Falling apart....

[Lisa]

falling apart....

well -this is probably the only place I can talk about this, as my husband doesn't come on here...

We have been having some problems on and off, nothing that I didn't think we could work through. Huisband has been getting more and more unhappy, doesn't like living where we are, he doesn't have friends here (and refuses to try to make any)....doesn't like my horses (which I had before meeting him).....and has been having more and more problems with his temper...nothing that makes me feel unsafe- he is more likely to hurt himself when having a rage fit.....

Anyway - we went to a marraige counselor on Friday, and were reserving judgement on her.....have another appointment for a couple of weeks from now...

I mentioned the horses - these have been a bone of contention in the past - although I do a LOT LESS with them than I have in the past - instead spending time with family etc.....They have gotten out now and again, but I have been improving the fences etc.....I do usually let them out in a small area to eat down grass, with just a single strand of electric tape to hold them in.

Well, this afternoon after getting back from my ride (I took today off from work as a 'me' day,.....I let the 3 out to graze while I helped my husband work on the lawnmower. We were unable to fix it, so I hooked up the horse trailer quickly and took the mower down to the rapair shop before they closed.....and forgot to lock the horses back up...

Guess what? Something happened and they took the fence down and got out....now husband has demanded a choice - him or the horses.....and he has decided I have chosen the horses (which I haven't - I told him it is an impossible choice)....he says he doesn't want to be held liable if someone hits one and is injured.....

He is heading out of town for work tomorrow, and has told me he is going to look for a place to live in his hometown (75 miles away) when he gets back.....I honestly didnt' think he would get to this - and I'm trying to figure things out.....not just the matter of him moving out, but our home, daughter etc.....I want to try to work on things, but the ultimatum he gave isn't something that I can just say 'ok, horses are gone tomorrow'.....they are a big part of my life, and have been for over 20 years.....

 

[Dexky]

Wow Paso, I wouldn't dare try to advise you here! That's tough! Is he refusing to go back to the counselor?

 

[DMS]

I'm feeling very badly for you Paso. I thank God for my husband and my horses daily (usually in that order), my hubby is also not a "horse person" but even he admits I'm a better person for my family when I've got horses in my life.
I really hope that he goes back to a counsellor with you because it sounds as though there's more going on than just the horses issue, they are just what he's choosing to take a stand on. Also, I think that moving back to his hometown should be a mutual decision, it sounds very unfair of him to issue an ultimatum like that.

With the horses, is it possible to compromise? Downsize to 1 horse plus an older companion horse, or a mini, or a goat (don't laugh, lots of people around here have goats as a companion animal - or llamas). That way he can see that you're serious about the marriage, but he's also got to meet you 1/2 way. Also, by selling 2 horses you'd hopefully make enough to purchase some decent fencing and gates, that way your horses wouldn't be out where there is a liability issue.
Personally I think it's healthy to have seperate interests, I don't quad much with my hubby, and he doesn't ride with me, but we have lots to talk about because we do different things (we've been married 21 years).

Good luck to you, I hope things go smoothly when he comes home.

 

[AndiGirl]

I feel that I can't give any advice, but I just want you to know that I'm thinking of you. I feel bad about the situation. I hope you two can come to a compromise that will be fair to both of you.

 

[Astra]

I can't give you much advise neither Lisa.
Only to sit down with him and talk it through, negotiate, compromise or ask a trusted friend to mediate.
I believe there's more to it than just the horses.
I once had a conversation with my sister who has 3 horses and she said she'd never choose her hubby over her horses! They are her life.
Has he got any interests and hobbies? Like DMS said, It's good to have separate interests.
Hope you get this sorted, it can't be good for your own well being and health.
good luck
xxx

 

[DustyKat]

Oh my paso, I am so sad to hear that you are going through this.

I agree with what has been said about the horses, it is a convenient excuse for his actions. I'm not suggesting he doesn't have issues with them but not to the point of it's me or them without further discussion or compromise being entered into.

There is obviously something going on within himself as you have witnessed with his behaviour and moods. I dare say you will bear the brunt of it as you are his comfort zone. Is it your relationship alone or could he be depressed?

