Trial of medication to see if I feel better for undiagnosed?

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So I have strong reason to believe I have crohns or some kind of ibd disease. Even though the doctors have not been able to find it I was wondering if there was some kind of treatment or drug I could take for just a couple of weeks to see if I feel better or maybe go into remission all together. Then I would know for sure. Kind of like a trial test to see if it makes a difference.

I have another appointment with a specialist at one of the best hospitals in the area but its going to take over 6 months to get in.

A little history I have strong reasons to believe I have crohns because about 5 years ago I had my wisdom teeth removed and after the surgery I had completely no symptoms for the better part of a year. And I just recently found out the surgeon gave me some kind of steroids for the inflammation because my surgery was very severe. It took 3 weeks after the surgery before I could even open my mouth due to the inflammation. I believe that possibly those steroids put me in some kind of remission and I didn't realize it at the time. Sadly my symptoms have long since relapsed and have gotten worse.

Any input would be great thanks!
 
I don't think any GI will prescribe IBD medication without a diagnosis and insurance will likely not cover it without that diagnosis.

The best thing to do is continue the route of trying to figure out what's wrong and then addressing it with the appropriate medication.
 
Yea I figured that would be the route I would have to go. I was just wondering if I could get my gp to let me try something what would be best? But I suppose I should just wait thanks for the reply.
 
There are undiagnosed people on here who are being treated for IBD. Check out The Undiagnosed Club Support Forum.

Good luck xx
 
The problem is that most of the drugs that are used to treat IBD have severe side effects and taking them comes with certain risks to your health. This means most doctors will want to know the diagnosis so they can be sure there is a good chance the meds will help you. If you don't have a firm diagnosis, they might be putting you on dangerous drugs for no reason - without a diagnosis they can't weigh the benefits against the risks.

What symptoms do you have? There are ways to manage pain, diarrhoea, etc. which may help make you more comfortable until you're properly diagnosed. There are also other things you can try like adjusting your diet. If you can tell us what symptoms are giving you most trouble, there are plenty of suggestions for most of the typical Crohn's symptoms that might help you feel better, without the risks that come with steroids, and your GP should be able to advise you on these too. Of course the most important thing would be to start nagging your doctors to get you diagnosed as quickly as possible. I take it you've been having symptoms a long time? Have you seen a specialist or had any tests done in the past?

Also Crohn's is not the only disease that would respond to steroids, so if you did improve while taking them, the diagnosis would still need more testing to be sure.
 
I was put on steroids with fantastic success, got my life back!

I am undiagnosed but GI says IBD but not sure what it is due to high faecal calprotectin and ESR.

They are really not keen to put me on immunosuppressants due to the risks - particularly the cancer risks as another syndrome I have puts me at 44x risk of lymphoma.

So at the moment my GP is tiding me over with short courses of pred when I get really sick.
 
Thanks for the responses I really appreciate all the input. So I'm curious what are some of the other diseases that steroids can help?

As for the problems I'm having its kind of complicated for many years it was mainly gi related problems such as bloating, diarrhea, abdominal cramps, and fatigue. I never really had any other problems at least not that I noticed. And then I had my wisdom teeth removed and I went into some kind of remission where I didn't have any problems at all I felt great! For 9-10 months, I felt better then I ever have and I thought to myself this is how I should feel I had so much energy, motivation, everything was clear not only vision whys but mentally my brain fog disappeared it was amazing. Words don't even describe it then all a sudden my symptoms started slowly coming back to the point where they eventually got worse. Whats crazy is when I was younger and was having problems I thought it was normal until I felt better and I didn't realize how crappy I really felt.

Sadly like I said before my symptoms not only have gotten worse but I developed many new ones that just dont make sense. So I had all kinds of tests done I had colonscopy, x-rays, barium swallow, food intolerances tests, parasites tests, pretty much everything. The only thing they found was fructose malabsorption. So they said cut out all fructose and you will be fine which is not easy so I went on a very strict diet for 6 weeks eating mainly chicken, fish, rice, potatoes and thats about it and I still had explosive diarrhea every day. And also if fructose malabsorption is my problem it doesn't explain the absence of my symptoms for those 9-10 months, as far as I know fructose malabsorption doesn't randomly just go away and come back.

