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Well if we get it from milk I really don't buy. I mean it does sound like it may have a case. But then why doesn't everyone have Crohn's or at least a lot more. Is it that their is something pre-programed in us that gets tiggered by something in milk that sets off the domino effect and set our Crohn's into motion? I mean hell, I don't know.... It just pisses me off that so much isn't known about Crohn's. :mad:
 
I really need to get Lucas in here on this one. Lucas is my nephew. He's been researching this very thing for 4 or 5 years, if not longer.

Let me see if I can get to him on AIM.

Be right back.
 
I totally agree but I really found it interesting too. I mean Ive heard so many things about crohns and how its caused, but this one is one ive ran in to several times so I thought id share it with everyone and see how ya'll felt about it. I mean I guess whenever they find the cause it will just lead hopefully to a faster cure so I think its good to share anything and everything no matter how stupid sounding that we find about crohns, because you never know what it could be linked too. I just thought they made some good points and actually explained why they think that maybe it could be linked to crohns.
 
Milk causes a LOT more than just Crohn's. I'm about to get up on my soap box now. First of all:

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And it just gets scarier from there. Every wonder if milk is the answer to osteoporosis, then why don't cows get osteoporosis? We're not feeding the cows milk for calcium. Nope.

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Did you know that YEARS of testing have been done on rats concerning the dangers of MILK? Did you know this has been going on for years upon years? Did you also know that the data from these tests have never been released?

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I was a skeptic too untill I started to look at the facts by reading all the info I could find. Now...I drink SOY milk!

Here are a few websites to get you started. When Lucas gets here, he can give lots more information that I can.

www.notmilk.com

http://www.milksucks.com/index2.asp

Here are just a few facts about milk to mull over:

THE ABC’s of Milk
52 good reasons to abandon milk and dairy!

A is for ALLERGIES
"In reality, cow's milk, especially processed cow's milk, has been linked to a variety of health problems, including: mucous production, hemoglobin loss, childhood diabetes, heart disease, atherosclerosis, arthritis, kidney stones, mood swings, depression, irritability, allergies..."
Townsend Medical Letter, May 1995
___________________________________

"Most formula fed infants developed symptoms of allergic rejection to cow milk proteins before one month of age. About 50-70% experienced rashes or other skin symptoms, 50-60 percent gastrointestinal symptoms, and 20-30 percent respiratory symptoms.
The recommended therapy is to avoid cow's milk."
Pediatric-Allergy-Immunology, August, 1994, 5(5 Suppl.)
___________________________________

B is for BREAST CANCER
"Human Insulin-like growth factor (IGF-I) and bovine IGF-I are identical. Both contain 0 amino acids in the identical sequence."
SCIENCE, vol. 249. August 24, 1990.
___________________________________

"IGF-I produces a 10-fold increase in RNA levels of cancer cells. IGF-I appears to be a critical component in cellular proliferation."
X.S. Li, Exp-Cell-Res., March, 1994, 211(1)
___________________________________

C is for CROHN'S DISEASE
"Mycobacterium paratuberculosis is capable of surviving commercial pasteurization."
Applied and Environmental Microbiology: 64(3), Mar 1998.
___________________________________

"Mycobacterium paratuberculosis (bacteria not killed by pasteurization) RNA was found in 100% of Crohn's disease patients, compared with 0% of controls."
D. Mishina, Proceedings National Academy of Sciences USA :93: September, 1996
___________________________________

D is for DIABETES
"The National Dairy Board's Slogan, 'Milk. It does a body good,' sounds a little hollow these days."
Scientific American, October, 1992
___________________________________

"These new studies, and more than 20 well-documented previous ones, have prompted one researcher to say the link between milk and juvenile diabetes is 'very solid'."
Diabetes Care 1994;17 (12)
___________________________________

E is for EAR INFECTIONS
"Milk allergies are very common in children... They are the leading cause of the chronic ear infections that plague up to 40% of all children under the age of six."
Julian Whitaker, M.D., "Health & Healing,"
October, 1998, Volume 8, No. 10
___________________________________