I hope more than anything you can get things sorted and also that the stress of this doesn't become too much for you...:hug:

Much love, :heart:
Dusty. xxxxxxxx

 

[scottmyster]

HI Paso, i feel like the others feel, i don't much advice to give you. but it seems to me that the horse don't play a part in this situation it as to be another issue he is going through at the moment. i don't know if he will attend the counsellor meeting because it could be a good be a good way for him to vent his frustrations and see what is the real problem . Like i said it must be a underlying problem he has to be acting this way.You just up and leave after 21 years of marriage. i hope things work out for you. best wishes.

scott

 

[Lisa]

Thanks all...we have had some issues on and off - mainly that I don't do things the way he does them (of course if I try to do something my way it is 'wrong' - or just not 'right') - and I am supposed to do everything his way...such as folding clohes, loading the dishwasher...trivial stuff.....

I'm not sure when the horses got out last - but it was months ago, if not in the winter.....his 'concern' is that if they get out and someone gets into an accident because of them, he will lose everything - and he isn't willing to risk that. The only reason they got out yesterday was that (stupid) me didn't put them back in the permanent fence before leaving to take the mower to the repair shop.

He admits he has issues - and says he can't change - as well as I can't change...granted, there are certain things that are ingrained....

We don't have big blow-out fights, in fact last night he was very calm...too calm almost - and told me he is 'OK' with my decision - that I chose the horses over him. I tried to tell him it wasn't that I made a choice - but he seemed to make on for me - since I didn't immediately say I was getting rid of the horses....

DMS - I 'only' have the 3 - and if I had a good, loving home for Sara I would send her there - I've only had her for not quite 2 years, and don't have the attachment that I have for the other 2 (Marci and son BB) who were both born here.

I don't think that would solve things though - I do have use of my mothers' pasture, but again, it isn't 'getting rid' of the horses....

When we were at the counselors, she mentioned that we need to do what makes US happy - not trying to make other people happy.....I think Michael took that the wrong way - he seems to think she was saying that we should not care about anyone else but our self.....I think that we need to take care of #1 first - but also keep others in mind.

He also cannot let things 'go'.....if I do something wrong - he will bring it up again if I do the same thing - even if it is a year later!

I know that I will (eventually)be ok - I am more concerned about our daughter though....she doesn't know all this is going on - and my husband is heading out of town for 3 days again today, we will see what happens when he gets back.....

 

[Jessi]

Maybe a little time away will do him some good. Perhaps it will be the time he needs to really sort out his feelings. And hopefully, it will come to some good, in the end.

I don't understand horses, but I understand having a passion for something. My passion is children. If my husband ever asked me to give up my passion, he would be asking me to give up on my own children over him. It doesn't make any sense in my situation, so why should it be any different in yours?! If you give up your horses, my guess is that you'd be giving up a huge piece of your heart. Then what kind of wife and mother would you be? You would be almost non-existent, right?!

It seems as though he is not making the decision FOR YOU, but rather using you as a disguise for a decision that HE is making. I could be wrong, and I hope that I am, but it seems like he may be giving up, and wants to blame you for his problems.

Please forgive me if I am overstepping my boundaries. I hate divorce. It's ugly for everyone involved, especially the children, but you can't be expected to give up an enormous source of your happiness.

I am so sorry that you have to go through this. I know all too well of the pains that you must be feeling. You are in my prayers. Your whole family and your horses are in my prayers.

Lots of love! :hug:

 

[DMS]

So, I asked my husband to weigh in on the matter (right after I thanked him for not making me choose between him and my horses).

He asked how old your child was, I kind of said what does that have to do with it? His answer. . . You guys came into a relationship with the horses taking up a large part of your time and energy, you also have a job and oh, let's not forget you deal with having Crohn's as well, he can deal with all of this, add in a child that takes up another huge amount of time/energy/love and he starts feeling that there is nothing left for him.
Now this is just my hubby's opinion, but in your husband's mind if something goes there will be more time for the 2 of you - obviously your child, jobs etc can't go - what's expendable? the horses.
The fix - again coming from the non horsey husband - spend more time working on your relationship, time alone together, do little things to put him first and he'll be fine with the fact that you have horses as well.