So as of lately my symptoms have mainly been extremely painful abdominal cramps, with watery diarrhea everyday unless I take cholestyramine which helps relieve about 70-80% of that. Extreme fatigue its next to impossible to wake up in the morning and when I do I drag all day. Also one of the most annoying problems I been having is vision problems I been having a hard time focusing my eyes and they also hurt alot and kind of feel like theres pressure on them. Almost like there inflammed. Another which has been causing me to have paniac attacks lately is I been having a real strong heavy feeling in my chest feel like theres a constant 45 lb. weight sitting on my chest and it makes my breathing feel labored and like I can't get a deep breath. Very scary!

So I was hoping I could try like prednisone for like 2 weeks and even if my symptoms are somewhat relieved or maybe what ever it is went into remission then I would have a good idea that it's some kind of inflammation causing my symptoms. And all they would have to do is pinpoint where it is. The next test I'm really going to push for is the pill cam.
 
Prednisone and steroids in general are used to treat inflammation, not really any particular disease.

A short course of Prednisone is usually a high dose for 7-10 days. Any longer than 10 days and you'll have to wean off of it.

You can have your doctor test your blood for any inflammation (CRP) and discuss with them about trying Prednisone to help reduce the inflammation if there is any.

I'm going to tag Cat-a-Tonic as she's not officially diagnosed yet has been somewhat treated so hopefully she'll be able to talk more about medication options for people who are undiagnosed. :)
 
The tests you had should have picked up Crohn's if that's what you have. Steroids can help pretty much any autoimmune disease, but of course it's possible that your symptoms cleared up spontaneously and the timing after the steroids was coincidence.

Have you tried Imodium (loperamide) for diarrhoea? It's often effective, very safe, and you don't need a doctor you can just buy it. You can also ask your doctor to try you on Lomotil (co-phenotrope) which is also a good anti-diarrhoea drug with few side effects.

Definitely mention the visions problems and breathing problems to your doctor if you haven't already. It's possible you have more than one condition and that your gastro. issues may be unrelated.
 
That is how I got diagnosed. They didn't see anything definite in my tests but I have heavy family history so they tried me on some meds and they helped. I still didn't get officially diagnosed though until I said I don't want to keep taking these meds when I don't even have a diagnosis and they said since I had symptoms, heavily family history and meds helped me they were going to diagnose me with Crohns. I only took Pentasa and at the point I started taking it, it was about 6 months after my actual flare so I wasn't in such rough shape. It doesn't completely remove my symptoms but it does actually help (I know a lot of people it does nothing for). I think my doctor wanted to try this med before diagnosis because it is such a weak drug, not sure if she would have put me on anything else before an official diagnosis. She also tried a bunch of antibiotics before the Pentasa to rule out some type of infection but those did nothing for me.
 
Thanks for the tag, Jennifer. :) Hi Admaster99, as Jennifer said, I'm undiagnosed too and I've also been on short trials of steroids. I first started having symptoms in 2009 - and in mid 2010, I asked for a trial of prednisone (corticosteroid). I was put on 10 mg for 5 days - that's a low dose and a short run, obviously. At the time, I was told that pred wouldn't work on IBS but it would work on IBD (Crohn's/colitis). Well, it worked fabulously, my symptoms went away with in the first day and I felt like a million bucks! And I felt horrible after the 5 days was up, all my symptoms returned with a vengeance and I felt worse than ever. Because pred worked so great, my doctors said it can't be IBS and started focusing on inflammatory illnesses (pred is a systemic drug that works on inflammation wherever it may be in the body).

After that trial, my GI suspected I might have Addison's disease. Addison's can mimic IBD-like symptoms, and it responds best to a low dose of prednisone (the ideal dose for Addison's is 7.5 mg - the body naturally makes about 7.5 mg of cortisol per day, and with Addison's the body's adrenal function is impared and it cannot make the necessary 7.5 mg per day). I underwent blood tests, and Addison's was ruled out. My GI also felt we should rule out Lupus (that also responds to pred and can also cause IBD-like symptoms), so we ruled that out with bloodwork as well. Because the other likely suspects were ruled out, my doctors now treat me as though I have IBD, although I'm not officially diagnosed and we still don't know what type of IBD or where it's located in my digestive tract, etc.

