My update - not great :(

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Ian

Joined
Feb 9, 2010
Messages
328
Location
London, UK
Hi all!

Well after another two weeks of continuing on weekly Humira, 40mg Pred and 75mg 6MP, things haven't really improved for me (maybe VERY slightly but if so not significantly). I saw a GI today - not mine, he's on holiday - but I was armed with a page of questions I'd typed up haha, bet she loved me! I had been going over many potential scenarios so nothing she had to say came as a huge shock, but still, some of it wasn't good to hear.

Basically, after a month of 40mg of Pred, it's time to taper. I've been pretty stable for the last week and a half (although I oddly haven't been very symptomatic with this flare anyway, even though the flexi-sig showed nasty inflammation) - averaging 2 b/ms per day, eating fine (anything I want), no pain etc. But STILL passing blood/mucus each time I go.
Anyway, things are surely about to get worse as I bring the Pred down - I think it's what's holding off all the nasty symptoms.

My last chance at a drug saviour is Infliximab, which I will be trying if/when I decline (definitely WHEN!). I am not expecting it to work, however. I used it last year in a bad flare and it worked wonders, but at the time it could only be prescribed here to treat acute symptoms so I was only entitled to the short course of infusions (initial, followed by one 2 weeks later, followed by one 6 weeks later). As I was in remission after this, I had to stop. The stop and start approach is known to have problems; it's very possible I will have an allergic reaction, or that is just plain won't work due to me possibly having developed anti-bodies. I know some people have been fine going back on it after a break, but I refuse to hang all my hopes on it. I don't want to set myself up for a huge disappointment.

If/when Infliximab fails, it looks like surgery is my only option. This was easier to deal with 2 weeks ago when a doctor (again, not MY doctor) told me that the 'worst case scenario' would be a resection to remove the inflamed part (mainly the sigmoid, some of the rectum and descending are inflamed to a lesser degree). He had only done a flexi-sig so he doesn't know if there is inflammation higher up, there was healthy bowel up there but obviously he hasn't seen the transverse, ascending and cecum (and they don't want to do colonoscopy at the moment in case the prep aggravates me and sends me over the edge). And even if there isn't, there was inflammation there last year, so it's possible, likely even, that inflammation will occur there in the future. For these reasons, the doctor I saw today told me that a resection or segmented resection might not be an option - it's very possible my 'worst case scenario' is in fact a complete colon removal, as the surgeon isn't going to want to do an operation that has a high chance of failure. Luckily, because I do my research and am a chronic pessimist, I already suspected this to a degree. But thanks to that previous doctor, this news could easily have knocked me off my chair.

So I'm preparing myself for this worst case scenario and it's pretty **** :( I always thought this would happen one day, but kind of hoped I'd be the other side of 50 when that day came lol. I know it can't be easy for anyone to deal with but I think if I could've made it through my youth first, it would be a bit easier to accept? I know, Infliximab could work, but I'm telling myself it won't as a defence mechanism really. I just can't go through having more hopes shattered right now.

She’s arranging an appointment for me with the surgeon (regardless of my health at the time – it’s a conversation I need to have either way). I guess I will be able to fire all my questions at him, and fight tooth and nail for him to do everything in his power to save my colon, even if it’s just to see if I can maintain remission afterwards. I don’t mind ultimately having to have two surgeries, but I guess he’ll mind having to perform two lol. I will also ask about the possibility of a temporary stoma that leaves my bowels in tact to see if they can heal once stool is diverted from them, so that the stoma can later be reversed. But I’m not hopeful; I’m sure the thinking will be that the disease will surely come back, so we may as well just take it all out.

I also mentioned the stem cell transplant trial here in the UK, and to my surprise did not get laughed out of the room. She said she’s look into for me to see if they are still recruiting (I believe they are, not sure though, and don’t know if I’m eligible blah blah). Problem is, if I end up pursuing that avenue, it will be because Infliximab failed, and I’ll be tapering my Pred, so I will be getting sicker by the day. I doubt I’d make it to trial as I’d have to go under the knife before then.

