Lymph nodes

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Mylittlesunshine

Mylittlesunshine

Joined
Dec 31, 2012
Messages
464
Hi everyone
Does anyone have any information
On lymph nodes in small bowel
And colon.
Is it normal for them to be present
And big.
Where should u find them.
How big should they normally be?
Really need advice.
Will update my daughters story thread soon
Just need to get information and thought first
Thanks
 
Lymphoid follicles are right under the outer mucosa in the intestine, you can see them in a colonoscopy sometimes. There's lymphatic drainage issues in crohn's disease too, they don't really know why. It's normal that they are present, they're part of the human body, it's when they "pop" out in a pattern in the intestine that it's not normal.

Why are you asking all of that btw, what tests did you do.
 
My daughter had scopes done
The GI came out and showed me
Pictures of small bowel and colon
And colon wall full of lympth nodes
Big swollen and red.
 
15nxch1.jpg


that's a lymphoid follicle
 
They're early diagnosis signs though, she just got sick recently?
 
outwards symptoms? a bit of pain I would guess, since they're transmural, mucosal inflammation like in UC tends to involve less pain since there's less nerves there, I don't want to guess stuff like that though
 
I had colon cancer. When they remove it they take it in a field with clear margins each side of the cancer. They take the colon and all the connective tissue that includes blood supply and regional lymph nodes(they refer to it as the flange) I lost around thirteen inches and and thirteen regional lymph nodes six of which were cancerous. If the cancer gets to the bottom of the flange it is really hard to detect in the fatty tissue. The good part about the colon lymph nodes is that they are regional and not systemic and losing them rarely leads to lymphodeema.Sounds like the inflamation is stirring up your daughters nodes. I hope It settles quickly for her,Hugs Ron.
 
GI said he couldn't see inflammation
I asked him what could cause this
Reply was possible allergy?
And could be normal
But he didn't want to put a cause yet
Till biopsys come back
Usually 3 weeks but he said will have them
Next week .
 
I would not worry about cancer, there are a million and one reasons why lymph nodes swell.
 
It would be great to find that all her symptoms could be put down to an allergy. Good luck!!
 
I hope so but not sure, I asked the GI
What percentage would he put it down
To allergy he said 25%
I'm so worried he wouldn't give me proper
Answers , I wanted to know if it wasn't allergy
What could it be , he said the biopsy will
Show what the naked eye can't see x
He also said that cos he couldn't see inflammation
Doesn't mean it isn't present.
I'm so confused.
 
I think David and several others could elaborate on the possibilities of invisible inflammation. I think his dx is Lymphocytic colitis or something like that. You could do a search up top. It would definitely be something to research that may point you in the right direction.
 
I'm glad she came through, ok.
Grace had CLEAR scopes!!!!! Clear as in no visible inflammation.
However, on the microscopic level it was really different.
She has more problems, than meant the eye.

Something IS happening in her colon.
You are right to be pushing for answers and the scopes prove it!
The biopsies will give the clear picture. Keep in mind the scopes can only see so far.
Their's still small intestines that only a MRE and pill camera can see.

HUGS
 
Mylittlesunshine said:
Has any of your kids had colonoscopy
That showed big swollen lymth nodes
And have crohns or UC
Click to expand...




Tagging in........................

DustyKat, Sacot, my little penguin, Tesscorm, crohnsinct, Twiggy930, Cathrine, Patrica59, muppet, Johnnysmom, EthanClark or anyone.

This is Batman...calling Robin:rof:
 
Holy poopy mess Batman!!! My little Sunshine-Clark has visible inflammation with ulcerations from his esophogus to his anus, inlcuding an anal fissure. He only had upper and lower endoscopies so some of the small bowel wasn't seen but I didn't notice any lymph nodes. Our GI didn't mention any either so I am assuming that he didn't have any. I am sorry I wasn't more help. Good Luck with your little one :hug:
 
Our GI didn't happen to mention lymph nodes but he is a man of few words and I am on a need to know basis. I think at the beginning he tried to give me minimal info to help with processing. He also didn't say rectal and stomach inflammation until months later so who knows.

I hope it isn't anything too troubling.
 
Stephen's ultrasounds and MREs have mentioned lymph nodes; it says "slightly prominent and enhancing lymph nodes, likely reactive in nature". Sorry, don't know what this means, assumed it just related to the inflammation and as GI never brought it up, I didn't worry about it. But, hmmm... I will ask about it...
 
Andrew never had the lymph nodes showing up. As far as I'm aware the lymph nodes are like a filter system for the body - they try to remove any infections no matter where they are. There must be something in her body that the lymph nodes are trying to fight, but don't know if it would point anywhere specific.
 
