solutions may be easier to retain as an enema, thinner and your body may have the urge to reject it as if you had diarrhea.

Even more of an issue is that the species that we need, is very low in the stool to begin with, only on the mucosal surface is where they dominate. Making your donor follow a strict diet with high fiber foods to help boost the good bacteria is one thing you can do to help ensure success.

It seems all that is needed to do a fecal transplant is one transplant at a high dose of bacteria for a very short duration of time, rather then have a low dose spaced apart given over a length of time, because the good bacteria being introduced need to fight off the existing pathogens in the patient first, then re-establish themselves to provide anti-inflammatory signals to the body. Once the inflammation dies down, pathogens can no longer flourish, and the good bacteria have a chance to dominate. Too low of a dose may only get the good bacteria so far, and the remaining inflammation will allow pathogens to dominate once again if the dose of good bacteria is not high enough or spaced too far apart.

Screening is pretty important, and one problem is that gastrointestinal disorders are very hard to diagnose as it is, so if someone has a mild case of IBS, they may not really know it, because they may not associate their gi symptoms with IBS. This may pose a risk as our intestines are very hospitable to pathogens, so it is important to have a good relationship with your donor and trust they are being truthful about the state of the gi health.

giving a successful fecal transplant is quite a technological hurdle and these are a few reasons for such mixed results. Patients who are already in deep remission from medications will likely require lower doses of bacteria then patients with uncontrolled or severe disease states. This is what the current state of the research suggests but we may learn more as more studies are completed.
 

Spooky1

Well-known member
Location
South Northants
Taymount look very expensive. Does it matter if you've had lots of intestine removed? Obviously we don't have as much of a digestive tract as others, therefore, do we lack bacteria?

I've just bought some Bimuno to try, this however is far more for IBS. I would try anything, and Bimuno is certainly cheaper than Taymount.
 
Here is a new report in the Journal of Clinical Gastroenterology of a patient with Crohn's Disease achieving a complete remission with only one fecal transplant and without the need for maintenance drugs.

This will now total 6 official reports of fecal transplant inducing remission in Crohn's Disease. (EDIT- That's remission without any maintainance drugs.)

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24667590
 
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I wish i had some references for this but from what I've read about 50% of the bacteria will die in the first 10 minutes after exposure to oxygen. After 20 minutes you may hardly have any left alive.
Would it be possible to flood the blender with some other gas before mixing takes place, displacing the oxygen? For instance, in small batch beer brewing there's a device called a 'beer gun' that floods an empty bottle with CO2 before the beer is gently added, preventing oxydation.
 
Would it be possible to flood the blender with some other gas before mixing takes place, displacing the oxygen? For instance, in small batch beer brewing there's a device called a 'beer gun' that floods an empty bottle with CO2 before the beer is gently added, preventing oxydation.


Yes carbon dioxide gas is fine. Anaerobic bacteria in the intestine actually utilize this as a food source, so it is non-toxic to them, and many probiotic anaerobic organisms found in the intestines can be cultered(grown) in a high co2 environment, or around 80% co2, so if they can grow under high co2 conditions, they will likely be able to survive exposure to high levels of co2 as well for a short amount of time.

Nitrogen has been used to flush a blender when blending stool samples with saline by pumping it into the cover with an intake and exhaust port, as blending exposes the bacteria to lots of oxygen. so nitrogen or carbon dioxide gas can be used to displace oxygen and preserve the bacteria during the blending process.

Standard anaerobic glove boxes used to culture and study anaerobic bacteria are usually a mix between 85% nitrogen, 10% hydrogen and 5% carbon dioxide.

I looked up this beer gun tool you were talking about. It works on the principle that co2 gas is heavier then the atmosphere and can flush the oxygen out of a bottle. he demonstrates this @1:45.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PfqZ_9UCt7s#t=172

Another option for blending stool for a fecal transplant is to mix it in a freezer bag after letting as many air bubbles out of the bag as possible, then clamping it shut with paper clamps so it wont break open while you mix it. this could create an oxygen free blending environment as well.
 
Another option for blending stool for a fecal transplant is to mix it in a freezer bag after letting as many air bubbles out of the bag as possible, then clamping it shut with paper clamps so it wont break open while you mix it. this could create an oxygen free blending environment as well.
That sounds like a better idea than trying to displace oxygen in some kind of mixing vessel (blender). To do it right, you'd probably need to pull a vacuum, then add your nitrogen or CO2. As you say, CO2 is heavier, so I guess if you added it very gently to the bottom of the vessel (like in your video), it might work without a vacuum. But the freezer bag just seems like it might be just as effective without the higher equipement burdon (cost and cleaning).
 