Sorry that was so long, lots to tell I guess. I keep saying to my mum and sister I wish I just didn’t CARE about the prospect of a stoma – then I’d be fine! But I suppose that’s like wishing you didn’t care when someone dies. Unfortunately the grief process is unavoidable. I just don’t want to be miserable about it but it’s hard – I don’t suffer with my CD on a daily basis like some do. When I’m not flaring, I have ZERO symptoms, normal energy, can eat/drink whatever I like. It’s not like a stoma will give me a new lease on life to the same degree it does for others, so it’s hard to see the positive side. I want to though. I really want to not care!

Anyway, I will stop now :)
 
HI Ian, I know how you feel, been down your avenue of choices to bear. Alot of people do great on Remicade, I didnt, but so many have and are still going strong! All the drugs you are on now, should of helped ,even the Pred alone. Would be a good idea to start tapering , such a nasty drug. I have had surgery twice so if you need any help let me know, I can help you somewhat. Dont give up hope the Remi doesn't work. Believe it or not there was a study done on pain meds and if you are convinced it won't help you, it won't. The brain is a powerful thing. :hang:
 
:hug:

Oh Ian, sending you lots of hugs hunny. I was thinking about you today when I was seeing my GI and wondering how you'd got on. I'm sorry that the answers you got were not the answers you were looking for. I'm keeping my fingers and everything else crossed that the Infliximab works again for you.
I've never had surgery on my bowels (yet) so can't offer advise on that area but I'm sure many folk on here will be able to advise you.

Love & hugs

Paula
x
 
Hey Ian,

Oh man I am so sorry to be reading all that is going on. :(

I hope the Remicade is a goer for you again and you don't have to face the prospect of surgery at this point. Personally, when speaking with the surgeon I would be pushing the temporary stoma option. To me it is not about the disease coming back but saving bowel, gaining remission and buying time and any decent surgeon should be thinking that way as well. I know all the colorectal surgeons Matt saw when he was in hospital felt this way. One, two, three or more surgeries is of no consequence to them so fight tooth and nail to retain as much as possible.

Good luck mate and keep us posted on how you are travelling.

Dusty. :hug:
 
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Ian,
I cannot add anything else to what others have said except, I am very sorry you are going through all this. Crappy disease! I SO agree with Dusty. Fight it! Tooth & nail, using underhanded measures if needed!
Good luck and keep us updated.
Michele
 
Hi,Ian.I'm sorry to read about your troubles. My 10-year-old boy is on Remicade and is finally doing great. He will nver be on Pred again because he ended up with a seizure from it. So if (or when rather) Remi stops working we'll be out of luck. It makes me really mad why you have to have one foot in the grave to be able to get the stem cell transplant. What is up with that? Of course you don't want you colon removed,I don't blame you. Especially when there is a cure out there (stem cell transplant)... For my own sanity I'm counting on that for my son in the future. Good luck and don't give up.
 
Aww Ian, that's crap :(

I know you're not trying to keep your hopes up, but there still is hope that you won't need surgery. I was ill for YEARS and nothing would get me off the pred, then all of a sudden I started getting better by myself. It's not over till the fat lady sings!! Hang in there!!!
 
Ian! I am so sorry you are going through all of this. I know you like to prepare yourself for the worst, but all the members above are right - don't give up just yet! Also, you may have a good point with a temporary stoma to give everything a rest. That has worked for quite a few on here. Keep us posted!!
 
Hey Ian,
Sorry to hear all this. You seem to have wisdom beyond your years. Your advice to others around the forum has been great. I wish you the best of luck.
 
Sorry you got such stinky news. Yuck. :(

I think everyone has pretty much hit the nail on the head with all their advice and I'm going to have to go along with what they say. I have never had to face this decision, so I can only imagine what you must be feeling/thinking...but I am a list maker and a scenario maker kind of person too. So don't feel too bad ;) It's best to be prepared for any situation that may come up, but don't back yourself into a corner with no hope for something working. I agree with Pen that the mind can help things, but definitely check into the temporary stoma before throwing in the towel. It's your body, not theirs. So, you have just as much say what goes on. :)

Good luck, buddy! :)
 
Thanks so much for the replies everyone! Having your support means a lot :)

I can't find very much information about a temp surgery that leaves the bowels in tact to see if they heal. I know Jer's Girl had it done, anyone know of anyone else? I will bring it up but I can't honestly see the surgeons going for it. I wonder how long you can leave the colon disconnected for...

But yes, I will fight all I can. At least then I'll know that if a total removal happens I did everything in my power to avoid it. That will make it easier to take I think.