Because I'm not fully diagnosed, my GI won't put me on any of the stronger treatments. My options so far have been Entocort (a steroid similar to pred, but not systemic and less harsh with fewer side effects), and the 5ASA drugs (Asacol, Pentasa, Apriso, Delzicol, etc). These are all pretty mild, but fortunately my IBD seems mild too so far, so these meds have worked pretty well overall for me. I would imagine that since you're undiagnosed as well, your doctors will likely only put you on the milder medications. In my case, I was on Entocort (steroid) to get me into remission, and then for the past few years I've been on 5ASAs to keep me in remission. I've been in a very mild flare for the past 6 months or so, but I'm doing better lately (I just had a steroid shot in my hip for my arthritis, and I can tell the steroids are helping my guts too!). If it were me, I'd ask for something like Entocort and/or 5ASA drugs. Do some reading up on these drugs so that you can be really informed and can tell your doc exactly why you want to try these meds.

Jennifer mentioned CRP - that can be a good measure of inflammation in the body for most people. But, about 10% of IBD'ers will not experience a raised CRP, even when in a horrible flare. I seem to be part of that 10%. So if your CRP is in the normal range even when you're feeling horrible, then you're probably in that 10% as well.

And I have to disagree with what UnXmas said. Tests don't always pick up on IBD. It can hide notoriously well sometimes. I have an aunt who just got diagnosed with Crohn's recently, but she's had symptoms for about 30 years. And I've read that on average, it takes about 10 years for things like Crohn's to get diagnosed from onset of symptoms. In my case I've been ill for just shy of 4 years now and still no proper diagnosis for me - I had another colonoscopy last month but it still looked totally normal both visually and on biopsy. Sometimes it just takes awhile. In my aunt's case, it wasn't until scar tissue developed that her doctors were able to see evidence of Crohn's. Doctors can be wrong, they can miss biopsying the right spot, IBD can hide out in the small intestine where it's difficult to see/get to, etc. Don't let some normal test results put you off - you know your body, you know things are not right, so keep fighting for answers! It may take awhile but we'll all get there eventually. :) Hang in there, good luck, and I hope that helped!
 
Just to clarify: I didn't mean it to sound like I was dismissing admaster99's symptoms - something is clearly wrong, but if it were Crohn's, usually scopes would have picked it up.

Btw Cat-a-Tonic - do your doctors think you have Crohn's specifically, or another form of IBD? I'm just asking because from what I've observed on this forum and in my own experience, most cases of Crohn's wouldn't respond to 10mg pred, and are usually started on around 40 - 60mg (unless doctors tend to overkill?). You might have seen me mention on other threads that I have another extremely rare illness, and the specialist I saw also thought I was a totally unique presentation of symptoms. So the idea of unique, unprecedented illness that can't be diagnosed or treated in any of the established ways interests me a lot. Do you think it's possible that you might have your own unique form of IBD, that evades detection by scopes, responds to a lower dose of pred, etc.?

But either way, I agree that doctors can be wrong, tests aren't necessarily 100% accurate, and negative/normal tests definitely do not mean that the patient is suffering any less with symptoms. But at the same time, scopes with biopsies are the best tests currently available for detecting IBD, so negative scopes make Crohn's an unlikely diagnosis. So I guess my advice to admaster is: keep pushing your doctors to find what's wrong with you and get you effective treatment, but keep your mind open to other possibilities besides Crohn's. Especially as you have symptoms affecting more than just your digestive system, if you have a chance to see specialists other than gastroenterologists it might be worthwhile pursuing that in addition to trying to confirm/rule out Crohn's.
 
Just to clarify: I didn't mean it to sound like I was dismissing admaster99's symptoms - something is clearly wrong, but if it were Crohn's, usually scopes would have picked it up.