Here is an excerpt from an article reporting on the most recent Study of Fecal Transplants in Ulcerative Colitis.

Case Report of Success

The overall study was negative but some patients had a very good response to the treatment. Dr. Moayyedi presented a case that "typifies a few patients in the study."

The man had a 20-year history of ulcerative colitis and had responded to steroids and 5-aminosalicylic acid for most of his illness. Two years before study entry, the medications became ineffective and he developed severe disease. He refused immunosuppressive therapies and surgery. He was randomized to the placebo group and showed no improvement during the study. He was then offered fecal transplant.

At 20 weeks, "his Mayo score is 0, his mucosa looks good, and he is fine without medication, after having had severe disease for 2 years," Dr. Moayyedi reported. This patient had a "diverse, unstable" microbiome at baseline. With treatment, his microbiome became enriched with Ruminococcus and began to resemble the donor's.

Transplants from some donors seemed to be more effective than others, indicating a need to better understand the transplanted microbiome, he said.

Length of Treatment and Severity of Disease

A number of patients who subjectively reported improvement but did not achieve remission continued on treatment, and approximately one-third achieved remission with extended treatment. This suggests that the study treatment period could have been too short, said Dr. Moayyedi.

http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/824930#2
 
wildbill, what is your opinion of the once a week protocol? If I had to guess, I'd say that, if the goal is to set-up an altered biome, the treatments would be at least daily. That would seem to be a better approach to push the previous biome out, to beat it into submission. A boxing analogy...if a prize fighter gets hit once a day, he can last for years. But that sam fighter got hit once per minute, he'd be on the canvas after a few blows.
 
wildbill, what is your opinion of the once a week protocol? If I had to guess, I'd say that, if the goal is to set-up an altered biome, the treatments would be at least daily. That would seem to be a better approach to push the previous biome out, to beat it into submission. A boxing analogy...if a prize fighter gets hit once a day, he can last for years. But that sam fighter got hit once per minute, he'd be on the canvas after a few blows.

In doctor Borody's study of FMT for UC, they did 5 daily FMT enemas and all 6 achieved remission without drugs and confirmed to maintain these "remissions" when followed up 13 years later. http://prdupl02.ynet.co.il/ForumFiles_2/28701499.pdf


I personally wouldn't have altered this protocol too much if i were to design a study myself and intended it to succeed, but there may be a benefit to trying something different just to see how people may respond. Perhaps for convenience we may have discovered the these enemas may be spaced out a bit like weekly or bi-weekly, although that still can be effective, it doesnt seem more effective then consecutive fecal transplants. But it might have been more convenient for patients to have them done once a week, rather then them meeting up with their donor every day of the week to perform a fecal transplant. So consecutive daily Enemas seem to be more effective then weekly enemas, since all 6 patients achieved remission in borodys study, as compared to the most recent study where they were spaced apart and didnt show a high response rate like Borody's study.

but now looking at all the evidence that exists in addition to borody's old study on UC, it just seems that one oral fecal transplant may be all that it will take, if the bacteria is protected from oxygen and perhaps if taken with high fiber meal and if the donor follows a strict high fiber diet. Influencing those 3 variables might be the trick.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24222969?dopt=Abstract
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-03-18/sydney-doctor-claims-poo-transplants-curing-diseases/5329836

Lots of variables at play here tho, so it will take alot of studies that try to examine the effects of each one and how they contribute to success so that we can develop a protocol that will give a more reliable response rate for all patients regardless of their severity.
 
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In doctor Borody's study of FMT for UC, they did 5 daily FMT enemas and all 6 achieved remission without drugs and confirmed to maintain these "remissions" when followed up 13 years later. http://prdupl02.ynet.co.il/ForumFiles_2/28701499.pdf
Wow! What an awesome paper! Unless there's another study that did the same thing and it didn't work, I'm not sure why this isn't more popular.

But yeah, five days in a row looks like a way to keep the bad guys on the ropes and/or knock 'em down.

but now looking at all the evidence that exists in addition to borody's old study on UC, it just seems that one oral fecal transplant may be all that it will take, if the bacteria is protected from oxygen and perhaps if taken with high fiber meal and if the donor follows a strict high fiber diet. Influencing those 3 variables might be the trick.
That would be a shattering result...to take a pill with some fiber and have the symptoms disappear. I still need to read the other papers you posted, but wanted to comment on the Borody paper.

Thanks for your continued focus on this topic!
 
Cured and remission are subjective terms, would you say 13 years remission is not a cure? How do you know? If they get sick again who's to say they were not reinfected or had an altered Biome, nothing in this life is certain.

But for the record for those who are interested, Borody still does the 5 day protocol to this day, so it's obviously still showing success, he is a very smart man, not one to beat a dead horse.