Think I'm just going to take Amy's approach and try and find as many positive aspects to a perminant stoma as I possibly can. I want to be mentally prepared for and accepting of the worst possible scenario, and then anything better than that is just a bonus!
 
Ian, have you had a look around the stoma subforum? There are probably others in there who have had temporary ostomies and had them reversed successfully. And like you said, if you want to think of the positives to the "worst case scenario", I'm sure they can provide you with a long list as well.

Other than that, I can't add much more than what has been already said, except to wish you luck and I hope you end up with a better scenario than what you are preparing to expect. Good luck!
 
Matt was facing the possibility of a temporary stoma back in January. I would imagine when Matt is scheduled for surgery and if the scan to see what is happening with the inflammation shows it is still extensive then a temporary stoma will still be on the cards.

There would be no limit, as such, as to the time you can have your colon disconnected. It has a blood supply so it remains viable.

Dusty. :hug:
 
Hey Ian-

Sorry to read about your troubles.:( Surgery is not an exciting option to begin with, and becomes even less so with the thought of losing your colon. The tiny sliver of light you may be able to see is you, in the future, healthy and happy. Surgery sucks, but hopefully it will give you greater freedom on the back end( if even necessary in the first place), figuratively typing.

Good luck, homey claus!
 
Hey buddy - Sorry you got a sh*t report at the doc's today. I admire you for being a realist and trying to investigate every scenario before settling for the worst case scenario.

I understand that you are hesitant to hope the Remi will work on the second go-round. But I think you should poke around a bit more to see how many others on here have had a temp stoma to allow for bowel rest. It might be more common than you think.

Is elemental diet an option for you? I know it's very hard to follow, but it has a very high success rate in inducing remission.

It's easy to hope and wish for surgery and accept a bag when one's symptoms are so bad and affecting daily life. So I can see how this option is not as exciting to you, since your life isn't affected so badly. It's a tough decision to make.

I really hope there are some other options for you to explore before settling on surgery.

We're here for you! We're all rooting for you!

xo - Ames
 
Thanks everyone!

I've looked around for information on temp ileostomies on here but can't find a great deal. I'd be interested to know how likely the inflammation is to reduce once the bowel isn't being 'used' - only because if there was no change, I'd not only be dealing with a stoma but still shitting blood/mucus out the back end lol.

I've also been told a j-pouch is not an option because my diagnosis is Crohn's, and I already knew that before I went in for my appointment. But it's actually Crohn's Colitis; limited to the large intestine and I've never had any in the illeum/small bowel. Should I push for this anyway? I know it's a risk, but what if I never develop inflammation anywhere else? Or what if a pouch gives me years of bag-free remission before it ultimately has to be changed to a perm stoma? I know they don't want to do multiple surgeries, but it's me that potentially suffers, not them. I know, common sense tells me just to do as advised, but we like our colon's don't we (even if they don't like us!) :)

Anyway, trying to make headway with the 'positives' of a perm ileostomy besides the obvious ones like possibly never having another symptomatic day in my life. One that sprung to mind - if I was ever at a music festival or camping or something, where the so-called 'facilities' are a disgusting joke (or not existent) - I'd be the only one not squatting in a bush and worrying about wiping haha. Just find a discreet place to empty and be on my merry way.
 
Oh and Amy, I did mention the elemental diet and the GI I saw said she'd be willing to let me try it, but it IS strict and she doesn't think it's likely to help. I don't either to be honest. Diet has never seems to initiate or exacerbate my symptoms (I'm lucky in a way), and I take it doesn't provide complete gut rest like a temp stoma would? I mean I know it's a liquid diet but it's not water, you still **** right? Lol. I can imagine it would be weeks/months of misery that would ultimately be for nothing, although perhaps that's just a lazy and defeatist attitude! I don't know.
 
Aww :( I really hope that the remicade works for you. Maybe if your doctor does say that the elemental diet is worth a shot that it is a good thing to try. At least this way you can say you exhausted every option. Hang in there.
 
Hi Ian,
I can tell you the biggest positive of an ostomy because I'm living it. It is renewed health. I had to give up running 8 years ago because of Crohn's. Now I'm back into it big time and loving it. I ran 13 miles (about 21 km) today - then when I got home, I did some work around the house. I had forgotten what it was like to have this much energy.