No swollen lymph nodes on DS 's scope
He first scope looked good visually but had lots of inflammation microscopically.
 
Lymph nodes aren't seen on endoscopy but nodular lymphoid hyperplasia can be seen.

Many children show prominent ‘nodular lymphoid hyperplasia’ that is considered normal in the small bowel especially, I believe. If the endoscoper was a pediatric GI, s/he would know what's normal in a 4 year old. However, an adult gi might not.

See if you can read the section on this google book on lymphonodular hyperplasia in this 2011 pediatric book.
http://books.google.com/books?id=FE...ract colon small intestine pediatrics&f=false

I couldn't copy it.... but it said it was benign, no specific therapy and excellent prognosis.
 
Sarah that what was called retroperitoneal and mosenteric adenopthy which i told is swollen lymph nodes. This quite common in children but not so common in older teenagers and much less common in adults.
 
The only mention of lymph nodes for my children was their surgical pathology.

Lymph nodes are found throughout the body and are a part of the immune system so if infection is present they may be swollen.

Lymph nodes are also found along the length of the bowel and are often found grouped together. A condition called Mesenteric Adenitis is seen in children and is often mistaken for appendicitis however Mesenteric Adenitis is normally a mild condition of short duration that resolves on its own with no treatment required.

If there is Crohn's located in the terminal ileum it would not be unusual on pathology to see swollen lymph nodes as not only is inflammation present but once the mucosal barrier is breached the very nature of the bowel's function would mean that some degree of infection will very likely be present.

Dusty. xxx
 
Gabrielle had a bunch of lymph nodes show up on her CT scan and MRE reports , and I was told that is normal with Crohn's.

However, JJ had some removed and biopsied when he had his appendix removed and they were related to the infection around his appendix.
 
Johnny's scope mentioned "a lymphoid nodule which contains a granduloma" that was the closest I could find to lymph node.

His CT scan before diagnosis did say he had swollen lymph nodes in the mesentery. "Enlarged mesenteric lymph nodes, compatible with a nonspecific mesenteric adenitis."

Hope that helps. I sympathize with trying to make sense of these records. I am constantly looking things up!
 
I think people are using follicles and nodes interchangeably. Many people call the follicles nodes or nodules, they're also part of the lymph nodes and lymphatic system.

Some people call the follicles peyer’s patches, I think with that word there is no confusion.

These are the follicles you can see on colonoscopies, they're all the red round connected circles, if they're active and inflamed they will bulge and become red like an aphthae in your mouth.

People care about them because there's still confusion about how crohn works, crohn's disease involves lymphatic drainage issues, lymphangitis, in some people there is lymph node infection, they don't really know where the inflammation starts first, deep in a transmural way across the intestine or the other way around, in the mucus layer where bacteria have contact with the intestine. The first clinical signs of crohn's disease is inflammation of those follicles, maybe breach of the mucus layer is a late secondary event (unlike in UC which isn't transmural (all the way accross) like CD is )

There's many studies that focus on the interaction between the mucus barrier and the intestinal microflora, but in MRI and on CT and colonoscopies they see granuloma lymphangitis.

2dtdx13.jpg
 
Last edited:
Johnnysmom said:
Johnny's scope mentioned "a lymphoid nodule which contains a granduloma" that was the closest I could find to lymph node.
Click to expand...

right, that's the granulomatous lymphangitis

All the billions spent on trying to discover how the microbiome works can be a bit frustrating when the first clinical symptoms of crohn's disease, which are lymphangitis and inflammation of lymphatic follicles, have likely nothing to do with the human microbiome.
 
it's unsharp, think you are too worried maybe that it is something bad

to me it looks like lymphoid hyperplasia
 
Well you can tell it's bumpy. Remember the microscopic level will tell the story also.

Where was this taken? That's doesn't look like kiny pic BUT maybe it might be.

I don't know if Dusty, David or Aussie can help here?

How is your girl feeling?
 
It's the colon had to reduce the size of
Pic to upload it.
To the right it is red and u see the bumps
Through the colon .
Thanks everyone
 
pic of lymphoid hyperplasia, it looks like that to me, but I just say it because I think you worry, it does not look bad to me

11vqyjn.jpg
 
Could it be this?

"Lymphonodular hyperplasia (LNH) of the gastrointestinal (GI) tract is a frequently observed in the terminal ileum and colon in children undergoing endoscopic evaluation. "
......NH is a common cause of rectal bleeding in young children and most patients have no long term sequelae.

http://journals.lww.com/jpgn/Fullte...ular_Hyperplasia__A_Common_Cause_of.1009.aspx


This is what I mentioned in my earlier post. The 2011 book said it's common in early childhood, can cause diarrhea and abd pain in addition to bleeding and "no specific therapy is required and prognosis is excellent."
 

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