"Cow’s milk has become a point of controversy among doctors and nutritionists. There was a time when it was considered very desirable, but research has forced us to rethink this recommendation...dairy products contribute to a surprising number of health problems (including) chronic ear problems..."
Benjamin Spock, M.D., "Child Care," 7th Edition
___________________________________

F is for FAT
"Milk fat has been identified as a cholesterol-elevating fat because it contains cholesterol and is primarily saturated."
Journal of Dairy Science 1991;74 (11)
___________________________________
"Preference for a diet high in animal fat could be a pathogenic factor, and milk and high fat dairy products contribute considerably to dietary fat intake."
J. Am Coll Nutr, 2000 Apr, 19:2 Suppl
___________________________________

G is for GROWTH FACTOR
"Levels of IGF increase in milk after cows are treated with rbGH." National Institutes of Health Assessment of Bovine Somatotropin, December, 1990
___________________________________
"The insulin-like growth factor (IGF) system is widely involved in human carcinogenesis. A significant association between high circulating IGF-I concentrations and an increased risk of lung, colon, prostate and pre-menopausal breast cancer has recently been reported." International J Cancer, 2000 Aug, 87:4
___________________________________

H is for HEART DISEASE
"Milk and milk products gave the highest correlation coefficient to heart disease, while sugar, animal proteins and animal fats came in second, third, and fourth, respectively."
A Survey of Mortality Rates and Food Consumption Statistics of 24 Countries, Medical Hypothesis 7:907-918, 1981
___________________________________
"For ischemic heart disease, milk carbohydrates were found to have the highest statistical association for males aged 35+ and females aged 65+. In the case of coronary heart disease, non-fat milk was found to have the highest association for males aged 45+ and females aged 75+, while for females 65-74, milk carbohydrates and sugar had the highest associations."
Altern Med Rev, Aug, 3, 1998
___________________________________

I is for IRON DEFICIENCY
"Cow's milk can cause blood loss from the intestinal tract, which over time, reduces the body's iron stores. Blood loss may be a reaction to cow's milk proteins."
Journal of Pediatrics, 1990, 116
___________________________________
"Cow's milk-induced intestinal bleeding is a well-recognized cause of rectal bleeding in infancy. In all cases, bleeding resolved completely after instituting a cow's milk-free diet." J Pediatr Surg, 1999 Oct, 34:10
___________________________________

J is for JUVENILE ILLNESSES
"Chronic diarrhea is the most common gastrointestinal symptom of intolerance of cow's milk among children... cow's milk can also cause severe perianal lesions with pain on defecation and consequent constipation in young children. In young children, chronic constipation can be a manifestation of intolerance to cow's milk."
New England J Med, 1998 Oct, 339:16
___________________________________
"At least 50% of all children in the United States are allergic to milk, many undiagnosed. Dairy products are the leading cause of food allergy, often revealed by constipation, diarrhea, and fatigue. Many cases of asthma and sinus infections are reported to be relieved and even eliminated by cutting out dairy."
Natural Health, July, 1994, Frank Oski, M.D., Chief of Pediatrics at Johns Hopkins Medical School
___________________________________

K is for KILLER BACTERIA
"Milk from cows inoculated with listeria was pooled for 2 to 4 days and then heated at 162 degrees Fahrenheit for 16 seconds in a high-temperature, short-time pasteurization unit. Live listeria bacteria was then successfully isolated from the milk after heat treatment in 11 of 12 pasteurization trials."
Journal of Environmental Microbiology. July 1987, (53)
___________________________________
"... curing alone may not be a sufficient pathogen control step to eliminate Salmonella, Listeria, and E. coli O157:H7 from cheese."
J Food Prot, 1998 Oct, 61:10
___________________________________

Continued in next post
 
L is for LACTOSE INTOLERANCE
"Overall, about 75 percent of the world's population, including 25 percent of those in the U.S., lose their lactase enzymes after weaning."
J. of the American Dietetic Assoc. 1996; 96
___________________________________
"Lactose malabsorption and lactase deficiency are chronic organic pathologic conditions characterized by abdominal pain and distention, flatulence, and the passage of loose, watery stools. Once correct diagnosis is established, introduction of a lactose-free dietary regime relieves symptoms in most patients who remain largely unaware of the relationship between food intake and symptoms."
J Clin Gastroenterol, 1999 Apr, 28:3
___________________________________