After an initial adjustment period, I'm finding the bag to be easy to deal with. Much better than the accidents and urgency of the past.
 
Ian, I look at your avatar and you could be my son in ten years. Same hair, everything...and the possibilities. It's gut wrenching for me to read about your troubles but heartening too the way you face it! Whatever you and the surgeons decide, I hope it's the best for you. You're a remarkable young man.
 
I had a temp colostomy. I had it reversed 6 months later. I went into remission, had one bad flare, and then had another remission for almost 4 years. So it can bring good health. As long you still have a rectum, they can put you back together.
 
Ian, I can't really say anything that wasn't already said. I will be sending some prayers your way. I do hope that the next round of treatment keeps you in remission for a while.
 
if I was ever at a music festival or camping or something, where the so-called 'facilities' are a disgusting joke (or not existent) - I'd be the only one not squatting in a bush and worrying about wiping haha. Just find a discreet place to empty and be on my merry way.

I think about this kind of stuff all the time with my upcoming surgery! And to me, it's a total bonus to get good health AND not have to worry about bathrooms in less than idea conditions like you mention above!!!

It might be worth continuing to explore the j-pouch. Like you said, you're the one taking the risk. It's just a matter of playing that odds that your disease will continue to leave your small intestine untouched.

Whatever happens, you will handle it like a champ! And for those days when you're not, you know we're all here for you!

xo - Ames
 
Hi Ian, nice to meet you!

You know, surgery isn't a bad thing at all. I had a re section this last December after only a month following my first symptoms and eventual diagnosis. I only had abdominal pain, but it was absolutely excruciating. Surgery has been a (surprisingly) very great experience! Minus two months in the hospital (but that should be way less for you) I am only 17, you look around my age, a little older but you shouldn't be scared. I know it is a little scary, but I did not cry once thinking about it. Was completely calm getting wheeled into the surgical room. Because I knew it would end...I knew that after 2 weeks of recovery I would be back to my normal life. Well, of course with some limited food for awhile. But now it's 3 months after, and wow...I'd do it again, no problem!!!! And I even had a whole month of pancreatitis afterwards with a huge tube in my throat.

Also, I started Remicade. Not sure if you have tried that, or spoken with your doctor about it, and if not, do so. You just get 2 hour transfusions every 8 weeks. Much better than those horrible injections.

Just keep your head up, things will get better over time, and NEVER let that slip your mind. Feel free to email me anytime, even if you just need someone to talk to, I can even give you my Facebook if you have one. Best wishes,
 
Hi Ian, I haven't even said hello. So a very big hello to you. I just want you to know I'm thinking of you xx
 
Hi Ian

I have to reiterate with Mark, you could be my son too! You look so much like him, my heart goes out to you little love!
I hope the Inflix works for you and bides you some more time to reassess the scenarios.
If not, I wish you all the luck in the world with whatever avenue you decide to travel down, I know you'll make the right decision.
love lots
Joan xxx
 
Thanks for the kind words everyone!

I will obviously try Infliximab again but I just can't bear to hold out hope for it because I'll only be devastated when it inevitably fails.

We don't know what the state of my ascending and transverse colon is yet - plus I haven't met with the surgeon. If it's mainly the sigmoid/descending colon that's messed up I will BEG him for a resection. I know the inflammation will come back, but when? We don't know. Could be days/weeks, could be years. I'm not responding to drugs right now but perhaps some of them would work if they were working on disease that was less far gone/severe? And if I got into remission I'd do everything in my power to stay there. And if I ultimately end up straight back in surgery having the bag, then at least I'd know I'd tried everything. That's the case I will make to the surgeon but again, I'm not holding out hope. I know Welsh Bird was in a very similar situation (only far more serious - I don't even really feel unwell!), but I think she had to put up a fight for that operation because they were pretty sure it wouldn't work long term.