Hugs to you Paso - horse treats to your horses!
Donna

 

[DMS]

And the part where you're supposed to do all stuff his way - that's really childish - he needs to leave the room if he doesn't like the way you're doing it. This reminds me of the first few times I left my hubby home with the baby (way back when), I made a decision to not be nit picky about the diaper being too loose, or the sink full of dishes.
Yes we all have character traits - he sounds like a perfectionist - and that's fine, but he can also make the decision to not make a big deal out of every thing.
Sorry if I'm overstepping.

 

[Jessi]

Everybody has quirks, right? You must really love each other, but sometimes, when we get busy with life, we forget some of the reasons why we marry in the first place, and the only things we can see are the things that bug us so much! See if you can't convince him to date you again, if you're not already doing that. It doesn't have to cost much or anything at all, but try to go out at least once a month. My husband courts me once a week. If we can't leave the house (due to a bad flare or whatever), we start the date as soon as the kids are in bed.

My heart is extremely heavy for the both of you, and I really hope this gets sorted out. Just remember that it takes time. Family is ALWAYS about time.

 

[Lisa]

Our daughter is 6 - I was actually pregnant when we married - although when he proposed to me (at a horse show as I came out of the ring!) we didn't know that.....he does say that if it wasn't for her, we probably would not have stayed together this long - or gotten married when we did (he said he was planning on a long engagement).....

I actually spend a lot LESS time with the horses than I used to - I don't travel to shows (except 1 local one that is 20 minutes away)...and in the last couple years I haven't even taken a horse with me - I've borrowed one for Tori to ride.

We have tried to make more time for 'us' - in fact we had a friend offer to watch Tori next week so we could go to the movies - which is now cancelled per husband. We have gone to 2 concerts this summer too - meeting up with friends while Mom watched Tori.

He did tell me last night that if I did give up the horses (something I have been mulling over - but can't just get rid of htem all) he knows I would come to resent that later on - and he is right.....to me it isn't a fair choice to have me make.....I've been thinking about this today - what if I told him he has to stop going back to his home town to visit with friends 'just in case' he gets into an accident.....I honestly think that there is more of a chance of that happening (75 miles one way) than my horses being out...but I would never tell him he had to give that up.....

Here is a breakdown of a typical work day -

I'mup around 6am, get daughter up by 630 and out the door about 7am - husband is usually still in bed or in the shower.

Work all day, we do talk on the phone, occasionally meet up for lunch (if we are both in town for work).....

I head home, get daughter from daycare first....make dinner, sit and watch TV - husband is usually on the computer. He doesn't like to go outside and do anything, we put horseshoe pits in a few weeks ago (for him) and have used them 3 times I think.....

Weekends are usually spent puttering around the house, doing laundry, the only times I have been able to get out riding are when I took a day off from work (or had a week day off).....

I ask about going places, meeting people - he isn't interested.....says he isn't any good at making friends, I think he doesn't like being out of his comfort area - whichi s his home town. He never lived anywhere else before moving to where we are - I think that is part of it too - he says he thought he could handle it, but has decided he can't.

I don't like saying it is all him - but I think 90% of it is.....yes, I have things that I could do better - but nothing that I have seen that would warrant screwing up 3 lives by separating or divorce.....

 

[Crohns08]

I don't know how old you guys are, but maybe he is going through a midlife crisis? It could be something worth considering I think if he's all of a sudden acting irratic and unlike himself. It was the first thing that jumped to my mind when reading this thread.

 

[Terriernut]

Paso, I'm very sorry to hear all of this. But, you may never speak to me again after my reply.

You and your horses are a 'package deal' and I believe your husband was well aware of that at the time he married you yes? They are 'family'.

I dont think this is about your horses whatsoever. I believe this is about control and power in the relationship. I would think your husband probably likes to exert control in alot of things, and not just about this. If I am wrong, please tell me so. I was married to a person like this. Nothing was ever going to be right no matter what changes I made. I finally decided I wasnt the one with the problem, HE was. And it took 4 psychologists to inform me I was right about that after they met with him.