M is for MAD COW DISEASE
"The destruction of milk from suspected cows was recommended in England to insure the public's safety... Experiments also indicate that temperatures reached during pasteurization of milk and household cooking does not kill the agent. In the United Kingtom on December 1, 1988, the government announced a ban on the sale of milk from infected cattle..."
Mad Cows and Milkgate, Virgil Hulse, M.D.
___________________________________
"A 24-year-old vegetarian has been diagnosed with Cruetzfeld-Jacob disease. Scientists fear that milk and cheese may be the source of infection."
London Times, August 23, 1997 Michael Hornsby
___________________________________

N is for NASAL CONGESTION
"Allergy to cow's milk proteins has been defined as any adverse reaction mediated by immunological mechanisms to one or several of these proteins. Reactions to cow's milk have been classified according on their onset as immediate (< 45 min) or delayed-type (from 2 hours to days). In the challenge test, 10 hours after milk intake the patient
presented serous rhinorrea, sneezing and nasal blockade."
J Investig Allergol Clin Immunol, 1998 Jul, 8:4
____________________________________
"Symptoms of milk-protein allergy include cough, choking, gasping, nose colds, asthma, sneezing attacks..."
Annals of Allergy, 1951; 9
___________________________________

O is for OSTEOPOROSIS
"Osteoporosis is caused by a number of things, one of the most important being too much dietary protein."
SCIENCE 1986; 233
___________________________________
"Consumption of dairy products, particularly at age 20 years, were associated with an increased risk of hip fractures...metabolism of dietary protein causes increased urinary excretion of calcium." American Journal of Epidemiology 1994;139
___________________________________

P is for PESTICIDES AND POLLUTION
"A 1988 FDA survey of milk samples from grocery stores in 10 cities found that 73% of the samples contained pesticide residues."
Environmental Contamination and Toxicology, 1991; 47
___________________________________
"The level of dioxin in a single serving of the Ben & Jerry's World's Best Vanilla Ice cream tested was almost 200 times greater than the 'virtually safe [daily] dose' determined by the Environmental Protection Agency."
Steve Milloy, author of junkscience.com (Milloy tested samples of ice cream for dioxins. The only major newspaper to report the story was the Detroit Free Press). 11/8/99
___________________________________

Continued in next post
 
Q is for QUIXOTE SYNDROME
"I have two Lasting impressions. One is that underestimating Robert Cohen's ability to damage the dairy industry is a big mistake. The other is a profound wish that the man was on our side."

American Dairy Farmer Magazine Oct., 1998, Editorial by Teresa VanWagner
(Robert Cohen is the author of the A-Z list. More information: www.notmilk.com).
___________________________________
"The colorful NotMilk site delights in describing milk as a glass of 'pus with hormones and glue.' Its creator, Robert Cohen, who calls himself the Not Milk Man, keeps a list of diseases on the site that he believes are caused by milk."
New York Times Magazine Section, Sunday, December 24, 2000
___________________________________

R is for RHEUMATOID ARTHRITIS
"Rheumatoid arthritis is more severe than osteoarthritis, is most common in the hands and feet, and is characterized by swelling of joints. Since this type of joint pain can be a symptom of a food allergy, dietary change sometimes has a profound effect. Dairy products, the most common food allergen, are one likely candidate as a contributing causative factor." Vegetarian and Vegan Nutrition by George Eisman, M.A., M.Sc., R.D.
___________________________________
"In the case of the eight year old female subject, juvenile rheumatoid arthritis was a milk allergy. After avoiding dairy products, all pain was gone in three weeks." Journal of the Royal Society of Medicine, 1985, 78
___________________________________

S is for SUDDEN INFANT DEATH
"Hypersensitivity to milk is implicated as a cause of sudden death in infancy." The Lancet, vol. 2, 7160, November 19, 1960
___________________________________