Besides, the ascending and transverse colon could be messed up too - in which case I'd have no choice. I don't see them going for a segmental resection! It's just so weird - I'm averaging 2 b/ms per day and have no pain - I even pass solid stool (it's not formed, more like a heap lol, but definitely solid and not liquid) - which might indicate the higher part of the colon is working okay. It's just I'm STILL passing blood/mucus when I go :( If it weren’t for that one symptom, which is also slowly resulting in anaemia and fatigue (some of the tiredness is from not sleeping though – I got about an hour last night from being worried sick), then I wouldn’t be presenting any at all. If I was at death’s door I’d probably be screaming ‘give me the bag!’ but it’s an awful prospect to face when I feel almost normal. Trying to be mature about it but I can’t – I don’t want that life. And I don’t want it for everyone that cares about me. My mum burst into tears this morning as I was talking to her – she just started saying ‘you don’t deserve this!’ and told her ‘neither do you’. I’m making her life hell. We both know it’s not my fault, but I am. She feels so awful for me. Everyone will if it happens. I’d just hate it. I know I’d re-adjust and come to accept it to an extent, but it would be like re-adjusting to the death of a loved one. You accept it, but life is never quite as good or the same afterwards. Like I said if I was suffering I’d probably feel very differently, but I’m not. I want to be braver. I want to not care. Wish I could just be okay with it and skip this whole grief cycle! And I don’t even know if it’s happening yet! But it just feels like it’s coming…

God, I didn’t intend for that last part. Feel free to retract all comments about how well I’m handling this ;)
 
Hi Ian,
Have just replied to your PM. Hang on in there buddy. It is a hard decision to make- it's taken me up until this week to accept that although I don't look unwell, I AM!
I see my gastro on Weds and will consent to the colectomy then. I know you're younger than me, and it seems scary (trust me I've cried buckets), but just having made the decision to go for it has brought some huge relief. Yes, it's going to be a big adjustment, but my life will be mine again. I can and will take control back over my dysfunctional colon- it's being retired early!!
Really hoping that Inflix works for you 2nd time round- will be here for you regardless!
xx
 
Awww Ian, just like Amy, I want to give you big hugs too :hug:

I think you are very brave :)

I'm hoping for the best for you hunny. Fingers crossed!!!!

Love & hugs

Paula
x
 
I too have Crohn's Colitis.

I went on and off Remicade 3 times before it began to fail. At the time it was my doctor's recommendation not to stay on it. In hindsight it was probably the wrong thing to do; as it no longer works for me.

If you are OK with it, I would recommend trying to stay on it. By the third time they had to double my dose to get it to do anything at all.

*I have a question. Can you elaborate as to what the doctor's are 'seeing' that they feel surgery is necessary if the Remicade doesn't work out? Are you losing a lot of blood twice a day? Is your condition that much worse without Pred.?

My thoughts are with you, and lets hope the Remicade whips you back to remission.
 
Hi JJOM,

I don't think the amount of blood I'm losing is that much - it can look a lot, but obviously as I only go to the toilet twice a day, it has many hours to collect inside before I expel it, which explains the quantity. If I end up having another b/m soon after the initial bloody one, there's often hardly any blood at all. But I am slowly but surely becoming aneamic, despite being on iron supplements (2 tablets per day). I won't be able to keep this up forever.

And yeah there was more bleeding before I started the Pred. Now that I'm being forced to wean off, I expect the bleeding to increase, and for my general health to decline.

I would be over the moon if the Remicade worked a second time, but it just feels like I've lost the battle (after just 6 years). Nothing else has worked, and I don't think Remicade will either - I just imagine the damage is too far gone to come back from.
 
Dear Ian,
Being stoic is one thing, pretending to be stoic is completely another. You never have to be ashamed, or embarrassed to write what you really feel/think/wish here! NEVER! Cry all you want, it is your body & your right: you are going through a grief process. Being a girl, I have never held back on my tears but I am of the impression that guys think it is "wussy". Ha! Another thing we girls have up on you all!
Seriously, you so have your head together. You can let it go to pieces once in awhile! We all do.
As for what you are putting others through? I know, without a shadow of a doubt, that they would much rather be walking through fire WITH you, than to be without you. I waited a long time before adopting my daughter (she was older, I was older) so I know how your mom feels about you...you were worth the wait! She feels helpless that's all. As a mom she wants to take all your pain away & fix everything & she can't this time. "Thems is the breaks of loving".
Good luck & remember what I said about the crying bit, okay? Doesn't make you less to feel fear.
Michele
 
Ian, obviously I have no personal experience but I work with a guy who has a perm. stoma due to colitis. Before he got it, he was in and out of the hospital often. This was long before my son's dx so I was clueless what he was going through. After his stoma, he is absolutely one of the happiest people I know. If you do have to go that route, try to be positive.