You cant work out problems with a person who has control issues. Whatever occurs, it will always be your fault, and your problem, and never theirs. If you look and see that this is a pattern...beware. Fault finding, nick picking, moodiness, keeping you isolated and alone, bullying. If you see this...dont let the door hit him where the good lord split him honey!
My heartfelt hugs are heading your way!

 

[Lisa]

I'm kind of wondering that myself Toni - or, if he is expecting things to fall apart, as his other marriages have (I am his 3rd wife).....and that is projecting through.....

Something else that came to mind - he has mentioned that the house is 'cluttered' an I have a lot of 'stuff'...yes, I admit that, but I am anything but a hoarder etc...the 'stuff' I have is mostly collectibles, and a lot is actually packed away. I buy/sell on ebay and also have a side business dealing in antiques and collectibles - mostly 'smalls'...so I have inventory in the basement.....

I have actually been going through things and getting rid of a couple of boxes each week - sorting through, putting things out for free, then taking leftovers to the dump.....now the other nght while we were eating dinner, I think, he mentioned that he wanted to get rid of the 2 pier cabinets that are on either side of the TV in the living room.....which would leave a 42 inch TV on a stand/cabinet with a 10 foot empty wall behind.....not sure where exactly that came from.....he also mentioned only having 'stuff' in one cabinet instead of at different locations.....not something that he has been pressing for - but kind of strikes me as not quite right???.....

Crap - time to head home.....thanks all for the input and support!

 

[Lisa]

Paso, I'm very sorry to hear all of this. But, you may never speak to me again after my reply.

You and your horses are a 'package deal' and I believe your husband was well aware of that at the time he married you yes? They are 'family'.

I dont think this is about your horses whatsoever. I believe this is about control and power in the relationship. I would think your husband probably likes to exert control in alot of things, and not just about this.

I'll still speak to you! :hug:

In all honesty - I have been kind of thinking along the same lines.....he and I are both 'A' type personalities - as he likes to say too - we are very independant, and have or own way of doing things, and our own thoughts etc.....he doesn't see it as wanting/needing control - I almost think that it ispartly ecause of his past relationships that he has the need for this.....ALSO the way he was brought up - I'll get into more of that another post....

 

[DMS]

you need a vacation - come to BC, you can stay in the 5th wheel for 2 weeks, we'll pick a new trail to ride every day and I'll even cook dinner for you. Oh, bring your daughter too - my youngest is 7 - they'll have a blast together and when we ride I've got 2 older kids that will babysit.

It really sounds like you've gone out of your way to make the marriage work - it's his turn now, and if he's not willing - well refer back to Terriernut's post.

 

[tiloah]

Oh honey. I wish I had an easy answer for you. Instead I have some across the internet hugs and an offer of support. I'm here for you whatever you need. Take care.

 

[DustyKat]

Oh hell paso! I'm with Joan on this...3rd wife.

Since he is the only common denominator in all of the relationships well, it speaks volumes. He can't hack it any more but rather than step up to the plate and admit it he is going to make you the excuse for his own shortcomings...it wasn't my fault she had horses, it wasn't my fault she didn't stack the dishwasher properly, it wasn't my fault she had too many nick nacks...blah, blah, blah.

I just hope that this doesn't impact too harshly on you and your daughter...:hug:

Much love, :heart:
Dusty. xxxxxxxx

 

[Goldfish]

HI Paso, hope you are doing OK. I agree with the control thing and definitely dont think its about the horses. I wonder why his other 2 marriages broke up? I dont actually need an answer on that but you might see a link with where he is going with this issue. Were there similarities from the last marriages and how he is acting now?
My husband doesn't much like mixing either but he will make an effort for me and he encourages me to be involved in things I love because it makes me happy. I dont know Paso it seems a bit odd i think. I'd love to find the real issue, as would you I'm sure. Best of luck, I will be thinking of you

 

[Lisa]

He married for the first time at 21 - lasted 2 years - I actually know her.....they fought, and admit they married too young....