Btw Cat-a-Tonic - do your doctors think you have Crohn's specifically, or another form of IBD? I'm just asking because from what I've observed on this forum and in my own experience, most cases of Crohn's wouldn't respond to 10mg pred, and are usually started on around 40 - 60mg (unless doctors tend to overkill?). You might have seen me mention on other threads that I have another extremely rare illness, and the specialist I saw also thought I was a totally unique presentation of symptoms. So the idea of unique, unprecedented illness that can't be diagnosed or treated in any of the established ways interests me a lot. Do you think it's possible that you might have your own unique form of IBD, that evades detection by scopes, responds to a lower dose of pred, etc.?

But either way, I agree that doctors can be wrong, tests aren't necessarily 100% accurate, and negative/normal tests definitely do not mean that the patient is suffering any less with symptoms. But at the same time, scopes with biopsies are the best tests currently available for detecting IBD, so negative scopes make Crohn's an unlikely diagnosis. So I guess my advice to admaster is: keep pushing your doctors to find what's wrong with you and get you effective treatment, but keep your mind open to other possibilities besides Crohn's. Especially as you have symptoms affecting more than just your digestive system, if you have a chance to see specialists other than gastroenterologists it might be worthwhile pursuing that in addition to trying to confirm/rule out Crohn's.

What about the entirety of your small bowel? 24ft of bowel that can't be biopsied or studied in a really meaningful way yet. Even the head radiologist at my hospital told me MRE's are pretty terrible for diagnosing crohn's. Crohn's also has a skip pattern so biopsies might miss the area.

My tests have been negative until now after what, 15 years of symptoms gradually worsening... I don't believe doctors know or understand enough about IBD to say if your scopes are negative, you don't have IBD. What will be understood about IBD in 100 years that makes our knowledge today seem primitive?
 
Unxmas - my GI is strongly leaning towards microscopic colitis. It can't be seen on scope, it would respond to pred, and it has a "skip pattern" so they'd have to luck into biopsying the right spot or they wouldn't find it. So yes, they think IBD and the likely suspect is microscopic colitis. I suppose it could be something rare, but it acts like IBD and it responds to IBD medications. I think there's a saying that goes something like: when you hear hoofbeats, think horses, not zebras. I don't think I'm a rare zebra, I think I'm a more common horse. :)

Yes, 10 mg is a low dose. I don't think my IBD has gone into the moderate/severe stage yet, I believe it to still be mild. Mild enough for me to get into remission on Entocort alone, mild enough to positively respond to 10 mg of prednisone. Mild enough to stay in remission for 2 years on just Asacol. Mild enough to not show up easily on tests and mild enough that I don't yet have anything like scar tissue. Just my assumption of course, I'm obviously not a doctor or anything like that.

Admaster, sorry to take the focus away from you. You mentioned eye pain/pressure as if they're inflamed. Have you seen an opthalmologist about this? Crohn's can in some cases cause iritis/uveitis, which would indeed be inflammation of parts of the eye. I think UnXmas's idea about seeing other specialists is a good one - I've heard a lot of people say they had good results with seeing a rheumatologist. You mentioned the pill cam too and I agree that is a good test to have - you can have a patency capsule (a dummy pill that will dissolve if it gets stuck) beforehand, to make sure the pill cam itself won't get stuck. If you're in the US, check with your insurance company first before having the patency capsule (my insurance said they won't cover it - apparently most insurance plans won't for some odd reason). Good luck, please keep us posted if you are able to have the pill cam!
 
What about the entirety of your small bowel? 24ft of bowel that can't be biopsied or studied in a really meaningful way yet. Even the head radiologist at my hospital told me MRE's are pretty terrible for diagnosing crohn's. Crohn's also has a skip pattern so biopsies might miss the area.

My tests have been negative until now after what, 15 years of symptoms gradually worsening... I don't believe doctors know or understand enough about IBD to say if your scopes are negative, you don't have IBD. What will be understood about IBD in 100 years that makes our knowledge today seem primitive?