Hope you all find wellness and stay there. Peace.
 
2/ Most of the bacteria (90%?) is anaerobic and dies when blended up in a frothy smoothie in your average blender
I would avoid the blender technique completely! A zip bag, where the air had been completely expelled, would seem to be a better choice.

But another question about viability....

Are there any references or guides for handling a specimin from a donor? Optimally, one would start an anarobic preparation immediately, but if this is not possible, how should the sample be treated, and how will the viability decline over time? This obviously depend upon handling conditions.

At minimum, the sample would be kept in an air tight container, but would refrigeration improve or degrade viability? What would be the half-life of bacteria at various temperatures?

One might consider modeling the process with a substance that indicates oxydation visually. If guacamole was similar to a fecal sample, then it appears that the surface oxydizes much faster than the interior. This is indicated by the discoloration of only the surface, leaving the material in the interior unchanged.

Beyond any modern studies of viability over time, what are the protocols used by traditional Chineese medicine? One may presume that through trial end error over generations, discoveries were made as to what worked best. Do these discoveries include consensus on when a sample is "too old"?
 
Here is a video that lays out equipment, supplies and process for at-home FMT. There are already many of these on the internet, of course, but most of those use a blender. This one uses a potato ricer, which, I think, reduces the amount of oxygen the sample is exposed to.

http://youtu.be/KEIYJHnOjHM

Saline was not used, but could (should?) be substituted for the distilled water. Other processes had used distilled and it seemed easier than having to mix up something. But since the consensus seems to be that there is an osmotic pressure concern using distilled water, it wouldn't be too much extra work to disolve some salt, or buy saline instead of distilled water.

A toilet hat would be optimal for collecting the sample, but plastic wrap is disposable. My goal with this process was to use equipment/supplies that could be thrown away rather than cleaned. And for the equipment/supplies to be found around the house or at a local store.

The potato ricer is probably something that would need to be purchased specially for the process. The idea was to have this replace the blender step that many people show in other process documentation. My thinking is that forcing the sample through those small holes oxydizes the sample less than (probably much less than) running it through a blender. The reason I say this is because the blender seems to be whipping air into the sample with a lot of force. So much force that the sample in some videos I've seen looks frothy! All of that air can't be too healthy for anaerobic cells. The holes in the ricer guarantee particle sizes of 2mm or 2.5mm, so there are no large particles to clog the enema bottle.
 
If you look at Probiotic Therapy Home Infusion Protocol from Probiotic Therapy Research, it says that you should take antibiotics for a minimum of 10 days before doing the FMT. The antibiotics recommended are one or two of the following:

rifampicin: 150mg AM, 150mg PM (2 pills per day)
vancomycin: 250mg AM, 250mg PM (4 pills per day)
flagyl: 400mg AM, 400mg PM (2 pills per day)

But the problem is that my GI doc refused to prescribe these potent antibiotics. I doubt any US doc would prescribe these antibiotics without a reason, and if you gave the reason that you were going to do a home FMT, they probably would be LESS likely to prescribe it, for fear of getting in trouble with the authorities.

I'm having him run a test for C. Diff and I'm hoping it's positive, because that's the only way I'm going to get the antibiotics!

Given that comes back negative, how does one source these antibiotics?
 
You should get in contact w prof borody at the cdd in Sydney, he knows doctors in the US that are like minded. Maybe he can put you onto one. God bless
 
If you look at Probiotic Therapy Home Infusion Protocol from Probiotic Therapy Research, it says that you should take antibiotics for a minimum of 10 days before doing the FMT. The antibiotics recommended are one or two of the following:

rifampicin: 150mg AM, 150mg PM (2 pills per day)
vancomycin: 250mg AM, 250mg PM (4 pills per day)
flagyl: 400mg AM, 400mg PM (2 pills per day)

But the problem is that my GI doc refused to prescribe these potent antibiotics. I doubt any US doc would prescribe these antibiotics without a reason, and if you gave the reason that you were going to do a home FMT, they probably would be LESS likely to prescribe it, for fear of getting in trouble with the authorities.

I'm having him run a test for C. Diff and I'm hoping it's positive, because that's the only way I'm going to get the antibiotics!

Given that comes back negative, how does one source these antibiotics?
This document is old. From the top of my head, I do believe i've read that antibiotics before the Fecal Transplant is not required. The Fecal Transplant should be powerful enough to wipe out all pathogens. I believe ive read researchers say these antibiotics are not needed, dont recall where i read it Though, So just skip it.
 