"Those who consumed cows milk were fourteen times more likely to die from diarrhea-related complications and four times more likely to die of pneumonia than were breast-fed babies. Intolerance and allergy to cow's milk products is a factor in sudden infant death syndrome." The Lancet, vol. 344, November 5, 1994
___________________________________

T is for TUBERCULOSIS
"A Mycobacterium bovis-infected dairy herd of 369 Holstein cows with lactation duration between 200 and 360 days was tested... 170 cows had positive tuberculin test results, and 199 had negative results. Cows with positive test results produced less milk than did cows with negative test results...In this herd, tuberculosis was associated with a 4% decrease in milk production." J Am Vet Med Assoc, 1998 Sep, 213:6
___________________________________
"Many diseases such as tuberculosis are transmissible by milk products." Journal of Dairy Science 1988; 71
___________________________________

U is for UTERINE & OVARIAN CANCER
The uterus and ovary, like the breast, are hormone-sensitive organs. Not surprisingly, uterine and ovarian cancers are both linked to fatty diets in epidemiologic studies." Cancer 1966;19
___________________________________
"IGFs may be important in carcinogenesis, possibly by increasing the risk of cellular transformation by enhancing cell turnover. These emerging epidemiologic data indicate that high levels of IGF-I are associated with an increased risk of at least several types of carcinoma that are common in economically developed countries."
Horm Res, 1999, 51 Suppl 3
___________________________________

V is for VITAMIN D-EFICIENCY
"Exposure to sunlight provides most humans with their vitamin D requirement." Journal of Nutrition 1996;126(4 Suppl)
___________________________________
"Testing of 42 milk samples found only 12% within the expected range of Vitamin D content. Testing of 10 samples of infant formula revealed seven with more that twice the Vitamin D content reported on the label, one of which had more than four times the label amount. Vitamin D is toxic in overdose."
New England Journal of Medicine, 1992, 326
___________________________________

W is for WISCOWSINITIS
"I have run into patients who undergo marked alterations in behavior patterns when ingesting dairy products, and whose behavior is totally changed by withholding them." Letter, Pediatrics 1979;64(5) John J. Murray, M.D.
___________________________________
"These dairymen are organized, they're adamant, they're militant, and they - they're massing an enormous amount of money that they're going to put into political activities, very frankly."

Secretary of the Treasury, John Connally to President Richard Nixon, from the Watergate
Tapes, March 23, 1971 (after President Nixon had received a $3 million cash gift from dairy-industry representatives in the oval office).
___________________________________

X is for XANTHENE OXIDASE
"Bovine milk is presently under investigation by this laboratory since it has been shown that milk antibodies are significantly elevated in the blood of male patients with heart disease." Proceedings of the Society for Experimental Biology and Medicine, 163: 1981
___________________________________
"Bovine milk xanthene oxidase (BMXO) may be absorbed and may enter the cardiovascular system. People with clinical signs of atherosclerosis have greater quantities of BMXO antibodies. BMXO antibodies are found in greater quantities in those patients who consume the largest volumes of homogenized milk and milk products." The X-O Factor, by Kurt Oster, M.D., and Donald Ross, Ph.D.
___________________________________

Y is for YIN/YANG
"Significant atherosclerosis is rare in peoples whose diet over the life span is predominantly vegetarian and low in calories, total lipids, saturated lipids and cholesterol." Nutrition and Athersclerosis, by Louis Katz
___________________________________
"Scientific data suggest positive relationships between a vegetarian diet and reduced risk
for several chronic degenerative diseases and conditions, including obesity, coronary artery
disease, hypertension, diabetes mellitus, and some types of cancer." Journal of the American Dietetic Association, November 1997, 97(1)
___________________________________