Perhaps I've heard too many doctors who seem to all believe their infallible. :p When I was being tested I was definitely led to believe that upper and lower scopes covered everything. The only circumstances I thought they'd miss is if Crohn's was in remission and hadn't left scar tissue. I've also noticed that doctors are more likely than anyone to insist that negative tests equal no disease (or, more accurately, negative tests means your disease is psychological). They don't appear to think tests will progress to be any better than what they have at present. But although I've noticed doctors have this tendency to assume they can't miss things, I didn't realise that scopes couldn't detect Crohn's if it was in the small bowel. For some reason I'd never questioned it when they told me the scopes covered everything.

Cat-a-Tonic - that's funny, my specialist used that saying and told me I was a zebra!
 
Thank you all for your responses, I really enjoyed your input "cat a tonic" it has given me hope that possibly I'm on the right track and that I will find an answer. Nothing has ever been easy for me. They say your chances of getting struck by lightning is like 1 in a million, I would literary be that one person lol. So my chances of having some freak disease is probably pretty good.

There is some other details I wanted to add. For one family history my dad has had similar digestion problems to mine when he was younger, up til he was about 30 and then they randomly disappeared and he hasn't had a problem since. And his father before him had problems all his life up until his death which I believe was caused by some kind of digestive cancer. So there is a family history there but whether ibd of some kind is to blame I don't know. And my father's dad died back in the 70's. So the testing was not available to ever find out what was wrong with him.

Also for some reason I got really sick after I had an endoscopy procedure. Mainly before I had this procedure I was having severe stomach cramps along with explosive diarrhea pretty much everyday. Which I could handle but after that procedure I woke up and never felt the same I honestly thought I had the stomach flu, and as time passed the symptoms stayed the same and never went away it felt like the flu but with no vomiting. I had night sweats, aching muscles, tingling sensations in my extremities, what felt like a fever, severe nausea I lost like 30 lbs because I couldnt eat, dizziness, feeling of faint. It was a nightmare and I asked doctors and none of them had any idea what was going on so they just said it was stress and that I needed anti-anxiety meds. Luckily after about 6 months the symptoms eased up a bit but a great handful of them are still there like the vision and breathing problems. All I know is it seems like they either irritated something while they where in there. Or it was a coincidence and what ever my problem is just happened to get worse around the same time.

So as of right now I am thinking if I have ibd it would be a mild form of crohns in the upper to mid small intestine. Because the symptoms match, I never have had blood in the stool, at least not that I have noticed or a blockage. So I'm really busy with work right now but I'm going to try and get in this week and set up an appointment to go to University of Iowa because that is where my last procedure the endoscopy was done some odd years ago. And drill them on questions and ask for the pill cam because they said that would be the next logical step. I'm also going to try and get my general gp to try me on a low dosage of entocort or whatever she recommends for ibd for a couple weeks to see if I notice a difference because any possibility of feeling better and getting some answers whether it be through trial and error I will take.
Again thank you all for your input I feel a lot more confident and motivated in my next steps sorry for the long post.
 
Just a quick update for anybody following or looking at this post. My doctor was more then willing to let me try a short trial of prednisone for 6 days at 20 mg. She said with this short of a time span I should have next to no side effects and its perfectly safe so I hope it works because if it does it would explain a lot. Wish me luck thanks.
 
I hope the prednisone helps you. Before I was diagnosed I had been to emergency many times. One doctor finally gave me 50mg of prednisone and a script for more. I never asked what prednisone was, or why he gave it to me. It was a miracle drug. Probably one of the happiest days of my life. Finally a drug that stopped all my symptoms. And it happened in 24 hours.
Fast forward many years, and I now have to take it for about a month for it to be effective when I have a flare up. But I have no problem with that. The benefits to me out weigh the risks of this drug and all the side effects.
I'm hoping you have he same results with prednisone.
Keep us posted.
 
Just a quick update for anybody following or looking at this post. My doctor was more then willing to let me try a short trial of prednisone for 6 days at 20 mg. She said with this short of a time span I should have next to no side effects and its perfectly safe so I hope it works because if it does it would explain a lot. Wish me luck thanks.

Good luck with the prednisone! I hope it helps you and maybe it will give you further clues about your diagnosis too. I'm not sure that 20mg is low enough that you won't get side effects though. Side effects on prednisone vary hugely from one person to another. They tend to build up over time, so with six days you shouldn't get too many, but it is possible you'll get some even on this low dose.
 

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