He was married to #2 for 8 years - that broke up when she wanted to go out more (he worked nights) - and she started messing around on him.....actaully was sleeping with another guy.

We don't have those issues - but he does bring up the exes quite a bit - and I ahve mentioned that to him.....he ~says~ he doesn't compare, and I am so much better than the first 2.....

He also says he loves, me, but doesn't like me much lately.....he was actually going to sleep on the sofa last night after our talk - and it was a VERY calm talk (with me crying a lot).....he ended up sleeping in the bedroom with me....

In many ways we get along really well - it has become the day-to-day house living where the problem is. I don't want to just give up - when I entered this marriage I told him - 'Divorce is not an option - death is'.......and I meant it!.....

His parents do not have the greatest of marriages - in fact I see more and more of his father in him - the outbursts, complaining.....BUT - they have been married for 50 years now.....

I wish I could get him to see someone - we do have the 2nd counselor appointment, but I am thinking maybe he needs to 'vent' by himself to someone - other than to his friends, who probably know more than I do at this point.

sigh.......it is going to be a really ****** week......we have a BBQ at the house on Saturday, then going to his sisters house for a BBQ Sunday to see our new great-nephew (the one who was a preemie and is now doing awesome!).....

Not sure how much he has talked to his sister or parents either - he did say that they would end up hating him (I don't think so - disappointed maybe) - and also that my parents would end up the same way....again, I don't think so.....it isn't as if he has done something 'wrong' such as sleeping around.....

He has also been spending a lot more time with his friends back 'home'...thinking maybe that has opened his eyes to being more unhappy too? He might be missing that.....I've tried to be patient, not sure how much I'll be able to take.....and I'm not a quitter, another 'problem'.......sigh.....

 

[Jessi]

Oh, girl, I am so sorry about your pain. This is worse than any disease!

 

[AndiGirl]

:hug::hug:The only thing that I can do is send you my love. You'll be in my prayers. Heartaches are the worst.

 

[Goldfish]

I do think you are doing great Paso and from the sounds of it he does love you which is wonderful. Have you suggested that he go to someone on his own to talk it through. I'm not sure venting to friends is necessarily the best option because your friends stick up for you and only really hear one side of the story. Not trying to be funny but of course that is what we are all doing for you and delighted to be there for you. If you tell him (and maybe you have) that you are happy for him to see a Councillor and discuss it on his own so that he may say what he likes without hurting you then he will not only have the opportunity for venting but if the Councillor thinks his mindset is wrong they will just tell him and he cant say that it is just your opinion. Bit of a waffle I'm afraid but hope that makes sense and is helpful. What do you think?

 

[Lisa]

I am going to try to sit down with him either tonight or this weekend and have a talk with him.....I've decided that he really needs to COMPROMISE - NOT issue ultimatums as he has been doing....

What I have come up with as far as the horses (the catalyst to the issues right now)....

1 - I will NOT set up any temporary fencing to let them graze down an area of grass (what they got out of this last time)

2 - I will work on reinforcing the existing fence from a 2 strand electric to a 3 strand - this will entail work, and will not happen overnight.

3 - When we (or I) go away for more than 24 hours, they will go down to my Mothers' farm where they will be behind electric fence, with fields between them and any roads.

4 - I want to install a secondary fence across the front of the property - but that will take some planning as it has to look nice too - this will actually serve 2 functions - help keep any children from getting too close to the road too - I am thinking a post/rail fence or something similar.....

The horses have NOT been getting out of the permanent fence - the last time they did (back in January?), it was due to one of them physically pulling a 10 foot steel panel open (which wasn't tied or braced) - that gets tied with a rope since then.

I know this won't solve everything - but it should be a start.....

 

[LOSTnut]

...and he can help with some of the things if he is really interested in keeping the marriage going.

Good luck with the talk, I keep my fingers crossed for you that he will be open to your suggestions.

Hugs!

 

[tiloah]

I hope he understands what an effort you're making. I know we can't glean your entire situation from your posts, but it sounds like calling it quits is just kind of what he expects to happen once the going gets tough. You need to remind him that you both wanted to be in this for life and that it's worth working through. It also sounds like he's obstacle building and like others said, trying to find reasons to "blame" you for it not working.