Z is for ZITS
"Acne is an end-organ hyper-response to androgens...These data show that sebaceous
glands are stimulated by androgens to varying degrees and support the theory of an end-organ response in acne."
British Journal of Dermatology, 1998 Jul, 139:1
___________________________________
"We studied the effects of growth hormone (GH) and insulin-like growth factors (IGFs), alone and
with androgen, on sebaceous epithelial cell growth...IGF-I was the most potent stimulus of DNA synthesis. These data are consistent with the concept that increases in GH and IGF production contribute in complementary ways to the increase in sebum production during puberty."
Endocrinology, 1999 Sep, 140:9, 4089-94
___________________________________


Source: Robert Cohen, author of: MILK - The Deadly Poison. Executive Director, Dairy Education Board
 
Firstly, Thank you MikesAngel for the article. I do not know if I totally believe it, but it is good to see. I just do not understand if they think 40% of cows are infected and all of their milk is pooled with all the other cows milk then how come more families do not get affected at the same time?

Ree that is a lot of information about milk. I really need to go into it further before I comment though.
 
I agree, but if you get "real" cows milk then it is fine. As long as it is un-pasterized it should be fine because all of the bad bacteria in the milk will be killed in the stomache. But I think what would be better is if we drank goats milk instead since it does not have as much lactose in it as milk more people can drink it because the some people with lactose intolerance can actually drink goats milk just as fine. The problem with goat's milk though is that it is hard to get unless you either buy it in dry form and put it in water but who knows what they do to that dry crap or you need a goat farm near by.

Jeff
 
WOW! That's a lot of food for thought...

I've read a little bit about the possible link between pasteurized cow's milk being linked to CD before, but never gave it much thought.

The information posted here presents some very interesting "facts" to consider...

I used to consume a LOT of milk when I was growing up! I remember my Dad yelling at me for it and saying, "that stuff costs more per gallon than gasoline!" "Do you want to start buying it?!" LOL

I don't drink nearly as much milk as I once did...not even half of that, but still... I'm considering going back to my Vanilla Silk! I don't like the taste of Silk to drink straight, but it's find on cereal and in baking: better to be safe than sorry I always say...

I've also heard that there may be a possible link between Crohns and certain immunizations. I'll have to try to find some articles to post about that.

So, maybe it's not that CD is actually "hereditary" (i.e. genetically), but maybe it's the similar diet and lifestyle choices that are shared (that's a possibility).

Don't you all think it could be a combination of factors? Not only that, but even if they did find out what causes CD, what about finding out how to reverse it in a person who has already acquired it?! Finding a cause or causes may be helpful in prevention, but a "cure" would be nice too!

Thanks for the info.
 
I just do not understand if they think 40% of cows are infected and all of their milk is pooled with all the other cows milk then how come more families do not get affected at the same time?
Click to expand...

Because some people are more suceptable than others? I don't know. CD is an autoimmune disease and that probably has something to do with it too. Why isn't everybody allergic to poison ivy? I think more research needs to be done of course. But until a difinitive answer is found, I'm stickin to Silk. It tastes better to me than moo juice anyway, and I need the extra protein, and soy is better for the heart. For me it's a no-brainer, as much as I hate that term.

I could preach for days on this subject. But I won't. LOL.
 
Um yeah.... I dont know. this article makes me really really not want to ever look at a hamburger or a glass of milk again. and I usually drink a gallon of milk every two days all by my self. like Tammi Lynn said better safe then sorry. Ree Ree- im going out tomorrow to buy some Silk Soy Milk lol
 
this article makes me really really not want to ever look at a hamburger or a glass of milk again.
Click to expand...

Whoa now, I can't give up my hamburgers..lol. Good thing they make soy burgers huh? And turkey burgers ain't half bad either...lol.

MikesAngel, Silk comes in 3 flavors...regular, Vanilla, and Chocolate. MMM! All 3 are really good! The Vanilla is yummy on cereal, but so is the chocolate.
 