Introducing Alex Khoruts, MD Associate Professor, Department of Medicine,
University of Minnesota. He is working on perfecting the fecal transplant and bringing it mainstream. Here is a video him speaking on the role of Intestinal Bacteria in health and disease. He begins by addressing the revolutionary idea that not all bacteria are bad, and its time to accept that what is going on within the intestinal bacteria is the equivalent to another organ system.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GGR3YkHEfLs
 
Hi All,

I don't have Crohn's but I recently did a DIY Fecal Transplant Pill procedure in an attempt to cure my IBS.

If anyone is interested in the process feel free to check out my progress and procedure here: gastrosolutions.org

It's only early days but the results so far are very promising. The pill/capsule treatment is a one shot deal and it may also be another solution for those seeking FMT treatment but aren't up to doing a dozen enemas.


Cheers
Chris
 
Hi All,

I don't have Crohn's but I recently did a DIY Fecal Transplant Pill procedure in an attempt to cure my IBS.

If anyone is interested in the process feel free to check out my progress and procedure here: gastrosolutions.org

It's only early days but the results so far are very promising. The pill/capsule treatment is a one shot deal and it may also be another solution for those seeking FMT treatment but aren't up to doing a dozen enemas.


Cheers
Chris

Hi chris, i have seen your website a few days ago about the fecal transplant pill making process based on the method of Dr. Louie in Canada. I try to keep up with your updates on your website, hope things continue to improve and hopefully you are cured of IBS from a fecal transplant pill.

It was my prediction that the pill method or any oral method would be superior to multiple enemas, we now have some evidence that that is the case. see the first post of this thread section #1 for references. In addition to that we also have your testimony now, which is pretty cool.
 
Hi Bill,

Yeah, I hope this treatment does work for people because it is so non-invasive. I was essentially looking for a one-shot solution instead of the enema. Swallowing a couple of dozen capsules is far easier than having 10 enemas!

Each to their own, though! :)
 
Is the fecal pill available in the U.S.? Would it help people with IBD in the colon rather than the stomach or small intestines?

I traveled to Minnesota to get our daughter on the anti map therapy (not fecal transplant). After being rediagnosed with Ulcerative Colitis, this Doctor would not prescribe those antibiotics for our daughter, and did not advice fecal enemas except for C.Diff.

I still think one day, those antibiotics will be the cure for many. If not cure, the preferred treatment with very little side effects.
 
FMT via colonoscopy or DIY FMT is the preferred method for UC. My daughter had CDiff, hopefully cured with a FMT and has been diagnosed with UC. The GI docs thought she had Crohns but we just got the Promethius IBD test and it all but ruled out Crohns. She is trying LDN, starting at 1.5 mg and it seems to be helping. I am making my own kefir for her and keeping DIY FMT on the back burner. She is down to 16 mg. Pred. Check out the website The Power of Poop for more info.
 
Is the fecal pill available in the U.S.? Would it help people with IBD in the colon rather than the stomach or small intestines?

I traveled to Minnesota to get our daughter on the anti map therapy (not fecal transplant). After being rediagnosed with Ulcerative Colitis, this Doctor would not prescribe those antibiotics for our daughter, and did not advice fecal enemas except for C.Diff.

I still think one day, those antibiotics will be the cure for many. If not cure, the preferred treatment with very little side effects.

Hope345: I know of only two clinics in the US offer the FMT capsule treatment commercially - Mark Davis, ND at Bright Medicine Clinic (brightmedicineclinic.com) and Bruce Hirsch, MD at Symbiotic Health (symbioticbio.com/team/).

I'm not sure if they treat non-C.diff, however. Probably worth a phone call or email though.

Best of luck.
 
Hope345: I know of only two clinics in the US offer the FMT capsule treatment commercially - Mark Davis, ND at Bright Medicine Clinic (brightmedicineclinic.com) and Bruce Hirsch, MD at Symbiotic Health (symbioticbio.com/team/).

I'm not sure if they treat non-C.diff, however. Probably worth a phone call or email though.

Best of luck.
The Bright medical clinic is only giving the Fecal transplant via pill form for C. Difficile infections because the FDA only approved it for this Disease in some circumstances.
 
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Hi all,

I think I am going to give this a shot - maybe DIY style at home.

I've had Crohn's Colitis for 32 years. Originally, I was diagnosed with UC but that was changed to Crohn's when I got fistulae 8 years ago. Not doing too bad at the moment but would love to be able to eat what I wanted or even have a glass (bottle) of wine. Not to mention that recent stresses have exacerbated things.

I have two potential donors - my lovely wife (I asked and she said she's up for it) and my two and a 1/2 year old daughter (I asked and she said 'Peppa pig' which I am taking as a resounding yes).

Which of these two potential donors do you think would be a better fit?

Thanks

Nick
 
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