To be honest though if I was given a choice between horses that love me unconditionally and a husband that gives me ultimatums... well I know which I would choose!

I hope you guys work through this and get the best possible outcome.

 

[xJillx]

Just catching up with this thread now.

Paso - Remember COMPROMISE is a two way street. It sounds like you are doing A LOT more compromising than your husband. Unfortunately, it doesn't sound like he is too willing to put forth any effort. And based on this and his actions, I agree with Toni's theory of a mid-life crisis or even perhaps depression. The signs are there - not wanting to socialize, projecting, and wanting to just give up. I really hope you can get him to agree to speak with someone.

Marriage isn't easy. I think anyone who is married can agree. I have been married for 4 years (we've been together for a total of 12 years), and the daily grind can really takes its toll. It takes effort to make it work, and I sure hope you two can work it out!

 

[Goldfish]

Best of luck with the chat. I agree with Jill about it being a two way thing. You could remind him of things he does that you cant stand but have to put up with. I sure you can think of somethings. Ultimatums might be one! Still I hope he does come up trumps for you and makes an effort. Please dont think that I want things to fall apart but remember its not always up to you to fix things. After a while that wears you down and it could (and given too much hassle, "should") be you giving up.

 

[Lisa]

well - so far the weekend has been pretty good.....haven't had the 'chat' yet - but he did get a bit of a dressing down from a good friend last night for how he has treated me (last night specifically with some comments) - he apoligized this morning for that - and hinestly I hadn't taken notice of the comments....

Anyway - we have bigger things going on right now with all the flooding in the area, and he has to leave early in the morning for work.....

Off to check in on the hurricane thread if I can find it!

 

[Silvermoon]

Well, Lisa, I have to say I agree with most of the others - and I think you realize it yourself. However, as Woody Allen once said, "The heart wants what it wants; there is no logic in this".

I think all of us can agree that what our brain tells us to do and what our heart tells us to do are two totally different things. In my mind, anyone that would ask you to "choose" something over them does not love YOU for WHO YOU ARE....

It definitely sounds like HE has issues, but it is going to be up to him to aknowledge and deal with those issues - just like he can't make you change without your willingness, you can't make him change either. As for the little stuff (the dishes, the laundry, etc), well that is just childish on his part. I would tell him if he doesn't like how you launder his clothes he can do his own damn clothes!!! (Dishes are another story, as I imagine if you don't do them, "right or wrong" way, they probably don't get done).

As others have said, as for the horses, they were around before he was! He proposed to you at a horse show for goodness sake! He must have known horses were a big part of your life!!

I have never had to do it, and I hope I never have to, but sometimes: "if you love something, set it free...." I have heard lots of couples give the excuse to stay together for the kids, but coming from a family that did just that, the kids will tell you that, in the long run, they would rather both parents be happy than "together".

And all my words don't mean a hill of beans when your heart is hurting. The only thing I can do for you then is to say "I am here, like the rest, to listen when you need to vent."

Much love and heart felt hugs.....

 

[Jessica]

Just came across this thread... I'm so sorry for what you're having to deal with. Advice isn't coming to mind, as I haven't been married before. I'm in a four year relationship, and that's about it.

I really wish you the best of luck. As previously said, love is not logical. But if mine gave me an ultimatum, I'd be gone. That would mean he could live without me. End of story. He feels the same towards me, as he listed it in the beginning as a dealbreaker. No matter the reason. Everyone is different though, and all situations are not the same.

Umm.. oh, my accounting head picked this out. You mentioned he's affraid of liability from the horses getting out and causing trouble (accidents and whatnot). Is there any type of insurance that is available? Or would it be covered by your Homeowner's?

Please keep us updated. <3

 

[RFarmer]

Aww Paso That sounds absolutely awful. I'm no marriage counselor, but I think it's important to remember that although you are responsible for your horses, your husband shouldn't resent you/them if you're passionate about it. If he loves you, he should support what you enjoy. Not threaten choices.