This is something I REALLY believe. I was a pt. of Dr. Shafran in Orlando who was researching this. He had me in his study and I went into remission for 3 years. He told me to drink ULTRA pasturized milk. I was a BIG cereal eater - cereal for breakfast, cereal for lunch, dinner, midnight snack...that's a lot of milk. And when I was a kid I would wash down my veggies with milk (hate those peas & string beans!) so I would drink 3 to 4 glasses with dinner. I am in the midst of a big flare now but live in Chicago where there is no Dr Shafran...I'm on a pretty strict diet...no sugar (REALLY< NO SUGAR) no carbs, I make my own yogurt...I'd love to say it's working, but alas....
Also I now drink goat milk. It's a lot easir on the digestive system. I started on a diet called The Makers Diet...it starts with a lot of religious mubo jumbo, if you're not into that thing and you can get passed it it's worth a try.
 
I have read much research linking Crohn's disease to the dairy industry. I certainly don't touch milk, i prefer soy or almond milk.

I have also read much research that a vegan diet eschewing any animal proteins is very helpful in bringing about a chron's remission. its what im doijng atleast.
 
I've met people with Crohn's who have dairy allergies. They don't have any dairy at all. They still have Crohn's. The milk link keeps appearing and getting shot down by repeated studies.

I personally think that it may be one of many potential triggers, but not a cause of the disease.
 
it may not be the sole reason for crohn's but it seems to have a valid point in activating the disease. perhaps there is a genetic factor but based on lifestyle choices diet, stress, etc we activate it, put it into remission, that sorta thing.
 
I agree with Creepy Lurker...there are a lot of triggers but I doubt there is a cause in any food, dairy or not
 
I think there have been too many studies demonstrating the correlation between MAP presence and Crohns Disease to ignore it. I personally believe that the immune systems of people with CD are predisposed to react to MAP bacteria in the gut, which causes all of our symptoms. In people without CD, the MAP is present, but their bodies just ignore it. This would explain why not everybody who drinks cow milk develops Crohns symptoms.

This makes treatment difficult, because even the strongest antibiotics are unlikely to kill every bacteria cell. Even if one cell survives, it will likely reculture. Additionally, if you were to completely rid your body of MAP, it would be near impossible to ensure that you don't reintroduce it again in the future, even if you avoid cow's milk.

I don't really drink cow milk anymore (I do eat cheese, but I'm from Wisconsin, so I kind of have to). I also take a lot of probiotics, which are supposed to "crowd out" MAP bacteria. I'm hoping this, in addition to Humira, will help keep my symptoms in remission.

-Greg
 
Yes, but I went 24 years of a heavy dairy consumer, how could one explain that one day my "predisposition" just "kicked in"?

Also, to point to Creepy Lurker's reference to those who are allergic to dairy and don't consume any, yet have developed Crohns.

I'm not saying MAP is meaningless, you're right the studies are too profound to ignore totally, but saying dairy causes Crohns is too bold with what we have at hand for the moment.
 
I doubt it's in most water in the quantities that it's in milk, especially if you consume treated water (but I am just guessing)....and also, I don't eat soil, I walk on it. :)
 
BWS1982 said:
I doubt it's in most water in the quantities that it's in milk, especially if you consume treated water (but I am just guessing)....and also, I don't eat soil, I walk on it. :)
Click to expand...

Google it to find out how much is in water in comparison to milk, and I'm assuming you eat foods that are grown in soil? Do you assume that simply washing your fruits and veggies is enough to get rid of MAP? Maybe you could google that as well?

:)
 
I suspected that's what you meant by soil, but was making a joke.

Like I said, I am just guessing, I have no numbers at hand...sure I could Google it, when I have the chance.
 
EXCELLENT POST! Makes me proud to be a Canadian in one sense, that they'd air this.. Not so proud that the law allows animals sick with this disease to enter the foodchain... that testing and better pasturization are not absolutely mandatory. And who knew that back when I was making the Leprosy analogy that MAP was related to it. What an odd coincidence.
 
I debated whether to give this it's own thread, but decided to just post it here:

http://www.crohns.org/

Talks heavily about evidence about specifically saying MAP FROM bovine may cause Crohns, and that would mean less liklihood that it was from MAP off of veggies or water. I still think it's the leading theory, but that doesn't mean I think it's the only plausible one. I'd like to ask my doc for a round of the said antibiotics known to be efficacious against MAP.
 

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