BTW, like Michelle says ^^^, after EJ's dx, I sat and cried once (after everyone had left home one day :))!! It was probably the first real cry I'd had in my adult life. Wow, it really is liberating. I know my twisted gut feelings are probably nothing comparably but letting those emotions run their course is great medicine!!
 
Oh my Ian, re read your posts and then tell me that you aren't mature! You are one very together young man and that is why your Mum is crying bucket loads mate.....you are son to be very proud of. As a Mum of CD kids I can tell you now that you are NOT making your Mum's life hell. Sure it is heartbreaking beyond belief to see your child suffer the way you are Ian and it is hard but seeing my own children and the hurdles they have faced and continue to face only makes me even more awe struck and proud of what they achieve in life.

With such difficult decisions to make Ian do you think seeking other opinions will help the process. Will the opinions of two or three top GI's and colorectal surgeons clarify for you what your options are. At least if they are all of the same opinion, no matter how undesirable, you aren't then left guessing with what if's.

Dusty. :hug:
 
Hey Ian, sucks that things might come to that but you seem to be in the best mindset someone could possibly be in. I remember before I went into surgery they said I might wake up with one the uncertainty is horrible, I was just crying and crying. So do you think if they could do a resection and get better, you might look into stem cell treatment? I'm in the same thinking as you I would rather have two surgeries in the hope that the first might give me the breathing space to try more treatments, screw the surgeons if they only want to do one lol Fingers crossed remicade helps x
 
Ian, I'm hoping for the very best for you! I hope you dont need a stoma at this point. But if you do, as you can see you will get plenty of help and support here. Good luck to you and sending huge cyber huuuggggggggggssss!
Misty
 
Thank you so much everyone, you're all amazing :)

To clarify on the Remi, we apparently can't look into until I start to show a decline. Not really sure why, maybe because I'm currently stable (i.e. not getting worse) and on Humira, so they can't justify the prescription change until *I* change? But I fear that once I start going downhill, it will be too rapid and by the time they sort the Remi out I'll already be on the operating table. I know Remi is a long shot, I don't expect it to work, but it doesn't feel like they want to HELP me get out of this. I know I can't stay on Pred forever but I've only been on 40mg for a month - it seems like they want me to get worse so I'm forced to succumb to surgery. I feel like I fell between the cracks 'cause my GI was away on holiday - one doc did my flexi-sig (told me worst case scenario was a resection - ****), another did my follow up appointment. I have barely seen MY doc through all of this, which seems unfair.

I have no problem showing my emotions. I'm not remotely manly, I'm a total girl. Anyone seen the season 2 finale of Grey's Anatomy? Cried my bloody eyes out! (in private of course lol). But when it breaks someone elses heart to see me upset, I just lose it. The only times I really recall seeing my mum cry before this were when my dad left and when her mum died. Kind of hammers home how awful this is.

Claire I'm not sure about the stem cell trial - I don't think I'd ultimately have the time, think I'd deteriorate and need surgery before anything started (if I even got accepted). DEFINTIELY if I was selected for the delayed group! Just out of interest how did you go about getting an appointment? Did you just drop him an email or did your hospital have to have some involvement?
 
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Ian,
I get it. It does tear me up too when I see others (husband, my mother) torn to bits over my crap (pun intended).
Guys, did not mean to imply because you pee standing up that you were not allowed to cry, just that society frowns on it. I say give society the bird, but that is me & how I live my limited life!
Ian, why are they pulling pred so soon? (no rock throwing please). Is your blood sugar up, or your blood pressure or anything else? You say you have been on it only a month. Is that the onlyntime you have been on it? I am trying to understand is all. I guess I shouldn't try to get into a doctors head!
Michele
 
Hi Ian, it's okay to cry. Real men do it. You are in my thoughts and prayers buddy!
 
Yeah Ian when I was in a flare I remember crying at Lost, Glee, Lord of the Rings and X Factor (That was a bad one lol)

Well I emailed Nottingham and they sent me the criteria list and spoke with my consultant before, but I lucked out in the fact that one of the GI's at my hosp has been involved in the trial and he was the one looking after me during my flare/surgery etc in 09/10, so I'm meeting with him.
 

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